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Posted: 11/20/2015 9:25:01 PM EDT
I'm just a hack who likes to goof around with guitars--no talent, but I enjoy making noise.  I don't really know what I'm looking at so I'm asking the resident talent for opinions.....


What is the difference between a Gibson Les Paul Studio vs. an Epiphone Les Paul Pro?  ($999 vs$599 at Guitar Center)  The closest Guitar Center is about an hour away, and I haven't had the opportunity to compare them side by side.

I know that the Gibson will have better resale value, but since I don't sell my guitars, resale value doesn't matter--I'm only looking at ease of playing and quality of sound.
Link Posted: 11/20/2015 9:35:39 PM EDT
[#1]
Made in America vs China is the biggest cause of the price difference. Gibson's pickups also sound better.

ETA: Someone correct me if I'm wrong but I believe the studios also don't have a maple top
Link Posted: 11/21/2015 12:10:26 AM EDT
[#2]



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Quoted:




Made in America vs China is the biggest cause of the price difference. Gibson's pickups also sound better.
ETA: Someone correct me if I'm wrong but I believe the studios also don't have a maple top
View Quote
Studio has a maple top. If you get a good Gibson there will be a playing satisfaction that the Epi will not match without a lot of massaging. I own American fenders and MIM fenders and no mater what anyone says there is a difference that makes the Americans worth at least to me the extra cost. It isn't that the MIMs are not good guitars they just are not great guitars..BTW a $999 studio is not a mid range Gibson. You need to pad that at least another 1 plus K to even start stepping into mid range.
Link Posted: 11/21/2015 1:30:35 AM EDT
[#3]
Gibson.
Link Posted: 11/21/2015 1:49:21 AM EDT
[#4]
I haven't liked any of the Studios I've played, there's always some little thing about them I don't like. But I also hate the Epi headstock enough that it'll stop my from buying one. If you're ok with buying a used one, I would think you would be able to find a LP Standard for not much more than a new Studio.

Quoted: You need to pad that at least another 1 plus K to even start stepping into mid range.
View Quote


The way their prices keep going up every year, I'd figure midrange would be up to around $4-5k now.
Link Posted: 11/21/2015 10:14:09 PM EDT
[#5]
I have both...A Gibson 2014 Studio Pro and an Epiphone Custom Classic.


The Gibson...I hated the stock pickups, Burstbucker Pro (bridge) and a 57 classic in the neck (the 57 wasn't as bad as the BBpro).


A set of Dimarzio's (Super Distortion 3-bridge and PAF Pro-neck) fixed the tone right up.


The Gibson needed the PCB gutted for the pickup swap (since I didn't feel like splicing connectors) and very minor tweaks to the intonation, bridge heights, and neck adjustment. The stock strings had to go as well.





Now, I love the Studio.





The Epi...well it cam with D'Addario's (my string brand), Gibson 490R & 498T pickups (Which sound fantastic in this guitar), and required less tweaking than the Gibson did as far as adjustments and set up. Electronics/pots are Alpha, while not my preferred brand they aren't some random no-name chinese crap.


The Tuners on the EPI, need to be changed...they suck.





The Studio has an actual Maple cap/top bonded to the body, whereas the Epi just has a maple veneer.





In my experience, the Maple tops gives the Gibsons that brightness or bite.


The Epi has just a bit of a darker tone.





Depending on the music...that determines which of the two I grab. After I set them up...they play Identical.



EDA: I also have a Gibson Halcyon...I grab the Epi or Studio before that one...maybe it's too expensive for me yet.

Link Posted: 11/22/2015 8:47:49 AM EDT
[#6]
Thanks for the info everyone.  I made the drive to Guitar Center yesterday and played a few of their LPs.......I don't know if GC has a luthier to set up the new guitars but if they do, they need a better one.  I was underwhelmed at the action and sound of everything I tried.  Strings were either waaaayyyyy high, or lots of buzz after the 7th.  The necks felt pretty good and the weight was right....but now that I've had a chance to try a few, I don't think a LP is what I'm looking for after all.


Thanks again




Link Posted: 11/22/2015 9:01:30 AM EDT
[#7]
for a Les Paul...Gibson all the way.  2016 models...the 2015 year was horrible for Gibson.  

I have seen Epi's with tops that had become unglued in sections from the body allowing you to push the wood in with just finger pressure.

for solid body Epi copies like the V's or Explorers...I can work with either brand.  

Gibson quality control is NO WHERE near what it was.  

Link Posted: 11/22/2015 10:54:00 AM EDT
[#8]
Guitar center doesn't have 'luthiers'...at best they have retarded hacks that call themselves techs.
Link Posted: 11/22/2015 11:29:31 AM EDT
[#9]
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Quoted:
Guitar center doesn't have 'luthiers'...at best they have retarded hacks that call themselves techs.
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The GC I go to actually has a guy that has been a tech for years. He's in his late 40s/early 50s and knows his shit. He did a fret job and setup on one of the MIJ Dinkys I bought recently and he did a flawless job.
Link Posted: 11/22/2015 1:55:06 PM EDT
[#10]

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Quoted:
The GC I go to actually has a guy that has been a tech for years. He's in his late 40s/early 50s and knows his shit. He did a fret job and setup on one of the MIJ Dinkys I bought recently and he did a flawless job.
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Quoted:



Quoted:

Guitar center doesn't have 'luthiers'...at best they have retarded hacks that call themselves techs.




The GC I go to actually has a guy that has been a tech for years. He's in his late 40s/early 50s and knows his shit. He did a fret job and setup on one of the MIJ Dinkys I bought recently and he did a flawless job.
The kids here...are just a bunch of stoner hack guitar players that don't want real jobs....I wouldn't trust them to restring any guitar, let alone give them a soldering iron.



 
Link Posted: 11/22/2015 2:56:25 PM EDT
[#11]
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Quoted:
The kids here...are just a bunch of stoner hack guitar players that don't want real jobs....I wouldn't trust them to restring any guitar, let alone give them a soldering iron.
 
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Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Guitar center doesn't have 'luthiers'...at best they have retarded hacks that call themselves techs.


The GC I go to actually has a guy that has been a tech for years. He's in his late 40s/early 50s and knows his shit. He did a fret job and setup on one of the MIJ Dinkys I bought recently and he did a flawless job.
The kids here...are just a bunch of stoner hack guitar players that don't want real jobs....I wouldn't trust them to restring any guitar, let alone give them a soldering iron.
 

That sucks. The manager at the Des Moines GC must be a little more strict in his hiring practices, because I have yet to deal with a complete idiot working there.
Link Posted: 11/22/2015 3:46:10 PM EDT
[#12]
I have two Traditionals that are fine specamins of Les Pauls but they will set you back another thousand over a Studio.
Link Posted: 11/23/2015 2:06:43 AM EDT
[#13]

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Quoted:


Thanks for the info everyone.  I made the drive to Guitar Center yesterday and played a few of their LPs.......I don't know if GC has a luthier to set up the new guitars but if they do, they need a better one.  I was underwhelmed at the action and sound of everything I tried.  Strings were either waaaayyyyy high, or lots of buzz after the 7th.  The necks felt pretty good and the weight was right....but now that I've had a chance to try a few, I don't think a LP is what I'm looking for after all.





Thanks again
View Quote
I have been consistently underwhelmed buy my local guitar centers. I have never gotten a guitar from anyone that was setup to my liking though. I bought my last LP sight unseen other than photos from Sweetwaters website... I know ..but..I lucked out on this one..It was set up before they shipped it....well after a restring and lowering the bridge along with an intonation adjustment it is a keeper.

 
Link Posted: 11/23/2015 4:21:20 AM EDT
[#14]
I think you can find really good Epiphones and really bad Gibsons.  I don't have a lot of buying options near me, and the closest GC is pretty far away.  I can't comment on their knowledge.  I don't like going there personally because they really aren't all that friendly, and they flat-out lied to me once about pricing.  

Luckily, I know a pretty good luthier that builds guitars so I take anything I order to him.   He can usually get them the way I want.   I have had a few Gibsons:  A flying V, Explorer Pro, Les Paul Studio, Les Paul Raw Power (bought this one used), and a SJ 150.  All of them needed some fret work.  The SJ 150 had two frets that were way off.  I would have sent it back, but I got a good deal on it through a sale.  

The only Epiphone I've had was a Masterbilt.   It was much better out of the box than the SJ 150 was.  Not trying to single out Gibson.. Just using that example since you were interested in them.  They only guitar I've ever bought that I didn't think I needed to change anything on was a Taylor.  I've done something to all the others.

So, obviously it would be beneficial to have the guitar you want in your hands before you buy it so you can figure out what you might need to change before hand.  

The best electric I ever bought is a '94 Japanese strat that looked like it got caught in a rock slide.  

Good luck.
Link Posted: 11/24/2015 3:07:09 AM EDT
[#15]
Buy a Telecaster and be done with your Quest
Link Posted: 11/25/2015 2:42:42 AM EDT
[#16]

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Buy a Telecaster and be done with your Quest

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My vote goes for a American Deluxe Strat with the HSS configuration.

 
Link Posted: 11/25/2015 7:46:57 PM EDT
[#17]
LP Studio isn't a "mid" level Gibson. It's the bottom rung. I've got a great black Studio (she's beaten and battered and I call her "Black Betty"). And a sweet AAA top LP Standard with Fralin pickups. The Standard is the mid-level. To get to high-levels you are looking at the Reissues (R9, R0, etc). I've played a lot of Reissues and most are awesome. But then again... so is my Standard. I've been impressed, but not impressed enough (yet) to go for the Reissue. It'll happen when the right one comes along though.

As far as strats go... I've got an Anderson Drop Top Classic that is the best strat I've ever owned (probably the best guitar I've ever owned) in 31 years of playing and gigging. The OP was asking about two LPs... and no matter how awesome the Strat... it'll never be an LP. If he wants that LP tone... he's got to get the LP. No PRS, ESP, or any other LP-clone I've ever owned was exactly an LP. Close, but still different.

Btw... I've owned many Gibson and Epiphone LPs. The bottom-rung LP Studio is still a better guitar than the top-run Epiphone (though I can't comment on the Elite series). This is not brand snobbery talking here. I've done it cheap and I've done it expensive. Despite many guitar gear forum declarations that production line Gibson LPs are crap and their Epiphone is awesome (I've said similar things myself in the past)... it's just not generally true. I'd take just about ANY Gibson over ANY Epiphone. I spend my weekends in my buddy's Gibson/Epiphone dealership... I even work there some Saturdays when he's short-handed, like last Saturday. So I've played hundreds of 'em. And I've never played an Epiphone that I liked more than any Gibson I've ever played. I'm sure that my brain was telling me that the Gibson was better because it said "Gibson" on it. But my EARS and my fingers were the ultimate judge and they preferred the Gibsons. And that's with solid bodies. When it comes to acoustics... there's not even a discussion. No cheap, thin-sounding, dead Epiphone even comes close to the Gibson Montana acoustics. But then again... for the price difference they shouldn't!
Link Posted: 11/26/2015 2:05:13 AM EDT
[#18]
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Quoted:
LP Studio isn't a "mid" level Gibson. It's the bottom rung. I've got a great black Studio (she's beaten and battered and I call her "Black Betty"). And a sweet AAA top LP Standard with Fralin pickups. The Standard is the mid-level. To get to high-levels you are looking at the Reissues (R9, R0, etc). I've played a lot of Reissues and most are awesome. But then again... so is my Standard. I've been impressed, but not impressed enough (yet) to go for the Reissue. It'll happen when the right one comes along though.

As far as strats go... I've got an Anderson Drop Top Classic that is the best strat I've ever owned (probably the best guitar I've ever owned) in 31 years of playing and gigging. The OP was asking about two LPs... and no matter how awesome the Strat... it'll never be an LP. If he wants that LP tone... he's got to get the LP. No PRS, ESP, or any other LP-clone I've ever owned was exactly an LP. Close, but still different.

Btw... I've owned many Gibson and Epiphone LPs. The bottom-rung LP Studio is still a better guitar than the top-run Epiphone (though I can't comment on the Elite series). This is not brand snobbery talking here. I've done it cheap and I've done it expensive. Despite many guitar gear forum declarations that production line Gibson LPs are crap and their Epiphone is awesome (I've said similar things myself in the past)... it's just not generally true. I'd take just about ANY Gibson over ANY Epiphone. I spend my weekends in my buddy's Gibson/Epiphone dealership... I even work there some Saturdays when he's short-handed, like last Saturday. So I've played hundreds of 'em. And I've never played an Epiphone that I liked more than any Gibson I've ever played. I'm sure that my brain was telling me that the Gibson was better because it said "Gibson" on it. But my EARS and my fingers were the ultimate judge and they preferred the Gibsons. And that's with solid bodies. When it comes to acoustics... there's not even a discussion. No cheap, thin-sounding, dead Epiphone even comes close to the Gibson Montana acoustics. But then again... for the price difference they shouldn't!
View Quote


Just curious, have you ever played any of the Masterbilts?   I've found them to be really good overall, especially for the price.  That was one of the only guitar tones my luthier ever brought up when talking to him.  He didn't believe me when I told him the price point.  

I'm pretty sure Alex Lifeson has played them live before.. On Resist specifically.  They can't be all bad..  
Link Posted: 11/26/2015 2:46:22 PM EDT
[#19]
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Quoted:


Just curious, have you ever played any of the Masterbilts?   I've found them to be really good overall, especially for the price.  That was one of the only guitar tones my luthier ever brought up when talking to him.  He didn't believe me when I told him the price point.  

I'm pretty sure Alex Lifeson has played them live before.. On Resist specifically.  They can't be all bad..  
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Quoted:
Quoted:
LP Studio isn't a "mid" level Gibson. It's the bottom rung. I've got a great black Studio (she's beaten and battered and I call her "Black Betty"). And a sweet AAA top LP Standard with Fralin pickups. The Standard is the mid-level. To get to high-levels you are looking at the Reissues (R9, R0, etc). I've played a lot of Reissues and most are awesome. But then again... so is my Standard. I've been impressed, but not impressed enough (yet) to go for the Reissue. It'll happen when the right one comes along though.

As far as strats go... I've got an Anderson Drop Top Classic that is the best strat I've ever owned (probably the best guitar I've ever owned) in 31 years of playing and gigging. The OP was asking about two LPs... and no matter how awesome the Strat... it'll never be an LP. If he wants that LP tone... he's got to get the LP. No PRS, ESP, or any other LP-clone I've ever owned was exactly an LP. Close, but still different.

Btw... I've owned many Gibson and Epiphone LPs. The bottom-rung LP Studio is still a better guitar than the top-run Epiphone (though I can't comment on the Elite series). This is not brand snobbery talking here. I've done it cheap and I've done it expensive. Despite many guitar gear forum declarations that production line Gibson LPs are crap and their Epiphone is awesome (I've said similar things myself in the past)... it's just not generally true. I'd take just about ANY Gibson over ANY Epiphone. I spend my weekends in my buddy's Gibson/Epiphone dealership... I even work there some Saturdays when he's short-handed, like last Saturday. So I've played hundreds of 'em. And I've never played an Epiphone that I liked more than any Gibson I've ever played. I'm sure that my brain was telling me that the Gibson was better because it said "Gibson" on it. But my EARS and my fingers were the ultimate judge and they preferred the Gibsons. And that's with solid bodies. When it comes to acoustics... there's not even a discussion. No cheap, thin-sounding, dead Epiphone even comes close to the Gibson Montana acoustics. But then again... for the price difference they shouldn't!


Just curious, have you ever played any of the Masterbilts?   I've found them to be really good overall, especially for the price.  That was one of the only guitar tones my luthier ever brought up when talking to him.  He didn't believe me when I told him the price point.  

I'm pretty sure Alex Lifeson has played them live before.. On Resist specifically.  They can't be all bad..  


No, I haven't tried the "custom shop" Epis. I'm sure they are very nice. That's why I mentioned the Elite series of Epi LPs as a possible exception. My dealer never got any of the high-end epis to my knowledge. But he's pretty smart that way. I'm sure he figures that most people wanting to spend that kind of money are more likely to want the Gibson. And I would agree with him. He's sold tons of Epis (probably hundreds). And most we're the mid-level ones. That's what people want when they're spending $500 +/-. Once they're close to the $1K price point, they're going for Gibson's.
Link Posted: 11/26/2015 3:10:58 PM EDT
[#20]
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Quoted:


No, I haven't tried the "custom shop" Epis. I'm sure they are very nice. That's why I mentioned the Elite series of Epi LPs as a possible exception. My dealer never got any of the high-end epis to my knowledge. But he's pretty smart that way. I'm sure he figures that most people wanting to spend that kind of money are more likely to want the Gibson. And I would agree with him. He's sold tons of Epis (probably hundreds). And most we're the mid-level ones. That's what people want when they're spending $500 +/-. Once they're close to the $1K price point, they're going for Gibson's.
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Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
LP Studio isn't a "mid" level Gibson. It's the bottom rung. I've got a great black Studio (she's beaten and battered and I call her "Black Betty"). And a sweet AAA top LP Standard with Fralin pickups. The Standard is the mid-level. To get to high-levels you are looking at the Reissues (R9, R0, etc). I've played a lot of Reissues and most are awesome. But then again... so is my Standard. I've been impressed, but not impressed enough (yet) to go for the Reissue. It'll happen when the right one comes along though.

As far as strats go... I've got an Anderson Drop Top Classic that is the best strat I've ever owned (probably the best guitar I've ever owned) in 31 years of playing and gigging. The OP was asking about two LPs... and no matter how awesome the Strat... it'll never be an LP. If he wants that LP tone... he's got to get the LP. No PRS, ESP, or any other LP-clone I've ever owned was exactly an LP. Close, but still different.

Btw... I've owned many Gibson and Epiphone LPs. The bottom-rung LP Studio is still a better guitar than the top-run Epiphone (though I can't comment on the Elite series). This is not brand snobbery talking here. I've done it cheap and I've done it expensive. Despite many guitar gear forum declarations that production line Gibson LPs are crap and their Epiphone is awesome (I've said similar things myself in the past)... it's just not generally true. I'd take just about ANY Gibson over ANY Epiphone. I spend my weekends in my buddy's Gibson/Epiphone dealership... I even work there some Saturdays when he's short-handed, like last Saturday. So I've played hundreds of 'em. And I've never played an Epiphone that I liked more than any Gibson I've ever played. I'm sure that my brain was telling me that the Gibson was better because it said "Gibson" on it. But my EARS and my fingers were the ultimate judge and they preferred the Gibsons. And that's with solid bodies. When it comes to acoustics... there's not even a discussion. No cheap, thin-sounding, dead Epiphone even comes close to the Gibson Montana acoustics. But then again... for the price difference they shouldn't!


Just curious, have you ever played any of the Masterbilts?   I've found them to be really good overall, especially for the price.  That was one of the only guitar tones my luthier ever brought up when talking to him.  He didn't believe me when I told him the price point.  

I'm pretty sure Alex Lifeson has played them live before.. On Resist specifically.  They can't be all bad..  


No, I haven't tried the "custom shop" Epis. I'm sure they are very nice. That's why I mentioned the Elite series of Epi LPs as a possible exception. My dealer never got any of the high-end epis to my knowledge. But he's pretty smart that way. I'm sure he figures that most people wanting to spend that kind of money are more likely to want the Gibson. And I would agree with him. He's sold tons of Epis (probably hundreds). And most we're the mid-level ones. That's what people want when they're spending $500 +/-. Once they're close to the $1K price point, they're going for Gibson's.


The Masterbilts aren't custom shop... They are regular production guitars.  The one I had was under $600.  All solid wood and sounded great.  They are still around, but it looks like the price has gone up a bit.
Link Posted: 11/26/2015 8:07:52 PM EDT
[#21]
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My vote goes for a American Deluxe Strat with the HSS configuration.  
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Buy a Telecaster and be done with your Quest
My vote goes for a American Deluxe Strat with the HSS configuration.  

I would not mind a used  Shawbucker Strat
Heck I'm looking for one
Link Posted: 12/7/2015 6:57:26 AM EDT
[#22]
I personally prefer the 498T pickup of the Gipson LP Studio T (same pickups in a Standard SG) to the Burstbuckers found in some of the higher end models. Of course the fit and finish isn't as nice. And like always it depends on your style of play. My influence is Adam Jones of Tool. His sound is impossible to obtain (that's a topic for a whole other thread) but I have found that a 498T through a Line 6 Spider III on the "Stinkfist" setting is as close as my budget allows me to get.

For reference as to why I prefer the 498T, Adam is rumored to use a JB pickup. I found that the JB sounds too thin and the Burstbucker isn't dirty enough but the 498T gets me good lows and a great classic rock sharp crunch that is very noticeable In Tool songs. He supposedly uses the JB but gets deeper and thicker tone through his multiple amp setup. The 498T plus the Stinkfist setting on the solid state amp with the channel volume increased a bit, bass increased a bit, mid lowered a bit, and just a touch of a roll off of the tone knob on the guitar sounds good to me.

I'll never be able to afford his actual gear or what everyone thinks his actual gear is I guess. Long story short, it all depends how you want to sound.
Link Posted: 12/7/2015 9:16:32 AM EDT
[#23]
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Quoted:
I personally prefer the 498T pickup of the Gipson LP Studio T (same pickups in a Standard SG) to the Burstbuckers found in some of the higher end models. Of course the fit and finish isn't as nice. And like always it depends on your style of play. My influence is Adam Jones of Tool. His sound is impossible to obtain (that's a topic for a whole other thread) but I have found that a 498T through a Line 6 Spider III on the "Stinkfist" setting is as close as my budget allows me to get.

For reference as to why I prefer the 498T, Adam is rumored to use a JB pickup. I found that the JB sounds too thin and the Burstbucker isn't dirty enough but the 498T gets me good lows and a great classic rock sharp crunch that is very noticeable In Tool songs. He supposedly uses the JB but gets deeper and thicker tone through his multiple amp setup. The 498T plus the Stinkfist setting on the solid state amp with the channel volume increased a bit, bass increased a bit, mid lowered a bit, and just a touch of a roll off of the tone knob on the guitar sounds good to me.

I'll never be able to afford his actual gear or what everyone thinks his actual gear is I guess. Long story short, it all depends how you want to sound.
View Quote


I love the 498T my SG. They sound amazing with lots of gain, very crunchy and with good clarity. Cleans on the other hand are not all that great to be honest, but it's a pretty high output pickup so I guess that's to be expected. The 490R is also pretty muddy, never really cared for it too much.
Link Posted: 12/7/2015 3:58:35 PM EDT
[#24]
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Quoted:


I love the 498T my SG. They sound amazing with lots of gain, very crunchy and with good clarity. Cleans on the other hand are not all that great to be honest, but it's a pretty high output pickup so I guess that's to be expected. The 490R is also pretty muddy, never really cared for it too much.
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Quoted:
I personally prefer the 498T pickup of the Gipson LP Studio T (same pickups in a Standard SG) to the Burstbuckers found in some of the higher end models. Of course the fit and finish isn't as nice. And like always it depends on your style of play. My influence is Adam Jones of Tool. His sound is impossible to obtain (that's a topic for a whole other thread) but I have found that a 498T through a Line 6 Spider III on the "Stinkfist" setting is as close as my budget allows me to get.

For reference as to why I prefer the 498T, Adam is rumored to use a JB pickup. I found that the JB sounds too thin and the Burstbucker isn't dirty enough but the 498T gets me good lows and a great classic rock sharp crunch that is very noticeable In Tool songs. He supposedly uses the JB but gets deeper and thicker tone through his multiple amp setup. The 498T plus the Stinkfist setting on the solid state amp with the channel volume increased a bit, bass increased a bit, mid lowered a bit, and just a touch of a roll off of the tone knob on the guitar sounds good to me.

I'll never be able to afford his actual gear or what everyone thinks his actual gear is I guess. Long story short, it all depends how you want to sound.


I love the 498T my SG. They sound amazing with lots of gain, very crunchy and with good clarity. Cleans on the other hand are not all that great to be honest, but it's a pretty high output pickup so I guess that's to be expected. The 490R is also pretty muddy, never really cared for it too much.


Agreed, I'm not a fan of the 490R. I've been wanting to change it out but I never use it anyways and I get my cleans (which are never actually clean) with just the volume knob. If I need a good clean I use my telecaster.

Edit: I should add that I do like the middle position with the 498T volume all the way up and the 490R backed down about half way but I never switch to the neck pickup on its own. Too muddy like you pointed out.
Link Posted: 12/7/2015 4:07:10 PM EDT
[#25]
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I would not mind a used  Shawbucker Strat
Heck I'm looking for one
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Buy a Telecaster and be done with your Quest
My vote goes for a American Deluxe Strat with the HSS configuration.  

I would not mind a used  Shawbucker Strat
Heck I'm looking for one

I got one on a trade a few weeks ago... I'm really digging it. (this coming from a Gibson guy).
I traded off a 2013 Studio LP that was getting set to get gutted (I couldn't stand the push/pull coil split thing).

That Fender looks lonley on my wall of Gibsons.
Link Posted: 12/7/2015 8:58:01 PM EDT
[#26]
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Agreed, I'm not a fan of the 490R. I've been wanting to change it out but I never use it anyways and I get my cleans (which are never actually clean) with just the volume knob. If I need a good clean I use my telecaster.

Edit: I should add that I do like the middle position with the 498T volume all the way up and the 490R backed down about half way but I never switch to the neck pickup on its own. Too muddy like you pointed out.
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I personally prefer the 498T pickup of the Gipson LP Studio T (same pickups in a Standard SG) to the Burstbuckers found in some of the higher end models. Of course the fit and finish isn't as nice. And like always it depends on your style of play. My influence is Adam Jones of Tool. His sound is impossible to obtain (that's a topic for a whole other thread) but I have found that a 498T through a Line 6 Spider III on the "Stinkfist" setting is as close as my budget allows me to get.

For reference as to why I prefer the 498T, Adam is rumored to use a JB pickup. I found that the JB sounds too thin and the Burstbucker isn't dirty enough but the 498T gets me good lows and a great classic rock sharp crunch that is very noticeable In Tool songs. He supposedly uses the JB but gets deeper and thicker tone through his multiple amp setup. The 498T plus the Stinkfist setting on the solid state amp with the channel volume increased a bit, bass increased a bit, mid lowered a bit, and just a touch of a roll off of the tone knob on the guitar sounds good to me.

I'll never be able to afford his actual gear or what everyone thinks his actual gear is I guess. Long story short, it all depends how you want to sound.


I love the 498T my SG. They sound amazing with lots of gain, very crunchy and with good clarity. Cleans on the other hand are not all that great to be honest, but it's a pretty high output pickup so I guess that's to be expected. The 490R is also pretty muddy, never really cared for it too much.


Agreed, I'm not a fan of the 490R. I've been wanting to change it out but I never use it anyways and I get my cleans (which are never actually clean) with just the volume knob. If I need a good clean I use my telecaster.

Edit: I should add that I do like the middle position with the 498T volume all the way up and the 490R backed down about half way but I never switch to the neck pickup on its own. Too muddy like you pointed out.


You may be just a magnet swap away from really liking those pickups.

The 490R comes with an Alnico II magnet. They're known for strong mids, rounded off highs and a mushy bottom end. As you move up in strength, the bottom end gets tighter, mids more scooped and top end more pronounced, until you get to the Alnico V. A5s are the most scooped out sounding of guitar pickup magnets, but the lows can get boomy in the wrong pickup. Magnets between A5 and A8 are not commonly used, and aren't always available. An A8 is similar to a Ceramic 8, in that it has strong mids, a big tight bottom end, but has somewhat rounded off highs like an A2. A Ceramic 8 is all of that plus a sharp and prominent top end.

According to what I've read, the 498T sounds fairly close to a Duncan Custom, so any of the mag swaps that work with those should work with the 498. I would probably try an A8, because I have a Custom with the stock C8 and it can get shrill with the wrong amp settings, but it has a nice tight bottom end and a great grind in the mids. I've also read that an A5 works well in a 490. Nice and clear with alot less mud.

And you can buy magnets for a few bucks each at addiction-fx.com.
Link Posted: 12/16/2015 12:26:45 AM EDT
[#27]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
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Made in America vs China is the biggest cause of the price difference. Gibson's pickups also sound better.

ETA: Someone correct me if I'm wrong but I believe the studios also don't have a maple top
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Or made in South Korea if you go with a used Epiphone. I several Gibsons and one Epiphone. Not really much of a difference if OP is just looking for a guitar to screw around on.

I would recommend a used MIM Fender Strat though.  If you break the neck, knock a horn off, you can easily replace either for about $200 for new, or half that used on eBay.  You should be able to easily find a good one for $250.
Link Posted: 12/18/2015 11:53:47 AM EDT
[#28]
I struggled with this about a year ago.  I say get a Gibson even if it's a Studio.  There is pride of ownership knowing you got the real deal.
Link Posted: 12/18/2015 2:45:43 PM EDT
[#29]
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Quoted:
I struggled with this about a year ago.  I say get a Gibson even if it's a Studio.  There is pride of ownership knowing you got the real deal.
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Absolutely! I've owned several nice Epi LPs that I replaced all the hardware and pickups on. But at the end of the day... they still were not GIBSON LPs. And yet, I spent enough money that I could've had a decent LP Studio. In fact, the backup to my LP Standard is a Studio that I got for $450. She's pretty beat-up, but she's got serious mojo. I also had another nicer Studio Lite that I got for $550 (but it didn't have as much soul at the beat-up one).

Anyways... Epiphone isn't junk at all. They're great LPs for beginners and people of limited means. But you're dead-on... there's no pride of ownership there that there is with a real Gibson. Like it or not... that's just a fact of life. Personally, none of my Epi LPs seemed quite as stout and toneful as my Gibsons.
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