Warning

 

Close

Confirm Action

Are you sure you wish to do this?

Confirm Cancel
BCM
User Panel

Posted: 9/16/2014 10:01:24 PM EDT
Can someone explain the racket that FBOs operate at airports? It's my understanding that the taxes that we pay go to cover the operations of public use airports, yet municipalities and FBOs can charge you to fly in and out, monopolize fuel prices and ramp access. In my limited understanding, and hopefully someone can explain to me how I'm wrong, it seems that it is conceptually the same as a municipality that sits along a stretch of federally funded interstate highway opting to either put in their own toll booth, or granting rights to a private company to charge whatever toll they want. What gives these private organizations the right to charge whatever they want for access to publicly funded airports? They didn't pay for the buildings, the ramp or the land, and in many cases, neither did the local governments who are granting the "rights" to charge the tolls.
Link Posted: 9/16/2014 10:23:17 PM EDT
[#1]
They lease their buildings, hangars, ramp, etc. from the airport authority.  They can do whatever they want on their property.  Many larger airports have two FBOs.  Start your own if you think you can do better!
Link Posted: 9/16/2014 10:28:24 PM EDT
[#2]
Kick backs and payoffs.
Link Posted: 9/16/2014 10:58:32 PM EDT
[#3]
FBO = fuck Barak Obama. I is confused.
Link Posted: 9/17/2014 6:39:09 AM EDT
[#4]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Kick backs and payoffs.
View Quote


Sounds like the operating procedures at my airport.
Link Posted: 9/17/2014 6:45:55 AM EDT
[#5]
They generally do not charge you to use the airport, only their ramp space.  Many airports have a public ramp space.  The ramp fees cropped up after signature (may the fleas of a thousand camels infest them) took the lead years ago.  I understand some ramp fees for the jackasses who pull up wanting coffee, ice, papers, and a power cart then buy 20 gallons for their lear.
Link Posted: 9/17/2014 9:26:23 AM EDT
[#6]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:


Sounds like the operating procedures at my airport.
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:
Kick backs and payoffs.


Sounds like the operating procedures at my airport.


Must be talking about TiCo Airport Authority.

FBO's typically pay a flowage fee on the amount of avgas and Jet-A they pump to the airport authority and ramp fees are one way to recoup that fee.

I try to find FBO's without ramp fees whenever I can and will fly as much as 20 miles out of the way to avoid a Signature or MillionAire FBO (they don't want GA piston planes there anyway- they're turbine snobs).
Link Posted: 9/17/2014 9:34:33 AM EDT
[#7]
Sounds like Atlantic Aviation in KRNO. The want $750 to drop off 1 passenger, $1300 per night for a hangar or $600 to utilize the ramp that the airport authority owns. They are the one and only FBO left on the field, by design.
Link Posted: 9/17/2014 10:12:19 AM EDT
[#8]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Sounds like Atlantic Aviation in KRNO. The want $750 to drop off 1 passenger, $1300 per night for a hangar or $600 to utilize the ramp that the airport authority owns. They are the one and only FBO left on the field, by design.
View Quote


Airport monopoly was the original signature business model.
Link Posted: 9/17/2014 10:21:02 AM EDT
[#9]
Link Posted: 9/17/2014 10:57:04 AM EDT
[#10]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:


I worked at the FBO on the west side of KRNO in high school (1980s). I take it that's gone now?
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:
Sounds like Atlantic Aviation in KRNO. The want $750 to drop off 1 passenger, $1300 per night for a hangar or $600 to utilize the ramp that the airport authority owns. They are the one and only FBO left on the field, by design.


I worked at the FBO on the west side of KRNO in high school (1980s). I take it that's gone now?



Last time I was there the airline terminal and ANG are the only thing on the west side. FBO was on the east side.
Link Posted: 9/17/2014 12:17:57 PM EDT
[#11]
Link Posted: 9/17/2014 2:08:06 PM EDT
[#12]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
FBO = fuck Barak Obama. I is confused.
View Quote


Fixed Base Operator. Places like Signature and Epps and such.
Link Posted: 9/17/2014 2:21:44 PM EDT
[#13]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:


Fixed Base Operator. Places like Signature and Epps and such.
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:
FBO = fuck Barak Obama. I is confused.


Fixed Base Operator. Places like Signature and Epps and such.


Epps, I know where you are based.
Link Posted: 9/17/2014 2:42:55 PM EDT
[#14]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:


Epps, I know where you are based.
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
FBO = fuck Barak Obama. I is confused.


Fixed Base Operator. Places like Signature and Epps and such.


Epps, I know where you are based.


There are free parking spots outside of their ramp.
Link Posted: 9/17/2014 3:51:10 PM EDT
[#15]
The downwind is good eats.
Link Posted: 9/17/2014 5:48:11 PM EDT
[#16]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:


The FBO was between the ANG and terminal, back when they had RF-4Cs.
I think it was JetWest?
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Sounds like Atlantic Aviation in KRNO. The want $750 to drop off 1 passenger, $1300 per night for a hangar or $600 to utilize the ramp that the airport authority owns. They are the one and only FBO left on the field, by design.


I worked at the FBO on the west side of KRNO in high school (1980s). I take it that's gone now?



Last time I was there the airline terminal and ANG are the only thing on the west side. FBO was on the east side.


The FBO was between the ANG and terminal, back when they had RF-4Cs.
I think it was JetWest?

That's correct, it was Jet West and the airport authority expedited their demise when a prominent tenant passed away. A Gulfstream maintenance facility, Western Jet  is renting the space now. We park there to avoid Atlantic's raping.
Link Posted: 9/17/2014 7:07:56 PM EDT
[#17]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
The downwind is good eats.
View Quote


I was there a couple weeks ago. As I'm eating, a Cessna 172 is taxiing across 16 and it just spluttered to a stop in the middle of the runway. Good thing it wasn't the active.

And The 57th Fighter Group is good too.


I wouldn't say I'm based there quite yet, but I'll be picking up my tickets there within the next year.
Link Posted: 9/17/2014 7:50:25 PM EDT
[#18]
Shoot me an im when are flying there, I'm based there.
Link Posted: 9/17/2014 11:46:09 PM EDT
[#19]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Shoot me an im when are flying there, I'm based there.
View Quote


Will do. I'm renewing my medical that I got two years ago and never used (Thanks Obama ) and then gonna knock out all my tickets as fast as possible. So long as the stars align I should be starting next month.
Link Posted: 9/18/2014 3:19:41 PM EDT
[#20]
Link Posted: 9/19/2014 3:32:24 AM EDT
[#21]

Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Must be talking about TiCo Airport Authority.



FBO's typically pay a flowage fee on the amount of avgas and Jet-A they pump to the airport authority and ramp fees are one way to recoup that fee.



I try to find FBO's without ramp fees whenever I can and will fly as much as 20 miles out of the way to avoid a Signature or MillionAire FBO (they don't want GA piston planes there anyway- they're turbine snobs).

View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:



Quoted:


Quoted:

Kick backs and payoffs.




Sounds like the operating procedures at my airport.




Must be talking about TiCo Airport Authority.



FBO's typically pay a flowage fee on the amount of avgas and Jet-A they pump to the airport authority and ramp fees are one way to recoup that fee.



I try to find FBO's without ramp fees whenever I can and will fly as much as 20 miles out of the way to avoid a Signature or MillionAire FBO (they don't want GA piston planes there anyway- they're turbine snobs).

Add Landmark Aviation to that list.

 



100LL at KAVL where I hangar my Cherokee was 7.26 a gallon last Monday. Vultures, they are.
Link Posted: 9/19/2014 7:29:07 AM EDT
[#22]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Add Landmark Aviation to that list.  

100LL at KAVL where I hangar my Cherokee was 7.26 a gallon last Monday. Vultures, they are.
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Kick backs and payoffs.


Sounds like the operating procedures at my airport.


Must be talking about TiCo Airport Authority.

FBO's typically pay a flowage fee on the amount of avgas and Jet-A they pump to the airport authority and ramp fees are one way to recoup that fee.

I try to find FBO's without ramp fees whenever I can and will fly as much as 20 miles out of the way to avoid a Signature or MillionAire FBO (they don't want GA piston planes there anyway- they're turbine snobs).
Add Landmark Aviation to that list.  

100LL at KAVL where I hangar my Cherokee was 7.26 a gallon last Monday. Vultures, they are.


Link Posted: 9/19/2014 10:17:45 AM EDT
[#23]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
It wasn't Ted Contri, was it?

When I was young, he gave me a ride in one of his Mustangs - the one painted in NVANG colors.
View Quote

William (Bill) Pennington- He had a GIV and an S76

Not a bad deal getting a ride in a Mustang, must have been a nice guy.

Link Posted: 9/19/2014 10:18:45 AM EDT
[#24]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
FBO = fuck Barak Obama. I is confused.
View Quote

Link Posted: 9/19/2014 10:28:12 AM EDT
[#25]
Link Posted: 9/19/2014 12:44:18 PM EDT
[#26]
Funny how that works. I occasionally do contract work for a guy who operates a G550. Landmark at RDU pissed me off in my Mooney. After I'd paid and was on my way out, I turned and told them, "I do not appreciate how I was treated. We also operate a Gulfstream 550 and we will not be coming here." In another instance, my contract rate is typically all-inclusive, being that I cover my own expenses. We were having some service performed on the Gulfstream. Sheltair stuck it to us for our piston singles. We opted to take on 40,000lbs of Jet A elsewhere and we continue to remind them of this.
Link Posted: 9/19/2014 3:48:37 PM EDT
[#27]
A wise man once said what goes around, comes around.

In about 1988 Memphis Aero at KMEM sold to AMR. I had recently completed a total restoration of my Beech 18 that I still own today. It looked like a polished time machine from the 1940's. When I visited relatives in Memphis the wonderful folks at Memphis Aero treated me like a king and would put my airplane in the hangar without my asking, saying that it was too pretty to let sit out.

I notified AMR prior to my arrival for my Christmas trip. The Beech was loaded to the gills with presents and baby gear. It took a full size old station wagon and a full size van to carry all the gear we had for that trip when we finally unloaded it. After arriving at MEM and making my way to the edge of their ramp I called the ops frequency and told them who I was and I needed to be parked. After about 10 minutes of sitting there with the engines running a young man approached me on one of their tugs and  motioned for me to follow him. He then proceeded right past the FBO and took me to a parking space at the far end of the ramp about 300 yards from the FBO. He tossed a set of chocks on the ground, pointed at a tie down spot and drove off. Did I tell you that it was drizzling rain?

After walking to the FBO office, leaving my wife and 1 year old son in the airplane I had a pretty good "mad-on". I was as irritated as a Ubangi Warrior with a really bad case of chapped lips.
We did not have pleasant dialogue. I took 30 gallons in each side so that I could take back off and go to Olive Branch. I invited them to insert their FBO into the farthest reaches of their rectal cavity without benefit of KY Jelly. The folks at Olive Branch treated me like a king and I continued to use them for several years. They had a tow bar for my airplane and already hooked it up to put it in the hangar before I even asked.
Link Posted: 9/19/2014 4:04:25 PM EDT
[#28]
Outside of FBOs in Bravo airports, the FBOs and their people tend to be genuinely nice and helpful.  I had one woman at Landmark who told me that the courtesy car I had reserved was loaned out, and she reached into her purse and handed me the keys to her own car.  That was at an airport which was not even towered (at the time).  Some the cheapest people on earth fly GA, and they'll argue over a dime.  The smartest thing is to call ahead.  They'll tell what the fees are, and what gas costs.  If you don't like it, go somewhere else, drive or buy a ticket.
Link Posted: 9/20/2014 1:19:29 AM EDT
[#29]
I was on a cross country flight consisting of 8 Apaches, we arrived at a millionaire FBO and even though we had previously arranged to refuel there, we were promptly told that we were not able to go into the FBO itself because they had a VIP flight arriving. My commander promptly told them to stop refueling the aircraft that they had started fueling and paid our bill. Shortly afterward a citation rolled in that they literally rolled out the red carpet for. We flew 20 minutes away to a smaller FBO and gave them our 2500 gallons of business not to mention the 8,000 gallons that the CH47s that were an hour behind us took. The Millionaire FBO manager then had the balls to call our base ops and complain that they had arranged for extra fuel and trucks to be on hand, and that we didn't use them. Needless to say I will not ever use them to stop at. I now always coordinate to call to smaller businesses that actually appreciate our business.
Link Posted: 9/20/2014 6:13:31 AM EDT
[#30]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:


Must be talking about TiCo Airport Authority.

FBO's typically pay a flowage fee on the amount of avgas and Jet-A they pump to the airport authority and ramp fees are one way to recoup that fee.

I try to find FBO's without ramp fees whenever I can and will fly as much as 20 miles out of the way to avoid a Signature or MillionAire FBO (they don't want GA piston planes there anyway- they're turbine snobs).
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Kick backs and payoffs.


Sounds like the operating procedures at my airport.


Must be talking about TiCo Airport Authority.

FBO's typically pay a flowage fee on the amount of avgas and Jet-A they pump to the airport authority and ramp fees are one way to recoup that fee.

I try to find FBO's without ramp fees whenever I can and will fly as much as 20 miles out of the way to avoid a Signature or MillionAire FBO (they don't want GA piston planes there anyway- they're turbine snobs).


Actually FB, I was referring to the other Orlando aiport.
Link Posted: 9/20/2014 10:07:06 AM EDT
[#31]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
I was on a cross country flight consisting of 8 Apaches, we arrived at a millionaire FBO and even though we had previously arranged to refuel there, we were promptly told that we were not able to go into the FBO itself because they had a VIP flight arriving. My commander promptly told them to stop refueling the aircraft that they had started fueling and paid our bill. Shortly afterward a citation rolled in that they literally rolled out the red carpet for. We flew 20 minutes away to a smaller FBO and gave them our 2500 gallons of business not to mention the 8,000 gallons that the CH47s that were an hour behind us took. The Millionaire FBO manager then had the balls to call our base ops and complain that they had arranged for extra fuel and trucks to be on hand, and that we didn't use them. Needless to say I will not ever use them to stop at. I now always coordinate to call to smaller businesses that actually appreciate our business.
View Quote


Bravo
Link Posted: 9/20/2014 2:10:03 PM EDT
[#32]
It's a sad state of affairs when one of the topics pilots frequently engage in is the discussion of how rude/incompetent/unreasonable/arrogant the big chain FBOs have been -- especially since we're all prima donnas, and are surrounded by them, ourselves.

On another note of rudeness, the most disrespectful action I've ever seen demonstrated by someone towards an FBO was a passenger on a midsize business jet (Lear or Citation). I think the company was Dillard's (I saw a badge on a passenger when they were walking out to the jet and I assumed it was them). I was at an FBO at a smaller airport in Texas. The girl working the counter was as sweet as she could be. This scrawny guy (passenger) in a suit walks up to her, flicks his wet hands at her and asks her if she knows what he's trying to tell her. She was confused; there were no paper towels in the MEN's restroom and he was upset that he could not dry his hands. How he could think that the young woman at the desk could be expected to know such a thing, and then for her to treat her that way was a trying moment for me.
Link Posted: 9/20/2014 2:58:32 PM EDT
[#33]
If you haven't seen this it's worth your time and pertains to this conversation.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e7Xq2KEDAnY


and this one too

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LsbjGEgowow
Link Posted: 9/20/2014 3:58:49 PM EDT
[#34]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:


Actually FB, I was referring to the other Orlando aiport.
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Kick backs and payoffs.


Sounds like the operating procedures at my airport.


Must be talking about TiCo Airport Authority.

FBO's typically pay a flowage fee on the amount of avgas and Jet-A they pump to the airport authority and ramp fees are one way to recoup that fee.

I try to find FBO's without ramp fees whenever I can and will fly as much as 20 miles out of the way to avoid a Signature or MillionAire FBO (they don't want GA piston planes there anyway- they're turbine snobs).


Actually FB, I was referring to the other Orlando aiport.


The one just north or the one by the big lake?
Link Posted: 9/21/2014 1:55:18 AM EDT
[#35]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:


The one just north or the one by the big lake?
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Kick backs and payoffs.


Sounds like the operating procedures at my airport.


Must be talking about TiCo Airport Authority.

FBO's typically pay a flowage fee on the amount of avgas and Jet-A they pump to the airport authority and ramp fees are one way to recoup that fee.

I try to find FBO's without ramp fees whenever I can and will fly as much as 20 miles out of the way to avoid a Signature or MillionAire FBO (they don't want GA piston planes there anyway- they're turbine snobs).



Actually FB, I was referring to the other Orlando aiport.


The one just north or the one by the big lake?


The one next to the big lake.  Uncle Larry's Red neck airport.
Link Posted: 9/21/2014 5:04:39 PM EDT
[#36]
You'd love the FBO I work at OP. No ramp, landing, or tie down fees. (fuel prices ain't bad either) I can't say the same about our competitor.
Link Posted: 9/21/2014 5:05:31 PM EDT
[#37]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Add Landmark Aviation to that list.  

100LL at KAVL where I hangar my Cherokee was 7.26 a gallon last Monday. Vultures, they are.
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Kick backs and payoffs.


Sounds like the operating procedures at my airport.


Must be talking about TiCo Airport Authority.

FBO's typically pay a flowage fee on the amount of avgas and Jet-A they pump to the airport authority and ramp fees are one way to recoup that fee.

I try to find FBO's without ramp fees whenever I can and will fly as much as 20 miles out of the way to avoid a Signature or MillionAire FBO (they don't want GA piston planes there anyway- they're turbine snobs).
Add Landmark Aviation to that list.  

100LL at KAVL where I hangar my Cherokee was 7.26 a gallon last Monday. Vultures, they are.

Landfill?
Link Posted: 9/21/2014 11:28:34 PM EDT
[#38]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
They generally do not charge you to use the airport, only their ramp space.  Many airports have a public ramp space.  The ramp fees cropped up after signature (may the fleas of a thousand camels infest them) took the lead years ago.  I understand some ramp fees for the jackasses who pull up wanting coffee, ice, papers, and a power cart then buy 20 gallons for their lear.
View Quote


Almost all airports federally funded have public ramp space.

Good fucking luck finding it! The FBO rats rip down the signs and blame it on high winds or snow plows.
Link Posted: 9/23/2014 6:55:55 PM EDT
[#39]

Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:


FBO = fuck Barak Obama. I is confused.
View Quote


Fixed Base Operator.

 



Eg, the company that leases or owns all the services (fuel, repair shop, restauraunt) at a given airport...




Bigger airports sometimes have more than one, but the 'norm' is one per airport, with a total monopoly on everything from gas to parts to burgers....
Link Posted: 11/3/2014 3:08:02 PM EDT
[#40]
http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/49/40103

(a) Sovereignty and Public Right of Transit.—
(1) The United States Government has exclusive sovereignty of airspace of the United States.
(2) A citizen of the United States has a public right of transit through the navigable airspace. To further that right, the Secretary of Transportation shall consult with the Architectural and Transportation Barriers Compliance Board established under section 502 of the Rehabilitation Act of 1973 (29 U.S.C. 792) before prescribing a regulation or issuing an order or procedure that will have a significant impact on the accessibility of commercial airports or commercial air transportation for handicapped individuals.
(b) Use of Airspace.—
(1) The Administrator of the Federal Aviation Administration shall develop plans and policy for the use of the navigable airspace and assign by regulation or order the use of the airspace necessary to ensure the safety of aircraft and the efficient use of airspace. The Administrator may modify or revoke an assignment when required in the public interest.
(2) The Administrator shall prescribe air traffic regulations on the flight of aircraft (including regulations on safe altitudes) for—
(A) navigating, protecting, and identifying aircraft;
(B) protecting individuals and property on the ground;
(C) using the navigable airspace efficiently; and
(D) preventing collision between aircraft, between aircraft and land or water vehicles, and between aircraft and airborne objects.
(3) To establish security provisions that will encourage and allow maximum use of the navigable airspace by civil aircraft consistent with national security, the Administrator, in consultation with the Secretary of Defense, shall—
(A) establish areas in the airspace the Administrator decides are necessary in the interest of national defense; and
(B) by regulation or order, restrict or prohibit flight of civil aircraft that the Administrator cannot identify, locate, and control with available facilities in those areas.
(4) Notwithstanding the military exception in section 553 (a)(1) of title 5, subchapter II of chapter 5 of title 5 applies to a regulation prescribed under this subsection.
(c) Foreign Aircraft.— A foreign aircraft, not part of the armed forces of a foreign country, may be navigated in the United States as provided in section 41703 of this title.
(d) Aircraft of Armed Forces of Foreign Countries.— Aircraft of the armed forces of a foreign country may be navigated in the United States only when authorized by the Secretary of State.
(e) No Exclusive Rights at Certain Facilities.— A person does not have an exclusive right to use an air navigation facility on which Government money has been expended. However, providing services at an airport by only one fixed-based operator is not an exclusive right if—
(1) it is unreasonably costly, burdensome, or impractical for more than one fixed-based operator to provide the services; and
(2) allowing more than one fixed-based operator to provide the services requires a reduction in space leased under an agreement existing on September 3, 1982, between the operator and the airport.

View Quote


There's also some information there that I think reflects the questionable lawfulness of long running TFRs.
Link Posted: 11/5/2014 10:11:43 PM EDT
[#41]
The airport authority of the local international has been busy running off all businesses besides Signature.  It has yet to be seen if Atlantic is going to stick around, at least those guys are somewhat helpful.



Our airport folks came from Brownsville.  I know some of the guys personally, talk about a bunch of freaking crooks fully supporting cronyism.  I do have to give them some credit, the drug money flowing into Brownsville has built a really nice FBO.  
Close Join Our Mail List to Stay Up To Date! Win a FREE Membership!

Sign up for the ARFCOM weekly newsletter and be entered to win a free ARFCOM membership. One new winner* is announced every week!

You will receive an email every Friday morning featuring the latest chatter from the hottest topics, breaking news surrounding legislation, as well as exclusive deals only available to ARFCOM email subscribers.


By signing up you agree to our User Agreement. *Must have a registered ARFCOM account to win.
Top Top