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CFII
Kiowa Driver
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Posted: 7/25/2012 2:58:14 PM
Originally Posted By Gamma762:
Originally Posted By CFII:
Around here in our NOE routes we have assholes spotlighting us at night.

Point one of those nightsun lights back at them.


The last time I saw an aircraft in an NOE route get spotlighted, the pulled into a quick OGE hover and spotlighted them back.
Originally Posted By Sylvan:
there is no room for free loaders or cowards in a functioning society.
lifestar17
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Posted: 7/27/2012 5:26:55 PM
OMG really? I fly EMS in Oklahoma and have been lasered once. Approach control told me that there were reports of it in an area I was about to cross and sure enough there it was. Just a small laser, and I assume that's what most of the reports are, and it was only a momentary glint on the bubble and nothing more. Anything with enough power to do retinal damage is against the law. The lasers used on guns are not powerful enough to do permanent damage. What is the big deal?

Our NVGs are perfect. Before we got them there was always some "bright" fireman at the landing zone that thought he had to guide us in with his light shinning right on us. Blinded us of course. Now the goggles just show it as a bright light but not enough to blind us and they still let us see the surrounding terrain. Best things since rolled toilet paper.
pwr2al4
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Posted: 8/9/2012 12:08:49 PM
Originally Posted By CFII:
Around here in our NOE routes we have assholes spotlighting us at night. Not all that fun under NVGs doing 50kts maybe 10ft above the trees.

There is the occasional assholes that shoots at us too. No bullshit.


Pilla: Sir, they're shooting at us! Sir, they're shooting at us!
McKnight: Well shoot back!

or at least pull an RTT set it down and beat their ass wholesale..

"Whenever there is any doubt, there is no doubt. That's the first thing they teach you."

Joenavy85
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Posted: 8/9/2012 5:45:30 PM
Originally Posted By Gamma762:
Originally Posted By 68Snuzz:
LOL....Radio Interference investigation are fun. Its amazing how many HAM operators can interfere with our radios.

I have serious doubts that you have any interference at all from amateur (aka "ham") radio operators.

I have no doubt at all that you have interference from illegal CB operations using the typical utter garbage illegal amplifiers. Cable TV system leaks are also common.


You'd be surprised, the same way there are wackos with cars, there are wackos with HAM licenses. There have been quite a few cases of operators getting their radios and modifying them to Tx/Rx out of band and causing problems for local PD and FD. Then they get caught because the brag to someone and that person reports them. It happens a lot more than you think, illegal CB ops that cause interference don't go down as much as you would think.
"A government that does not trust it's law abiding citizens to keep and bear arms is itself unworthy of trust." - James Madison

ATF should be a convenience store, not a government agency.
Overtorque
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Posted: 8/9/2012 10:01:05 PM
Originally Posted By lifestar17:
Anything with enough power to do retinal damage is against the law.


Not sure what you mean by "against the law." Where you are, possession of lasers with the capability to do permanent eye damage is against the law, or firing these same lasers at aircraft is against the law?

H60ADriver
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Posted: 8/10/2012 9:12:23 AM
The FBI takes lasers pointed at aircraft very seriously. A CW3 in my unit pulls double duty with homeland Security flying Hawks for C&BP. One of their guys got lased and had some eye damage. They located the guy that lased them and he got 4 years and a $100k fine. I found out about this while getting lased myself while flying with that W3. We were on approach at 3k feet about 2200hrs or so, when bright green laser stared bouncing around the aircraft. We broke off approach dove in on the "target" and pulled up a hover over his house, he continued to laze us until we were a few hundered feet from his front door, at which point he ran inside. We stored the grid coordinates, and relayed his address to approach control along with the grid. He was also arrested, not sentenced yet though.
JimEb
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Posted: 8/10/2012 9:34:13 AM
Originally Posted By H60ADriver:
The FBI takes lasers pointed at aircraft very seriously. A CW3 in my unit pulls double duty with homeland Security flying Hawks for C&BP. One of their guys got lased and had some eye damage. They located the guy that lased them and he got 4 years and a $100k fine. I found out about this while getting lased myself while flying with that W3. We were on approach at 3k feet about 2200hrs or so, when bright green laser stared bouncing around the aircraft. We broke off approach dove in on the "target" and pulled up a hover over his house, he continued to laze us until we were a few hundered feet from his front door, at which point he ran inside. We stored the grid coordinates, and relayed his address to approach control along with the grid. He was also arrested, not sentenced yet though.


So who was the perp? Some drunken 40-yr-old redneck man, punk 12-yr-old boy, or a 80 yr-old lady in a wheelchair on the front porch of her nursing home?
H60ADriver
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Posted: 8/10/2012 10:46:07 AM
[Last Edit: 8/10/2012 10:50:25 AM by H60ADriver]
Hard to tell for sure under NVG's. Was a male, looked to be somewhere between I'd say 20 and 40. Thought the laser was mounted on a weapon, but, couldn't tell with enough certainty to claim it was. Was a pretty average house in a middle income part of town.
BlammO
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Posted: 8/10/2012 11:00:04 AM
[Last Edit: 8/10/2012 11:04:40 AM by BlammO]

Originally Posted By Joenavy85:
Originally Posted By Gamma762:
Originally Posted By 68Snuzz:
LOL....Radio Interference investigation are fun. Its amazing how many HAM operators can interfere with our radios.

I have serious doubts that you have any interference at all from amateur (aka "ham") radio operators.

I have no doubt at all that you have interference from illegal CB operations using the typical utter garbage illegal amplifiers. Cable TV system leaks are also common.


You'd be surprised, the same way there are wackos with cars, there are wackos with HAM licenses. There have been quite a few cases of operators getting their radios and modifying them to Tx/Rx out of band and causing problems for local PD and FD. Then they get caught because the brag to someone and that person reports them. It happens a lot more than you think, illegal CB ops that cause interference don't go down as much as you would think.

Citation please? There are technical and other reasons I believe you have the ham/CB thing backward. Of course there are a few bad apples among ham radio operators, but I am convinced the are very few and far between.

I am not buying the claim one bit.


Edit for clarification: Mods to ham radios for operation on PD/FD frequencies are one thing, but mods to ham radios for operation in aviation band are a LOT less common. Your typical VHF/UHF ham radio cannot be modded for AM operation and usually cannot Tx around the aviation frequencies even after modification. CB, on the other hand, is mostly AM and very commonly modded with high power, low quality amplifiers that splatter harmonics on many frequencies.
Never send a man to do a neutron's job. -- BlammO
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Joenavy85
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Posted: 8/13/2012 1:01:38 PM
[Last Edit: 8/13/2012 1:33:36 PM by Joenavy85]
Originally Posted By BlammO:

Originally Posted By Joenavy85:
Originally Posted By Gamma762:
Originally Posted By 68Snuzz:
LOL....Radio Interference investigation are fun. Its amazing how many HAM operators can interfere with our radios.

I have serious doubts that you have any interference at all from amateur (aka "ham") radio operators.

I have no doubt at all that you have interference from illegal CB operations using the typical utter garbage illegal amplifiers. Cable TV system leaks are also common.


You'd be surprised, the same way there are wackos with cars, there are wackos with HAM licenses. There have been quite a few cases of operators getting their radios and modifying them to Tx/Rx out of band and causing problems for local PD and FD. Then they get caught because the brag to someone and that person reports them. It happens a lot more than you think, illegal CB ops that cause interference don't go down as much as you would think.

Citation please? There are technical and other reasons I believe you have the ham/CB thing backward. Of course there are a few bad apples among ham radio operators, but I am convinced the are very few and far between.

I am not buying the claim one bit.


Edit for clarification: Mods to ham radios for operation on PD/FD frequencies are one thing, but mods to ham radios for operation in aviation band are a LOT less common. Your typical VHF/UHF ham radio cannot be modded for AM operation and usually cannot Tx around the aviation frequencies even after modification. CB, on the other hand, is mostly AM and very commonly modded with high power, low quality amplifiers that splatter harmonics on many frequencies.


I'll have to search for them, I have seen several ones with PH and FD, only seen 2 that were aviation related. And yes the CB's do splatter harmonics all over the place, I was referring to ones modded to do so, not someone who amplified and then realized what they could do and exploited it.

Robert
KC9SGU
"A government that does not trust it's law abiding citizens to keep and bear arms is itself unworthy of trust." - James Madison

ATF should be a convenience store, not a government agency.
Joenavy85
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Posted: 8/13/2012 1:43:50 PM
Guy gone bad
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FM Entertainment
More FM entertainment

Still looking for the aviation interference stories, but keep in mind, 108-137 MHz is the Air Band, standard FM radio is just below that, and most radios that are modded to the FM radio band can cover the Air Band as well. My mobile rig is completely unlocked in case of an emergency situation, so that I can use just about any frequency to call for help (which is perfectly legal). I'll continue to look for the other 2, if I can't find them I apologize, but either way, I now understand the context you were using and agree completely.
"A government that does not trust it's law abiding citizens to keep and bear arms is itself unworthy of trust." - James Madison

ATF should be a convenience store, not a government agency.
pwr2al4
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Posted: 8/13/2012 4:41:49 PM
Originally Posted By Overtorque:
Originally Posted By lifestar17:
Anything with enough power to do retinal damage is against the law.


Not sure what you mean by "against the law." Where you are, possession of lasers with the capability to do permanent eye damage is against the law, or firing these same lasers at aircraft is against the law?



lazing aircraft is a felony. lasers above 5mw I believe are restrictetd and regulated by teh FDA i believe.


"Whenever there is any doubt, there is no doubt. That's the first thing they teach you."

BlammO
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Posted: 8/13/2012 7:48:49 PM
[Last Edit: 8/13/2012 7:51:50 PM by BlammO]

Originally Posted By Joenavy85:

Guy gone bad
Another
FM Entertainment
More FM entertainment

Still looking for the aviation interference stories, but keep in mind, 108-137 MHz is the Air Band, standard FM radio is just below that, and most radios that are modded to the FM radio band can cover the Air Band as well. My mobile rig is completely unlocked in case of an emergency situation, so that I can use just about any frequency to call for help (which is perfectly legal). I'll continue to look for the other 2, if I can't find them I apologize, but either way, I now understand the context you were using and agree completely.

I was challenging 68Snuz's assertion that, "Its amazing how many HAM operators can interfere with our radios." None of your statements support that point and I'd wager that your "unlocked" mobile rig is not capable of interfering with airband which is AM modulation. They simply lack the circuitry to transmit AM even though many can receive it. There are a handful of rigs that can be modified to do so, but ham radio operators tend to be conscientious and law-abiding with very few exceptions (which are almost always related to FM interference on public safety bands and interference within the ham bands). The bad apples are extremely few and far between, very much unlike the CB crowd.

This entire sub-discussion is off topic anyway, but I didn't want to let a slander of the ham community go unchecked.

I am unable to find even one instance of a licensed ham operator causing harmful interference to aviation communication. I'm sure it's possible, but extraordinarily rare. My challenge to provide citations stands.


ETA: Only one of your four citations involved a licensed ham radio operator and all of them were totally irrelevant to this sub-discussion.
Never send a man to do a neutron's job. -- BlammO
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jfagan601
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Posted: 8/13/2012 8:02:57 PM
Originally Posted By pwr2al4:
Originally Posted By CFII:
Around here in our NOE routes we have assholes spotlighting us at night. Not all that fun under NVGs doing 50kts maybe 10ft above the trees.

There is the occasional assholes that shoots at us too. No bullshit.


Pilla: Sir, they're shooting at us! Sir, they're shooting at us!
McKnight: Well shoot back!

or at least pull an RTT set it down and beat their ass wholesale..


This
Overtorque
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Posted: 8/14/2012 11:52:34 AM
[Last Edit: 8/14/2012 8:42:52 PM by Overtorque]
Mr_Happyface
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Posted: 8/14/2012 12:01:33 PM
Originally Posted By Star_Scream:
Originally Posted By FB41:
Originally Posted By a555:
I've had people on boats shine spotlights on me when I'm at pattern altitude.


I had people shine Q-beams at me from the end of the friggin' runway!

Turned out they were pissed off an airport (that has been in service for 70 years!) was ruining their 'quality of life'. The FAA and local cops were NOT amused.


We take things like that, RC planes, radio interference and other threats to safety very seriously

Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile


Yeah, I've had an RC plane fly DAMN close to me, and guys in my unit have been lased often, they say it's amazingly bright... of course we fly attack aircraft so we make a game of it.






hrt4me
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Posted: 8/15/2012 11:39:50 PM
Originally Posted By JimEb:
More and more reports of this in the news.

Think its really some sort of organized terrorist plot or some stupid punk kids screwing around?

Wonder how much more of this before any sort of laser emitting device will be regulated by the ATF FDA?


fixed it for you
Bob58
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Posted: 8/16/2012 7:59:24 AM
Just don't do what one of our guys did back in the late 80's.

He was teaching the UH-1 NVG IP course at the time and was on one of the NOE routes along a river. He got spot lighted by the same redneck from the same single wide for a third time that week and decided that he'd had enough.

So he hovered up to the trailer and began repeatedly bouncing his skids off the roof to teach the guy a lesson.

That didn't go over too well for either party.
DRich
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Posted: 8/17/2012 5:54:50 PM
Originally Posted By Bob58:
Just don't do what one of our guys did back in the late 80's.

He was teaching the UH-1 NVG IP course at the time and was on one of the NOE routes along a river. He got spot lighted by the same redneck from the same single wide for a third time that week and decided that he'd had enough.

So he hovered up to the trailer and began repeatedly bouncing his skids off the roof to teach the guy a lesson.

That didn't go over too well for either party.


Yeah, the but the 911 call had to be priceless! "They's a hee-lee-oh-copter bouncin' on my house!"
hrt4me
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Posted: 8/17/2012 5:58:36 PM
Originally Posted By Bob58:
Just don't do what one of our guys did back in the late 80's.

He was teaching the UH-1 NVG IP course at the time and was on one of the NOE routes along a river. He got spot lighted by the same redneck from the same single wide for a third time that week and decided that he'd had enough.

So he hovered up to the trailer and began repeatedly bouncing his skids off the roof to teach the guy a lesson.

That didn't go over too well for either party.


could have gone much worse for the redneck in the trailer
ekg98
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Posted: 8/20/2012 2:44:14 PM
I am a amateur radio operator. I am also a mechanic at a internetional airport. I have personally heard interference two different times. Both times it was pilots disrupting FM our broadcast band. Coming though our jams.
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