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Posted: 4/23/2017 7:39:55 PM EDT
[#1]
Change the receptacle for your coffee pot every 3-4 years.
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Posted: 4/23/2017 7:51:25 PM EDT
[#2]
I should have taken a picture... While replacing an old outlet yesterday I found the ground wires were only loosely wrapped around each other - no real connection. That was improved before I closed up the plate.
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Posted: 4/23/2017 8:40:25 PM EDT
[#3]
Stop doing DIY electrical work all together.
The majority of DIYers do a terrible job. |
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Posted: 4/23/2017 8:45:35 PM EDT
[#4]
6" of free conductor in a box does not equal the length of your jelly bean dick.
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Posted: 4/23/2017 8:49:27 PM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Stop doing DIY electrical work all together. The majority of DIYers do a terrible job. Don't get me wrong - I've barely managed to maintain my delusions of adequacy in this realm. So far my only saving grace seems to be a willingness to ask questions & do research. Well, that and an allergy to dying in my sleep from an electrical fire. And maybe a touch of project OCD. |
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Posted: 4/23/2017 8:49:41 PM EDT
[#6]
Duct tape IS NOT an approved insulating method.
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Posted: 4/23/2017 8:52:54 PM EDT
[#7]
Guessing what is the right way after watching a YouTube video, stop now please.
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Posted: 4/23/2017 8:59:54 PM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
While brimming with truth, that rather defeats the purpose of this thread. What one thing do you see most often that amateurs really, really need to stop doing? Don't get me wrong - I've barely managed to maintain my delusions of adequacy in this realm. So far my only saving grace seems to be a willingness to ask questions & do research. Well, that and an allergy to dying in my sleep from an electrical fire. And maybe a touch of project OCD. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Stop doing DIY electrical work all together. The majority of DIYers do a terrible job. Don't get me wrong - I've barely managed to maintain my delusions of adequacy in this realm. So far my only saving grace seems to be a willingness to ask questions & do research. Well, that and an allergy to dying in my sleep from an electrical fire. And maybe a touch of project OCD. Some jackwagon used a piece of metal duct tape in my service panel to cover two slots where a double pole breaker used to be. We moved in here in June last year, and I just noticed it a few weeks ago. You would think I would have killed the main, and fixed it by now... Also in this house there are two black wires feeding every light fixture! This house is a prime example of DIY work. |
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Posted: 4/23/2017 10:48:54 PM EDT
[#9]
This is going to be a long thread if you limit it to one comment
Duplex outlets- If you're not using all of the terminals run the spare screws in. It's especially not fun when trouble shooting if they're in a steel box or mud ring. It is a good way to identify the correct breaker 
I've seen Pros not do it too. |
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Posted: 4/23/2017 10:58:22 PM EDT
[#10]
Don't like the OP's rules for this thread.
If you have to use your foot to push a GFCI in the box, the box is too small. |
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Posted: 4/24/2017 11:56:04 AM EDT
[#11]
Didn't mean one gripe per reply - going back to first post to clarify...
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Posted: 4/24/2017 12:00:52 PM EDT
[#12]
Some AHJs run 'homeowner classes' as a requirement to pull a permit.
Of course plenty of idiots just never pull permits. I have seen a few decent jobs over the years. As a PE I get a lot of 'relief' on most work. Like I can stamp off inspections and skip them. The back stabs should be removed off most devices. When they disallowed them for #12 they should have just gone all the way and eliminated them. Back wire clamps works very well. Running in unused screws should be a requirement. The NEC is NOT an instruction manual. Get a code handbook to learn what it means. |
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Posted: 4/24/2017 6:58:14 PM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Didn't mean one gripe per reply - going back to first post to clarify... 
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Posted: 4/25/2017 10:10:01 PM EDT
[#14]
Stop using stab-ins
Use pigtails on devices Stop undersizing wire Stop using romex underground Maybe just don't do electrical Oops forgot one Stop running romex in between the drywall and studs |
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Posted: 4/26/2017 8:11:30 AM EDT
[#15]
Electricians seem kind of stuck up
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Posted: 4/26/2017 8:29:12 AM EDT
[#16]
Coming off an existing circuit with smaller wire to add more devices.
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Posted: 4/26/2017 8:50:45 AM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Use pigtails on devices Stop running romex in between the drywall and studs 2) Like notching studs, or just sandwiching the wire between the stud and the drywall? Do people do that, or am I misunderstanding something? |
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Posted: 4/26/2017 9:08:02 AM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
1) Example, adding 6" of wire to an outlet and then wire nutting that onto the circuit? 2) Like notching studs, or just sandwiching the wire between the stud and the drywall? Do people do that, or am I misunderstanding something? 
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Posted: 4/26/2017 9:21:41 AM EDT
[#19]
I lasted about 1 week doing residential service as an interning apprentice. I couldn't stop calling the customers idiots or telling them they almost burned their property down. Farmers are the worst.
I've since been in the HVAC controls & security industry for the past 15 years, so I don't see any residential anymore in my career, just commercial/industrial. What i have found though, as my wife an I have been house shopping, is that home inspectors need to be lined up and slapped in the face with a piece of bicycle inner-tube any time they write anything about electrical installations in their reports. I've seen the dumbest, most asinine statements in some of the inspection reports from these so called "trained experts." If you cannot tell me the difference between grounded conductor and grounding conductor, put the pencil down, step away from the panel and go look at some more caulk. |
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Posted: 4/26/2017 9:53:05 AM EDT
[#20]
I wish real licensed electricians would use the proper pitch and length screws for outlets and switches when you have a thick wall from tile, Don't just fuck up the box with a 3" drywall screw.
Also use the little rubber spacers around the screws to actually secure the outlet so it doesn't flop around when installed |
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Posted: 4/26/2017 10:29:20 AM EDT
[#21]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I lasted about 1 week doing residential service as an interning apprentice. I couldn't stop calling the customers idiots or telling them they almost burned their property down. Farmers are the worst. I've since been in the HVAC controls & security industry for the past 15 years, so I don't see any residential anymore in my career, just commercial/industrial. What i have found though, as my wife an I have been house shopping, is that home inspectors need to be lined up and slapped in the face with a piece of bicycle inner-tube any time they write anything about electrical installations in their reports. I've seen the dumbest, most asinine statements in some of the inspection reports from these so called "trained experts." If you cannot tell me the difference between grounded conductor and grounding conductor, put the pencil down, step away from the panel and go look at some more caulk. But, you are correct...many can't tell the basic difference between a main service panel and a subpanel... |
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Posted: 4/26/2017 11:29:29 AM EDT
[#22]
I've seen some pretty bad stuff from licensed electricians too.
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Posted: 4/26/2017 2:42:24 PM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Stop using stab-ins Use pigtails on devices Stop undersizing wire Stop using romex underground Maybe just don't do electrical Oops forgot one Stop running romex in between the drywall and studs You just blew my mind, had no idea people would do something so rediculous. |
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Posted: 4/26/2017 2:54:01 PM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I wish real licensed electricians would use the proper pitch and length screws for outlets and switches when you have a thick wall from tile, Don't just fuck up the box with a 3" drywall screw. Also use the little rubber spacers around the screws to actually secure the outlet so it doesn't flop around when installed The face of the box must be no more than 1/4 inch below the surface and flush to a flammable surface. Short extenders come with screws to hold rte device and the extender. Deeper ones come with screws to mount the extender and then you use the standard device screws. The device screws may have to be trimmed shorter with some extender configuration. |
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Posted: 4/28/2017 4:17:33 PM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Woaah...wait a second. Do you mean running them literally sandwiched between the two? As in perpindicular to the studs, just behind drywall?! Are they at least notching out the studs and putting metal nail protector plates across the channels? You just blew my mind, had no idea people would do something so rediculous. But yes lol |
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Posted: 4/28/2017 9:32:36 PM EDT
[#26]
I am not a pro, but whoever did the electrical in my bathroom and the kitchen wall adjacent to it knows even less than I do.
They created 3 hidden junctions and a few other problems like the light switch being right outside the shower alcove. I also found a junction just wire nutted together under my floor. It almost gave me a heart attack until I figured out it wasn't connected to the box. |
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Posted: 4/29/2017 11:00:19 AM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I also found a junction just wire nutted together under my floor. It almost gave me a heart attack until I figured out it wasn't connected to the box. I'm a DIYer. Frankly I do a better job than some electricians I've hired to do work. I just found out that my crawlspace dehumidifier circuit that I paid to have done a few years ago wasn't protected with a GFCI. I just fixed that. He ran wires in my breaker box from my shed like shit. I just did a big wire clean up in there, had a disconnect a bunch of stuff to re-organize. Jackass who wired in my minisplit drilled a hole through the back of my box out the brick covered back of my garage. Not sure how I'm going to cover up that hole yet besides foaming it. I usually use pigtails to hook up receptacles, but when I don't, its because there is plenty of wire, and it's cleaner to use the spare terminals on the receptacles. 12ga is a PITA to use, but makes for great circuits. Years back I pulled a permit for doing my garage wiring. I sliced open a section of drywall all the way around the garage, put in 4 30A 220V circuits and 2 20A 120v, put in a generator xper panel. Inspector was like "why did you bother getting a permit?" . I just had to redo the wiring for my mini split AC, put some lights in my crawlspace, and I'm working on running some 6/3 upstairs for a subpanel. |
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Posted: 4/29/2017 2:59:00 PM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Besides the fact it was hidden which is a big no-no, I don't understand the problem of the wire "just" wire nutted together. Do you mean like w/ no box clamps, or wires twisted together or what? I'm a DIYer. Frankly I do a better job than some electricians I've hired to do work. I just found out that my crawlspace dehumidifier circuit that I paid to have done a few years ago wasn't protected with a GFCI. I just fixed that. He ran wires in my breaker box from my shed like shit. I just did a big wire clean up in there, had a disconnect a bunch of stuff to re-organize. Jackass who wired in my minisplit drilled a hole through the back of my box out the brick covered back of my garage. Not sure how I'm going to cover up that hole yet besides foaming it. I usually use pigtails to hook up receptacles, but when I don't, its because there is plenty of wire, and it's cleaner to use the spare terminals on the receptacles. 12ga is a PITA to use, but makes for great circuits. Years back I pulled a permit for doing my garage wiring. I sliced open a section of drywall all the way around the garage, put in 4 30A 220V circuits and 2 20A 120v, put in a generator xper panel. Inspector was like "why did you bother getting a permit?" . I just had to redo the wiring for my mini split AC, put some lights in my crawlspace, and I'm working on running some 6/3 upstairs for a subpanel. |
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Posted: 4/29/2017 3:12:26 PM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Besides the fact it was hidden which is a big no-no, I don't understand the problem of the wire "just" wire nutted together. Do you mean like w/ no box clamps, or wires twisted together or what? It was properly run through he floor joist and it wasn't connected to the electric box anymore, so I don't know why no one bothered to pull it out. I am more scared by people running electric between the stud and drywall... I at least had a air gap :) |
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Posted: 4/29/2017 3:49:54 PM EDT
[#30]
Double tap
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Posted: 4/29/2017 3:53:54 PM EDT
[#31]
I don't understand the problem of the wire "just" wire nutted together. Do you mean like w/ no box clamps, or wires twisted together or what? I have seen this many times over the years. In older houses, newer houses. Never once in a brand new house though (as in not ever occupied). I have seen poor workmanship in brand new jobs plenty of times. I did some work in an area with a real shortage of inspectors during a building boom. As a PE I could be paid to inspect work and then use my seal. Of course since I assume liability when using my seal it is not free and I check VERY carefully. |
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Posted: 4/29/2017 4:22:51 PM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
6" of free conductor in a box does not equal the length of your jelly bean dick. 
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Posted: 4/29/2017 8:06:21 PM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Stop doing DIY electrical work all together. The majority of DIYers do a terrible job. I do a better job than most Florida electricians/plumbers and I barely know what I am doing. The difference is that I actually care enough to do it correctly. |
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Posted: 4/29/2017 8:27:22 PM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
90% of new houses in Florida come with toilets that flush with hot water and electric wiring pulled tight in the boxes to save wire. I do a better job than most Florida electricians/plumbers and I barely know what I am doing. The difference is that I actually care enough to do it correctly. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Stop doing DIY electrical work all together. The majority of DIYers do a terrible job. I do a better job than most Florida electricians/plumbers and I barely know what I am doing. The difference is that I actually care enough to do it correctly. I have seen some downright scary electrical installations in hotels/prisons/nursing homes/etc. since I moved south. It seems that where I was trained, (Wisconsin) we do things more to code. (I don't care if you are a southern electrician, and choose to take offense to this, I'm just stating what I see. If you do your work up to code, and in a "neat, and workmanlike manner", God bless you, and keep up the good work.) |
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Posted: 4/29/2017 8:31:39 PM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
90% of new houses in Florida come with toilets that flush with hot water and electric wiring pulled tight in the boxes to save wire. I do a better job than most Florida electricians/plumbers and I barely know what I am doing. The difference is that I actually care enough to do it correctly. To this day, "Soups on!" is how I great him at family gatherings. |
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Posted: 4/30/2017 10:09:06 AM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I nominate this post for the best example of OP's original question. |
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Posted: 5/1/2017 7:47:15 AM EDT
[#37]
Getting DIY electrical advice from the internet.
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Posted: 5/1/2017 7:58:19 AM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Change the receptacle for your coffee pot every 3-4 years. Does the receptacle loosen up or burn out? |
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Posted: 5/1/2017 5:21:03 PM EDT
[#39]
Asking me for electrical advice then questioning as to why it has to be done that way (especially if its going to take more effort on your part )....as if I have to justify the reasoning before your acceptance
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Posted: 5/1/2017 5:35:12 PM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Don't like the OP's rules for this thread. If you have to use your foot to push a GFCI in the box, the box is too small. |
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Posted: 5/1/2017 8:53:12 PM EDT
[#41]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Since your going to be insulting, care to explain where I'm fucked up? @Tier0ne0perator |
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Posted: 5/2/2017 12:24:00 AM EDT
[#42]
I'm probably "that guy" right now as I try to wire a small room in my unfinished basement. So I appreciate the read on some of this stuff.
My FIL is an electrician, so I am basically just running the wires to the boxes and marking them, but leaving the final hook up to him, so he can then post in this thread 
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Posted: 5/2/2017 1:05:54 AM EDT
[#43]
I see a lot of you guys talking about what wrong looks like.....so what does right look like? I only ask because I'm planning on adding a 20A circuit in my garage to put in a single or double outlet pretty much right next to the panel. I'm not hiring an electrician to come out and put in one stupid outlet that might have 6' of romex total.
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Posted: 5/2/2017 7:37:49 AM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I've seen a lot of work done by people who seem disdainful of pros and sure they have all the answers, most not as aggressive about it as you, but some. Even if your work is top notch and fully code compliant, which would be fairly unusual given your stated level of experience, it's an attitude that causes messes to be piled upon messes and makes some systems all but unserviceable over time. I'm just not happy with paying the pro I used for a few projects on the house when I was strapped for time, and him not doing a top notch job, or not following code (IE not putting a GFCI on a crawl space circuit or properly securing the wires). Admittedly he did find one problem I couldn't with loose wires on an outlet. I had one outlet hidden and somehow he knew one would be there. I had checked every other thing on that damn ckt before I gave up. The idiot who drilled a hole though the back of my panel was an HVAC guy who probably shouldn't have been doing that work to start with. As far as I know, everything I've done is code compliant. The big job wiring up my garage I had inspected, and I just pulled a permit for the sub panel install I'm working on so that will be inspected also. If I don't know something I research it. And that doesn't just mean google. Google might give the answer, then I go to the code or manufactures specs to verify. I was a Nuke Electrician in the Navy which gave me a pretty good understanding of electricity and wiring and IRL, I'm a Nuke Eng PE. |
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Posted: 5/2/2017 7:42:56 AM EDT
[#45]
Hey, ground wire is cheaper than black, red, or white. Let's run all the circuits with green wire!
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Posted: 5/2/2017 7:48:26 AM EDT
[#46]
If we could have a sub forum for electrical questions I would and I am sure others would give non binding advise to people needing help. I try to help with questions to save people here money and not getting hurt. In the past others have helped me with questions and I have helped others. I have been in the Electrical Contracting business all my life. My Dad has had the business since the 70's.
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Posted: 5/2/2017 8:45:59 AM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I am not a pro, but whoever did the electrical in my bathroom and the kitchen wall adjacent to it knows even less than I do. They created 3 hidden junctions and a few other problems like the light switch being right outside the shower alcove. I also found a junction just wire nutted together under my floor. It almost gave me a heart attack until I figured out it wasn't connected to the box. As for the code on switches I found it was allowed. I agree - not smart - but allowed. Canadian states to move it out of arms reach. As for the hidden junctions when remodeling most homeowners won't tolerate a flush access cover - and three running across the top of the bathroom wall to redo all the wiring the original contractor messed up by running the kitchen ceiling light circuit off the bathroom breaker was the least of it. One remodel had that power going around a door jamb installed later and yes, it was sandwiched between the studs and frame, tightly. So I get it - there is some really bad work out there. I'm not licensed and should probably never work on my own stuff again, but here's mine: Just disconnect tube and socket completely - instead of scabbing onto it for more outlets or lights. Don't drop another circuit breaker under the existing to expand. Adding power to outside outlets like a pool? Conduit, people, and don't use romex in it. Just say no to staples on studs. And never, ever let a local trade college class remodel your wiring. You get blamed for all the shoddy unsupervised work. |
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Posted: 5/2/2017 11:40:03 PM EDT
[#48]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
OK, I'll give you the attitude thing. I did come across strong. I'm not anti-pro. I really respect good ones. I learned a ton watching a pro/family friend do a lot of work on my parents house growing up. There is a lot more to know about how to wire up a house than just knowing the code. There is a lot of technique and finesse that goes into it. I know and respect that. I'm just not happy with paying the pro I used for a few projects on the house when I was strapped for time, and him not doing a top notch job, or not following code (IE not putting a GFCI on a crawl space circuit or properly securing the wires). Admittedly he did find one problem I couldn't with loose wires on an outlet. I had one outlet hidden and somehow he knew one would be there. I had checked every other thing on that damn ckt before I gave up. The idiot who drilled a hole though the back of my panel was an HVAC guy who probably shouldn't have been doing that work to start with. As far as I know, everything I've done is code compliant. The big job wiring up my garage I had inspected, and I just pulled a permit for the sub panel install I'm working on so that will be inspected also. If I don't know something I research it. And that doesn't just mean google. Google might give the answer, then I go to the code or manufactures specs to verify. I was a Nuke Electrician in the Navy which gave me a pretty good understanding of electricity and wiring and IRL, I'm a Nuke Eng PE. Quote HistoryQuoted:
OK, I'll give you the attitude thing. I did come across strong. I'm not anti-pro. I really respect good ones. I learned a ton watching a pro/family friend do a lot of work on my parents house growing up. There is a lot more to know about how to wire up a house than just knowing the code. There is a lot of technique and finesse that goes into it. I know and respect that. I'm just not happy with paying the pro I used for a few projects on the house when I was strapped for time, and him not doing a top notch job, or not following code (IE not putting a GFCI on a crawl space circuit or properly securing the wires). Admittedly he did find one problem I couldn't with loose wires on an outlet. I had one outlet hidden and somehow he knew one would be there. I had checked every other thing on that damn ckt before I gave up. The idiot who drilled a hole though the back of my panel was an HVAC guy who probably shouldn't have been doing that work to start with. As far as I know, everything I've done is code compliant. The big job wiring up my garage I had inspected, and I just pulled a permit for the sub panel install I'm working on so that will be inspected also. If I don't know something I research it. And that doesn't just mean google. Google might give the answer, then I go to the code or manufactures specs to verify. I was a Nuke Electrician in the Navy which gave me a pretty good understanding of electricity and wiring and IRL, I'm a Nuke Eng PE. Quoted:
Just say no to staples on studs. |
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Posted: 5/3/2017 7:56:06 AM EDT
[#49]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
With that background and your willful attention to detail, I think you're probably guilty of over engineering, if anything, and likely putting down a safe, quality install. |
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