House came with gas logs, but no tank.  Gas logs could be used to provide some heat with the power out, and propane could also run one or more generators.  

Thinking about an underground tank instead of an above- ground tank.

General propane newbie suggestions appreciated.

For above ground tanks, propane companies generally require a minimum annual fill based on a percentage of the tank capacity or you will pay a tank rental fee.
If you can, size the tank to your estimated usage, and buy once a year - generally summer when the price is often lowest.
If that doesn't work check into buying your own tank.
Otherwise consider a pair of 40 or 100 lb tanks if you will only use the gas log occasionally.

Price those options against the installed cost of an underground tank.

What do you have for gas plumbing inside the house, and does it penetrate the wall or foundation?  That is where your low pressure regulator will go.  A line will go from the high pressure regulator on the tank to the low pressure regulator.

There was a recent thread regarding propane conversion kits for generators in the Survival Forum, take a look there.  US Carburetion I think.

If it's a typical "gas log set", the heat you get from it will be a big disappointment for the amount of fuel used.

Are they propane logs?  Are you certain?  

Do you have natural gas?  Is it available where your house is?

If the prior owner installed gas logs, then it should be obvious where the tank had been.  If that's all you want to run, then I'd probably consider a 100lb tank.

I have no natural gas at my location.

Does propane go bad?

I want the propane MAINLY for emergency use (ability to heat my home during a power outage in freezing weather, and the ability to use a generator without storing tons of gasoline.


I want to bury a tank.  any reason not to?

Propane is right up with electric on $/BTU

Depends on location but in my location, it's usually cheaper.  It does fluctuate a lot more in price though.

Propane never goes bad....but tanks and fittings can leak and release your stored propane.  

You can certainly bury a tank but it's expensive and in some areas, you will have a hard time getting a burial rated tank.....so that'll add more expense as well.  

Propane is a great fuel.  I'm building a house at the moment and I installed a dual fuel heating system (propane furnace and heat pump).  Propane is great because of its long term storage capabilities.  

If you want to bury a tank, you certainly can.  But, be prepared for sticker shock vs buying an above ground tank.

thanks for the comments and suggestions!!

I have gas logs too and they add a nice ambiance to the room and some heat in the immediate vicinity of the fireplace but dont expect it to really keep you warm if you absolutely gotta have it during the worst winter storms.  Since you have (or will get) propane for the house, do you have a gas furnace?  If not, get one.



Why?



Instead of relying on the gas logs for heat in a power outage, you buy that generator you mentioned which also runs on propane.  Even a very small generator is enough to provide power for a gas furnace and voila, your whole house is now warm with power out.



 

IMHO, that's BS. Maybe when fuel prices are high, but right now propane is dirt cheap... below are some numbers from an online fuel cost calculator that I just ran. My current electric rate and my local current propane rate. I used 100% efficiency on the gas burner because I assume it's an indoor vent-less unit. Even if it were a vented unit there would still be no comparison on cost.




ETA, OP, I would really consider against underground tanks. #1 they are more expensive, #2 They take more corrosion control precaution, #3 cannot be relocated as easily, #4 install costs are drastically higher (somebody had to dig the hole and redo the dirt after its in the hole). There is nothing wrong with an above-ground tank, as a matter of fact, I've NEVER seen or heard of an in-ground tank being used around me; I had never heard of it until arfcom.

I wouldn't burry a tank.  They can go bad and tend to have more issues underground.  My friend is in the business and strongly discouraged my from wanting to burry one.   For the little you will use see if you can buy a used tank.   If it has new valves shouldn't be any issues.   A small tank shouldn't be that expensive.

Also if you didn't know....you can't bury a regular tank.  You have to get a burial rated tank.

The burial would be for safety more than aesthetics.  There are tons of tall Carolina pines around my house.  I don't have a good place to locate a tank away from the house. I'm assuming that if something large and heavy fell onto the tank, it could be bad.  I see lots of people with a tank adjacent to their home.  It seems like a bad idea for the same reasons.   Keep the suggestions coming!!!

Wait till harvest and heating seasons.
Propane is a commodity item used to dry grain and heat houses.

It is so expensive it is never used to generate commercial power.
Think about it why.

If they natural gas logs, you'll need to re-jet them.  Natural Gas has lower energy than propane, and you need different jets.

Running Propane through a natural gas jet is bad news as you'll be sending much more propane than NG.

You're an intelligent man, lets not play dumb. It's not used to generate commercial power for numerous reasons, cost is one of the smallest contributors. First and foremost there is an energy conversion loss so trying to compare the use of propane to generate electricity vs. the cost of electricity is asinine.

The reason propane isn't used for commercial power generation is because it has to be trucked to most places, which adds significantly to the cost, significantly to delivery/supply risks, and just makes for a general PITA. For  consumption volumes the size of a power gen station it is MUCH more economical to just run the natural gas line. The line itself will be expensive, but the gas is cheaper (because of decreased storage, handling, & delivery costs).

The "shortage" of LP we saw a couple years ago was due to the inability to truck enough to the places that needed it because of the cold winter. It isn't the norm.

That being said, don't buy your LP during harvest and heating season and you won't have those issues. The OP is asking about putting some back, which implies it will be a fill it up and rarely use it scenario. Can you "put some back" with electricity and natural gas?

Sometimes you pay a slight price premium to gain other advantages. Propane has it's advantages, and for the time being (while oil prices are low) the cost is relatively cheap.

Good post.  

LP does fluctuate in price more than other fuels but much of the time, the price is fairly low.  Right now, the price is very low.  The spike a few years ago was a perfect storm of demand and lack of supply.  The price came right down once the demand dropped.  The lesson there is, have enough storage capacity to buffer spikes in price.

Hey guys-

I've read some posts suggesting not to bury a tank.  If a 100 foot tall, 18" diameter pine were to fall on an above-ground propane tank, is there the possibility of an explosion?

It's a very remote possibility.  You don't hear about it on the news every night...  Most of the gas explosions are caused by a leak and a follow up spark from another source.  The tank itself would have to be very hot to go boom.  Link

Buried or above ground is just a personal choice.  There are additional cost for a buried tank but if you don't want to look at it, bury it, it's done very often.

A friend of mine has a 500 gallon buried tank, he owns the tank...  He uses it for a standby generator, LP range and hot water when the solar or outdoor boiler dont satisfy their hot water needs.  Because he owns the tank he calls several vendors when he needs a fill and negotiates the price.

If tree falls on tank it may cause leak.  But keep in mind it also needs spark to go off.   I have had branches come down on mine and wasn't an issue.  You have dome lid on top of tank that protects sensitive areas.

This. Even if the tree falls on it and ruptures the tank, there needs to be a spark from somewhere. I don't see that as very likely from a tree falling. In a typical installation, there aren't any electronic devices near the tank to cause such a spark.

During a past tornado, I know of a number of propane tanks that had trees fall on them.  Most common issue was broken gas lines.  Not one blew up.  Even if you shot a propane tank with a large caliber rifle, it won't explode.  It'll vent itself but unless there is an ignition source nearby, it'll just vent harmlessly to the atmosphere.

Where propane is the most dangerous is if you have a leak inside your house.  Natural gas is lighter than air and will rise AWAY from typical ignition sources.  Propane is heavier than air and will fall to the ground inside the house....where typical ignitions sources usually are.  Get a flammable gas detector near every appliance that burns propane and then don't worry about it.

As stated, it still needs a spark. Propane is a flammable/combustible gas. It's not an explosive. Yes, treat it with respect, but it doesn't magically explode.

Anecdotal story: My dad has 3 1,000 gallon tanks for his grain dryer on the farm. The dryer is feed with a 3/4' liquid line. One time that line ruptured, he heard a LOUD hissing, discovered it and immediately closed the line. He lost 400 gallons of propane in a matter of minutes yet there was no fire, explosion, or injury (other than loss of 400 gallons of propane at ~$1/gallon).

If propane was useful it would be delivered the same way natural gas is to power plants using dedicated pipelines.

While electric heat is 100% efficient at point of use propane lags far behind natural gas.

Older propane barely makes 65% to 75%.

In areas with very high propane use bulk purchases are reasonably priced.
In other areas it easily rivals electric.

In areas with NG it is much preferred.

Electric might be "100%" efficient at point of use but when you consider the transmission losses, electricity isn't close to 100% efficient.  

Efficiency ratings of furnaces are the same propane vs NG.  A 70% NG furnace is the same efficiency as a 70% propane furnace.  A 95% propane furnace is the same efficiency as a 95% NG furnace.  Your comment "Older propane barely makes 65% to 75%" makes no sense.  If you are saying that an older propane furnace might only be 65-75% efficient....well you could say the same thing about older NG furnaces.  

Propane's negative price wise is that it's a commodity that is more volatile than NG.  But, since you can have a tank and store it on your property, you can get the largest tank (or several tanks) and buy when it's low (usually in August) and buffer the price spikes.  

Propane prices are certainly very region specific.  Where you live, propane might well be higher priced...I have no idea.  However, in my area, propane is usually quite low and at the present time, it's cheaper than heating with resistance electric.  

In the OP's case, NG isn't available so it's not even an option.  If he wants a gas fireplace, it's going to have to be propane.

There's nothing wrong with NG but it's not available in a lot of areas.  You're restricted to where the pipelines go to.  In some areas that have NG, it can also be expensive to hook up to.  The last house I built, NG was available and I wanted to use it to heat the house and water.  I contacted the NG company and they told me it would be about $9000 to run a line to the house and set a meter.  I can buy a lot of propane for the price difference between setting a propane tank vs spending $9000 to get a NG line.

Reading your situation and location, South Carolina, the first poster, probably has it right.

Your least expensive is to get one or two hundred pound tanks.  They each hold 23 gallons.  Retail is around $125 per tank.

Your temperatures probably above 20 degrees  most of the winter.  Electric heat pump should take care of you without much problem

I live in Ohio and in the winters we regularly go below 20 in Dec, Jan and Feb.  My house is all electric,  At those temps my emergency heat kicks in and my bills "Sky rocket" in the words of our glorious leader.

The best thing about the 100 lb tanks is that you can take them to get them filled yourself,  mine run around $75/each.  The larger tanks require a delivery truck, the price is less but delivery may not come for a couple of weeks in peak season.

Most people who have gas logs just stick with a 120 above ground tank and it holds 96 gallons but you will have delivery and setup charges.