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Posted: 7/24/2014 9:46:49 AM EDT
Bought a house. Underwriter came by yesterday and took pics. Got a call today from the insurer and was told it's a liability and I need to fill in the crack so it slopes.
Will crack repair do the job? If not, whats the best course of action short of calling a contractor? 
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Posted: 7/24/2014 9:50:52 AM EDT
[#1]
If it were mine, I would replace the section completely or the entire walk vs a patch job.
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Posted: 7/24/2014 9:53:34 AM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
If it were mine, I would replace the section completely or the entire walk vs a patch job. I would take this route as well. I wouldnt want that hump in my walkway. |
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Posted: 7/24/2014 10:13:05 AM EDT
[#3]
Cut the concrete on the tooled line at the top of the photo.
Do the same at the tooled line on the other side. Hammer out that section. Dig out any roots and compact the soil. Set 2 form boards. Dowel into the 2 cut edges. Pour new concrete. |
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Posted: 7/24/2014 11:35:02 AM EDT
[#4]
How long is the walkway? I just had my concrete walkway torn out due to it sinking over time and had it replaced with brick pavers. Looks a million times better, although it wasn't cheap.
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Posted: 7/24/2014 12:51:44 PM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Cut the concrete on the tooled line at the top of the photo. Do the same at the tooled line on the other side. Hammer out that section. Dig out any roots and compact the soil. Set 2 form boards. Dowel into the 2 cut edges. Pour new concrete. This. Don't try to patch that. FYI. When you sledgehammer the concrete, lift it up with a shovel or pick. Pounding on it flat against the dirt doesn't do shit. |
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Posted: 7/24/2014 2:48:31 PM EDT
[#6]
Quick and dirty to get your coverage. Lift the slab clean out the underside so that the slab will lie flat, Then fill the crack with a bag of sakrete.
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Posted: 7/24/2014 3:05:24 PM EDT
[#7]
Went to home depot.....felt.......like I was in a foreign country.
Called three concrete contractors, ONE called me back. He'll be over tomorrow to look see. The heave is due to a cottonwood tree just left of the sidewalk in the photo. Probably roots. I really have no idea how much cost I'm dealing with but if the contractor is reasonable I'm gonna ask to see how much to pave the entire section to the right of the sidewalk in addition to replacing the sidewalk. This will give a much larger driveway. Is there a per sq foot national standard I can use to guesstimate? |
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Posted: 7/24/2014 3:17:38 PM EDT
[#8]
No idea what you're looking at out there... say maybe 2-3 yds of concrete, with minimum load charges maybe $750? That's Chicago anyway, no idea in MT.
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Posted: 7/24/2014 6:48:56 PM EDT
[#9]
Just to get insurnace coverage? Get a $5 bag of quickcrete, a sledge and bang that piece out, and pour a bag in the hole, add water, stir and smooth it out with a straight edge.
Others have already states the correct way to do it. |
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Posted: 7/24/2014 7:29:31 PM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Cut the concrete on the tooled line at the top of the photo. Do the same at the tooled line on the other side. Hammer out that section. Dig out any roots and compact the soil. Set 2 form boards. Dowel into the 2 cut edges. Pour new concrete. This prolly <$50 in sack crete and a few hours work. |
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Posted: 7/24/2014 10:42:54 PM EDT
[#11]
After removing the broken section of concrete, remove the tree root and back fill the cavity left in its absence. Tamp the soil until it is hard and smooth.
Then, do as others have said, dowel in the rebar and pour the new concrete section. |
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Posted: 7/24/2014 10:50:31 PM EDT
[#12]
Go back to Home Depot. Ask a couple of the Mexicans out front if they do concrete. Then have them tell you what tools and materials you need to buy. Get the stuff you need from Depot, take the Primos back to your work site and have them do the work while you drink a beer.
Or bust out the section with a sledgehammer, mix a bunch of sacrete, level with a scrap of flat wood. Done. |
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Posted: 7/25/2014 2:17:31 AM EDT
[#13]
I guess my insurance agent didn't look at my sidewalk/driveway when I bought my house
. That small of a section I would do it myself. Post after pictures of your sweet flat work skillz.
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Posted: 7/25/2014 2:32:28 AM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Went to home depot.....felt.......like I was in a foreign country.
Called three concrete contractors, ONE called me back. He'll be over tomorrow to look see. The heave is due to a cottonwood tree just left of the sidewalk in the photo. Probably roots. I really have no idea how much cost I'm dealing with but if the contractor is reasonable I'm gonna ask to see how much to pave the entire section to the right of the sidewalk in addition to replacing the sidewalk. This will give a much larger driveway. Is there a per sq foot national standard I can use to guesstimate? Having just poured a new patio in my backyard, I can tell you this -Some contractors don't like to do small jobs. What you're talking about, is a small job -Yes, concrete companies have a minimum load they need to make it worth delivery and getting a truck on the road. If you only replaced that one section of sidewalk, your contractor may just do it all by hand with a wheelbarrow and bag of concrete. If you decided to pour new driveway, and a sidewalk, then you're getting into the range where it's worth it for a company to bring a truck My patio is 11x26, and the lowest bid we got from 3 separate companies was $2200 |
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Posted: 7/25/2014 9:10:53 AM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Having just poured a new patio in my backyard, I can tell you this -Some contractors don't like to do small jobs. What you're talking about, is a small job -Yes, concrete companies have a minimum load they need to make it worth delivery and getting a truck on the road. If you only replaced that one section of sidewalk, your contractor may just do it all by hand with a wheelbarrow and bag of concrete. If you decided to pour new driveway, and a sidewalk, then you're getting into the range where it's worth it for a company to bring a truck My patio is 11x26, and the lowest bid we got from 3 separate companies was $2200 Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Went to home depot.....felt.......like I was in a foreign country.
Called three concrete contractors, ONE called me back. He'll be over tomorrow to look see. The heave is due to a cottonwood tree just left of the sidewalk in the photo. Probably roots. I really have no idea how much cost I'm dealing with but if the contractor is reasonable I'm gonna ask to see how much to pave the entire section to the right of the sidewalk in addition to replacing the sidewalk. This will give a much larger driveway. Is there a per sq foot national standard I can use to guesstimate? Having just poured a new patio in my backyard, I can tell you this -Some contractors don't like to do small jobs. What you're talking about, is a small job -Yes, concrete companies have a minimum load they need to make it worth delivery and getting a truck on the road. If you only replaced that one section of sidewalk, your contractor may just do it all by hand with a wheelbarrow and bag of concrete. If you decided to pour new driveway, and a sidewalk, then you're getting into the range where it's worth it for a company to bring a truck My patio is 11x26, and the lowest bid we got from 3 separate companies was $2200 I literally don't even bother looking for a contractor anymore on jobs under about $4000. Nobody wants the work, they won't even call you back. It's weird, considering how desperate everybody was for any work to do 2 years ago. It's a good sign that the market is ready to replace some of the contractors we lost back in 2008-2010. |
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Posted: 7/25/2014 9:32:57 AM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Go back to Home Depot. Ask a couple of the Mexicans out front if they do concrete. Then have them tell you what tools and materials you need to buy. Get the stuff you need from Depot, take the Primos back to your work site and have them do the work while you drink a beer. Now you know why we have an immigration problem. You will also understand why we have people who are overweight and have substance abuse problems. There are also worker's compensation risks which a new homeowner probably should consider. I could write a book, literally, on why every aspect of this recommendation is a bad idea. |
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Posted: 7/25/2014 12:29:29 PM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I guess my insurance agent didn't look at my sidewalk/driveway when I bought my house . That small of a section I would do it myself. Post after pictures of your sweet flat work skillz.Yeah, it ain't gonna be sweet.
The entire sidewalk is 4 feet by 18 feet, which via a concrete calc says I need 81 40lb bags of concrete.  That's a lot of wheelbarrellin and mixing.
The "line" at the top of the pic is nothing but a line in the sidewalk, it looks like it was a single pour. I'm going to try and use Sakrete Top n Bond on it to slope it to satisfy the insurer, with long term plans of replacing the whole thing. (I need to learn this shit anyway). Keep in mind I have virtually no tools, so they will need to be purchased as needed, but so far I have a shopping list that consists of: Pick Shovel Hoe Lumber for forms Trowels Edger Sponge Wheelbarrow Prybar Sledgehammer Plastic sheeting Lots o homer buckets Handsaw for forms (circular maybe). Concrete, gravel. Anything I missed? |
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Posted: 7/25/2014 2:24:58 PM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Now you know why we have an immigration problem. You will also understand why we have people who are overweight and have substance abuse problems. There are also worker's compensation risks which a new homeowner probably should consider. I could write a book, literally, on why every aspect of this recommendation is a bad idea. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Go back to Home Depot. Ask a couple of the Mexicans out front if they do concrete. Then have them tell you what tools and materials you need to buy. Get the stuff you need from Depot, take the Primos back to your work site and have them do the work while you drink a beer. Now you know why we have an immigration problem. You will also understand why we have people who are overweight and have substance abuse problems. There are also worker's compensation risks which a new homeowner probably should consider. I could write a book, literally, on why every aspect of this recommendation is a bad idea. We have an immigration problem because people are overweight and have substance abuse problems as a result of their worker's compensation risks? Maybe you should write a book on sarcasm. |
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Posted: 7/25/2014 10:30:41 PM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Yeah, it ain't gonna be sweet.
The entire sidewalk is 4 feet by 18 feet, which via a concrete calc says I need 81 40lb bags of concrete. That's a lot of wheelbarrellin and mixing.
The "line" at the top of the pic is nothing but a line in the sidewalk, it looks like it was a single pour. I'm going to try and use Sakrete Top n Bond on it to slope it to satisfy the insurer, with long term plans of replacing the whole thing. (I need to learn this shit anyway). Keep in mind I have virtually no tools, so they will need to be purchased as needed, but so far I have a shopping list that consists of: Pick Shovel Hoe Lumber for forms Trowels Edger Sponge Wheelbarrow Prybar Sledgehammer Plastic sheeting Lots o homer buckets Handsaw for forms (circular maybe). Concrete, gravel. Anything I missed? Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
I guess my insurance agent didn't look at my sidewalk/driveway when I bought my house . That small of a section I would do it myself. Post after pictures of your sweet flat work skillz.Yeah, it ain't gonna be sweet.
The entire sidewalk is 4 feet by 18 feet, which via a concrete calc says I need 81 40lb bags of concrete. That's a lot of wheelbarrellin and mixing.
The "line" at the top of the pic is nothing but a line in the sidewalk, it looks like it was a single pour. I'm going to try and use Sakrete Top n Bond on it to slope it to satisfy the insurer, with long term plans of replacing the whole thing. (I need to learn this shit anyway). Keep in mind I have virtually no tools, so they will need to be purchased as needed, but so far I have a shopping list that consists of: Pick Shovel Hoe Lumber for forms Trowels Edger Sponge Wheelbarrow Prybar Sledgehammer Plastic sheeting Lots o homer buckets Handsaw for forms (circular maybe). Concrete, gravel. Anything I missed? Concrete saw Cut it at the line, Its still a simple repair |
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Posted: 7/26/2014 1:56:06 PM EDT
[#20]
Contractor came over....
The "patio" idea was an extra idea I had for additional parking out front. Due to easements and cost I'm not messing with it so the sidewalk and area bordering the footer for the front stairs he wants about $1500. |
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Posted: 7/26/2014 4:32:47 PM EDT
[#21]
Go for it, but,... be sure the contractor will allow you to cherry pick the estimate, "This and this but not that".
Once again, we see the contractor asking to be prepaid (50%). Personally, I am ambivalent about this but I know there are many here who would advise against paying anything up front. It's a small job. Ask if he'll agree to receive one payment upon completion. Get the revised terms in writing (red line the bid and both initial the changes). |
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Posted: 7/26/2014 5:52:43 PM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Contractor came over.... <a href="http://s1114.photobucket.com/user/JohnSmith6073/media/2014-07-252154382_zpse726efdf.jpg.html" target="_blank">http://i1114.photobucket.com/albums/k537/JohnSmith6073/2014-07-252154382_zpse726efdf.jpg</a> The "patio" idea was an extra idea I had for additional parking out front. Due to easements and cost I'm not messing with it so the sidewalk and area bordering the footer for the front stairs he wants about $1500. $11.50?! I was quoted $4 for my driveway, 12x35. |
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Posted: 7/26/2014 6:48:53 PM EDT
[#23]
Not sure, did yours require demo and excavation? Maybe the difference? Getting a second bid Monday.
According to the first guy the portion of the sidewalk in the photo is part of the city's easement and the tree actually belongs to them. |
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Posted: 7/26/2014 9:24:23 PM EDT
[#24]
Is it the sidewalk or the path to the house?
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Posted: 7/27/2014 12:51:49 AM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Not sure, did yours require demo and excavation? Maybe the difference? Getting a second bid Monday. According to the first guy the portion of the sidewalk in the photo is part of the city's easement and the tree actually belongs to them. Talking with the concrete guy that we used when I did construction, he said from the time they show up, until they leave, figure about $4 a square foot for a pad. I don't know what curbs,stairs, etc are. |
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Posted: 7/27/2014 4:42:13 AM EDT
[#26]
Not sure how things work in your area but if you are in the city try contacting them and see if they will perform the work.
In my hometown, the city will come out and repair the sidewalk and only charge for the materials, they do a good job and get it done pretty quickly. |
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Posted: 7/27/2014 9:07:18 AM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Not sure how things work in your area but if you are in the city try contacting them and see if they will perform the work. In my hometown, the city will come out and repair the sidewalk and only charge for the materials, they do a good job and get it done pretty quickly. Exactly. This is why I asked if it was a sidewalk or path. If it's a sidewalk, the City owns that. It is their responsibility to maintain it (and the offending tree). Actually, they don't want to you do repairs of the type being discussed here. Call them, for sure, if this is a sidewalk. |
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Posted: 7/27/2014 9:15:40 AM EDT
[#28]
I like to do things once. I rather pay a little more, one time, and have something last than save a nickel and "hope it lasts." That said, if you share that logic, your estimate skips right over.....PSI!
If you are doing a decent amount of work, you can quickly diminish your genuine guys from your "we do it all" guys by telling the them the job will require three sample pours which you will be testing to the PSI promised (at your own expense), and the contract must guarantee such or guarantee. You will tell right there if you have a decent guy who is good or a guy not worth talking to. I did a huge patio and the list went form a dozen to two...and both were on par with pricing. I never did the testing of the samples, but 8 years later and the slabs are perfect. Can't say so much for the neighbors who used on of the other guys. |
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Posted: 7/27/2014 9:22:14 AM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Is it the sidewalk or the path to the house? Path to house from the city sidewalk. The easement apparently extends about 5-6 feet from the sidewalk, some kind of historic thing. All of the neighboring front yard fences are along this "line" down the street, all are set back from the sidewalk about 5-6 feet. 
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Posted: 7/27/2014 1:52:48 PM EDT
[#30]
I don't know if it is at all useful, but maybe get a new insurance company? My grandma's sidewalk has been cracked for as long as I can remember, and her insurance hasn't ever told her to do something about it.
I switched our insurance after 1 year because the stupid agent lied to me in writing about the policy coverages. It's a pain to find a new insurance policy, but maybe it will be worth it if your current company is going to be nit-picking you about stuff like this. |
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Posted: 7/27/2014 5:00:58 PM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Path to house from the city sidewalk. The easement apparently extends about 5-6 feet from the sidewalk, some kind of historic thing. All of the neighboring front yard fences are along this "line" down the street, all are set back from the sidewalk about 5-6 feet. <a href="http://s1114.photobucket.com/user/JohnSmith6073/media/2014-07-27112037_zps91c45c7f.jpg.html" target="_blank">http://i1114.photobucket.com/albums/k537/JohnSmith6073/2014-07-27112037_zps91c45c7f.jpg</a> Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Is it the sidewalk or the path to the house? Path to house from the city sidewalk. The easement apparently extends about 5-6 feet from the sidewalk, some kind of historic thing. All of the neighboring front yard fences are along this "line" down the street, all are set back from the sidewalk about 5-6 feet. <a href="http://s1114.photobucket.com/user/JohnSmith6073/media/2014-07-27112037_zps91c45c7f.jpg.html" target="_blank">http://i1114.photobucket.com/albums/k537/JohnSmith6073/2014-07-27112037_zps91c45c7f.jpg</a> Interesting, give the city a call and see if you can get them to do the work... |
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Posted: 7/27/2014 5:09:43 PM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
If it were mine, I would replace the section completely or the entire walk vs a patch job. This. Saw cut where the expansion/contraction poi.ts were placed(and failed to properly crack). Then setup simple form and pour new concrete i.to the area where you removed the broken chunks. About a 1-2 hr job with maybe 20-30 bucks in materials. That is if you have a circular saw and can get a concrete blade. |
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Posted: 7/27/2014 9:12:05 PM EDT
[#33]
I would call your City's Building & Safety Department. Tell them the situation - their tree broke their sidewalk and it is a hazard to foot traffic. No one wants to be sued and surely someone will sue if they are injured in a fall. It probably does not meet the ADA requirements in its present state, either.
That tree was planted in the wrong spot. The sidewalk will crack again and again until that tree is gone. It looks to be a nice tree, so I'm sorry to say that. If you prune the roots below grade, the tree will be unstable. Honestly, the tree should come out or the path should be relocated to save the tree. |
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Posted: 7/27/2014 9:18:58 PM EDT
[#34]
Calling tomorrow, don't know if the tree predates the path or not.
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Posted: 7/28/2014 4:26:18 AM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Calling tomorrow, don't know if the tree predates the path or not. I would hate to lose that tree and the shade it provides. |
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Posted: 7/28/2014 9:47:51 AM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I would hate to lose that tree and the shade it provides. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Calling tomorrow, don't know if the tree predates the path or not. I would hate to lose that tree and the shade it provides. Yes, that tree is more important than the pathway but the two are in conflict. If you have the money, I would relocate the path away from the tree. You have to be careful. If the City owns the tree or the property it's on, they may use the sidewalk repair as justification to remove the tree. It is unlikely you will be given a vote in its removal. Relocating the path eliminates the conflict. You could use it as an opportunity. |
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Posted: 7/28/2014 11:07:54 AM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Yes, that tree is more important than the pathway but the two are in conflict. If you have the money, I would relocate the path away from the tree. You have to be careful. If the City owns the tree or the property it's on, they may use the sidewalk repair as justification to remove the tree. It is unlikely you will be given a vote in its removal. Relocating the path eliminates the conflict. You could use it as an opportunity. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Calling tomorrow, don't know if the tree predates the path or not. I would hate to lose that tree and the shade it provides. Yes, that tree is more important than the pathway but the two are in conflict. If you have the money, I would relocate the path away from the tree. You have to be careful. If the City owns the tree or the property it's on, they may use the sidewalk repair as justification to remove the tree. It is unlikely you will be given a vote in its removal. Relocating the path eliminates the conflict. You could use it as an opportunity. My thoughts also. |
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Posted: 7/28/2014 12:38:37 PM EDT
[#38]
I've learned a little. The city LOVES those trees, created a special "boulevard" area with them and permits must be sought to do anything that may alter them. The second contractor I talked to said he has to call the city with the idea of chopping the roots and they may or may not approve of it, they may make him pour a higher sidewalk (something the first contractor was planning on doing). He said the city has 24 hours to call him back with a laugh. I like the tree and don't want it gone. I could live with removing the path altogether and pouring a smaller one that links to the driveway instead. Any contractor doing anything that may impact the tree has to be an approved "boulevard" permitted outfit.
The fine for damaging the tree is some mathematical cluster that has a lot to do with the trunk diameter.
May go back to skimming the crack for insurance coverage and living with it.
ETA: Calls to the city forester in charge of the tree go to voicemail so far. |
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Posted: 7/28/2014 12:44:02 PM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Cut the concrete on the tooled line at the top of the photo. Do the same at the tooled line on the other side. Hammer out that section. Dig out any roots and compact the soil. Set 2 form boards. Dowel into the 2 cut edges. Pour new concrete. this, you can rent an electric jack hammer or a concrete saw from a local place and cut it in no time. i'd probably go with the saw, try to keep it in as many large chunks as possible. make sure there's no roots under it too, else it'll just happen again most likely. |
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Posted: 7/28/2014 5:53:32 PM EDT
[#40]
i would bust out that area around the crack, mix some sackrete and be done with it, i wouldnt replace 18 ft of sidewalk
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Posted: 7/28/2014 7:03:32 PM EDT
[#41]
You could remove the concrete pathway and replace it with gravel. This would not hurt the tree and would not be a trip hazard.
Decomposed granite (crushed stone) would also work. They need a border to retain the stone. This would actually beneficial to the tree relative to what's there now. |
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Posted: 7/29/2014 1:24:16 PM EDT
[#42]
City forester came out and took pics, referred me to the risk management section, who has filed a claim with their insurance. I'd be surprised if they approve the claim but it's worth a shot.
When I pressed the forester for an answer about cutting on the roots he said the insurance claim would determine if that would be done.
Wonder if the claim process will require multiple cost estimates? As we've seen, getting contractors to even come out and look at a small job is difficult. |
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Posted: 7/30/2014 5:41:59 AM EDT
[#43]
I only have one comment.
I would never give a contractor 1/2 the money upon signing a contract. I would agree to paying the first half the day he pulls up and starts the job. He may very well need the funds to purchase materials or pay for things. If you pay him half, a month in advance, he has no incentive to keep you high on his list of priorities. Suddenly other profitable jobs are pushed in front of yours. I've seen it happen dozens of times. I used to be a contractor. When people offered to pay me a substantial amount well in advance of starting the job, I would decline payment. I would tell them exactly what I typed above. I was always honest and conscientious as a contractor, but human nature is what it is. |
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Posted: 7/30/2014 2:09:24 PM EDT
[#44]
Yeah, I'm a little hesitant to give the guy money up front. Would probably negotiate full payment upon completion or it's a nogo.
Spoke with the city insurance rep and he pretty much hinted the claim will be denied. City code states "The property owner shall maintain landscaping within the boulevard area not occupied by roadways, curb and gutter, driveways, sidewalks, or crosswalks according to the standards in this article." He also said it was there when I bought the property so I should have had the issue corrected prior to closing, etc. So............. I fired the home insurer and am going with another one that doesnt care about sidewalk cracks. Still going to fix the sidewalk at some point but time is not an issue at this point. |
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Posted: 7/30/2014 3:59:45 PM EDT
[#45]
hmm sounds like the cities sidewalk and the cities problem not your insurance companies
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Posted: 7/30/2014 4:18:33 PM EDT
[#46]
I'd get rid of the shit pathway and make a stone walkway or grass, the insurance company is retarded.
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