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 BobCole
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Team Member
Joined: Oct 2001  TN, USA
 Posts: 26325 Feedback: 100% (4) Link To This Post |
Posted: 3/1/2009 8:43:10 PM
Mr. King;
I am a NRA Life Member & I am constantly defending the NRA's rep among black rifle owners. While many of us need no convincing about the NRA's dedication to ALL firearms, many black rifle owners are convinced that the NRA could care less about these types of rifles. Quite honestly, I am not able to refute two points they make: 1) Lack of black rifle coverage in American Rifleman, both in stories & on the cover. Yes, I realize that there's a slew of what's known as "Fudd rifles" that flood the market as well as shotguns, but given the option of "American Hunter" magazine, why don't those bolt actions take a backseat in the Am Rifleman magazine? Yes, I understand sometimes one has to cater to their advertisers, I too live in the real world & not a dream world. But I can count on one hand & have fingers left over for the number of times the Am Rifleman has had a black rifle (not necessarily an AR) on their cover. 2) Lack of non-hunting guns available at the Friends of the NRA banquets!!!!! This is a personal PET PEEVE of mine as well! It has been explained to me that 5 states do not allow hi-cap rifles to be sold in those states. Ok, well, what about the OTHER 45 states, sir? Is it so gosh darn hard to offer something to the vast, vast majority of the "free" states? The current package offers a compact Kimber 1911, a J-frame S&W & the rest are purely hunting guns. Now, certainly no offense to those whom hunt, but many of us simply SHOOT and/or shoot in competitions such as IPSC/IDPA & 3 Gun matches. What in the WORLD would most of us do with a camo'd pump shotgun or a synthetic stocked Weatherby? Nice guns, no doubt, but in major metro areas hunting is an extremely hard to find activity these days due to development. I understand one cannot please everyone & goodness knows that will NEVER happen. But when *I* go to try to sell banquet tickets & potential buyers look at the package offered, they just shake their heads & tell me to get back to them when the hunters allow the black rifle crowd to sit at the table too. Yes, I know there's offerings allowed to supplement the designated prize packages. That is beside my point. In fact, it MAKES my point in that the black rifles should be the ones offered & the Weatherby's & Bennelli's should be the options to be bought above the package. I strongly argued this point at the recent banquet committee meeting with some regional NRA managers. I may have just as been talking to a wall for all the feedback I got from them. In fact, it was suggested that banquet attendees place their complaints in "writing" in order to "prove" these points. It was at this time that I got discouraged & just gave up. They are willing to just "write off" a HUGE potential market of attendees for our banquets. 
May I politely remind the NRA higher ups that this web site is "AR15 dot com" & NOT "bolt action rifle dot com" or "pump shotgun dot com"???????? 
Thank you for your time & response, sir! |
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Posted: 3/1/2009 9:57:07 PM
Originally Posted By Tom_King:
Originally Posted By oulufinn:
Mr. King, Thank you for taking the time to post here! I am wondering why there is so very little (Next to none.) information on the NRA website regarding the Board of directors. It seems the only information available is what little is in the magazines and on sites like ARFCOM. I am really appreciative of the good information here, and am making good use of it, but it seems that there should be much more information on the official NRA website regarding the candidates and the voting process. It seems it is not by accident that the information is not available & the management of the NRA does not want to make it so. I am personally very interested in the status of guys like Joaquin Jackson who showed his absurd views, and when he will be up for re-election. (I think it is in 2010). A Google search on "NRA Board of Directors" yields links to an anti gun site " http://www.nraleaders.com/ "(Left cold on purpose) and links to other sites that discuss the subject. The NRA surely has a web development plan to direct people to their site, don't they? Sometimes web browsing is more convenient than finding the magazine and searching through it for limited information. Also, others who may consider joining and see the existing site, may want more actual information about the leadership, rather than what is actually available now. I had posted this in another section, but was directed here by wise_jake. (Thanks for the direction, wise_jake) Regards, Bruce Bruce, The NRA by laws specify where the information must be posted and how. The NRA is a NY Corporation and I don't think NY alows electronic posting. I don't know what the future plans are for web development but do know that changes are in the works. Joaquin was bush whacked. He is as pro black gun as you and me..that can be taken to the bank.. TK Thank you for your reply, Mr. King. I hope that there are some changes made in communication of these important issues, if allowed by state law and the NRA bylaws. It would seem that the internet is an effective way to communicate to present and future members that is being severely underused. There must be some way to utilize this medium to better effect. As to taking the latter to the bank... I have heard many speak about magazine capacity, hunting, and self defense. If one "Gets it" it really isn't hard to be clear on the subject & the first answer that comes out in a "Bushwhack" situation is a fairly reliable indicator of true feelings, IMO. We will have to disagree on this one. When this came to light I immediately upgraded to a Life Member. I then had the privilege to speak about it with Edward Land, who assured me that the statements made by Mr. Jackson were not the position held by the NRA. He did use the word "Bushwhacked" in the conversation, as well, though I sensed a great dismay at the words used by Mr. Jackson, regardless of their exact context. This is why a short bio is nowhere near enough to make an informed and accurate decision on who to cast a vote for. We need deeper insight into the real feelings of a candidate. Regards, Bruce |
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Posted: 3/1/2009 11:12:10 PM
Hello Mr King.
Thank you for your work and dedication. As a benefactor life member, I know as you do NRA membership MUST be at much higher levels if we have a shot of resisting more restrictive firearm laws. Because of our economy, how about a 1/2 price renewal and new membership incentive program to entice membership growth? Pass the word... |
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Posted: 3/2/2009 8:56:37 AM
Originally Posted By RRA223:
Hello Mr King. Thank you for your work and dedication. As a benefactor life member, I know as you do NRA membership MUST be at much higher levels if we have a shot of resisting more restrictive firearm laws. Because of our economy, how about a 1/2 price renewal and new membership incentive program to entice membership growth? Pass the word... RRA223, It has been passed on. TK |
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Posted: 3/5/2009 8:24:08 PM
Originally Posted By BobCole:
Mr. King; I am a NRA Life Member & I am constantly defending the NRA's rep among black rifle owners. While many of us need no convincing about the NRA's dedication to ALL firearms, many black rifle owners are convinced that the NRA could care less about these types of rifles. Quite honestly, I am not able to refute two points they make: 1) Lack of black rifle coverage in American Rifleman, both in stories & on the cover. Yes, I realize that there's a slew of what's known as "Fudd rifles" that flood the market as well as shotguns, but given the option of "American Hunter" magazine, why don't those bolt actions take a backseat in the Am Rifleman magazine? Yes, I understand sometimes one has to cater to their advertisers, I too live in the real world & not a dream world. But I can count on one hand & have fingers left over for the number of times the Am Rifleman has had a black rifle (not necessarily an AR) on their cover. 2) Lack of non-hunting guns available at the Friends of the NRA banquets!!!!! This is a personal PET PEEVE of mine as well! It has been explained to me that 5 states do not allow hi-cap rifles to be sold in those states. Ok, well, what about the OTHER 45 states, sir? Is it so gosh darn hard to offer something to the vast, vast majority of the "free" states? The current package offers a compact Kimber 1911, a J-frame S&W & the rest are purely hunting guns. Now, certainly no offense to those whom hunt, but many of us simply SHOOT and/or shoot in competitions such as IPSC/IDPA & 3 Gun matches. What in the WORLD would most of us do with a camo'd pump shotgun or a synthetic stocked Weatherby? Nice guns, no doubt, but in major metro areas hunting is an extremely hard to find activity these days due to development. I understand one cannot please everyone & goodness knows that will NEVER happen. But when *I* go to try to sell banquet tickets & potential buyers look at the package offered, they just shake their heads & tell me to get back to them when the hunters allow the black rifle crowd to sit at the table too. Yes, I know there's offerings allowed to supplement the designated prize packages. That is beside my point. In fact, it MAKES my point in that the black rifles should be the ones offered & the Weatherby's & Bennelli's should be the options to be bought above the package. I strongly argued this point at the recent banquet committee meeting with some regional NRA managers. I may have just as been talking to a wall for all the feedback I got from them. In fact, it was suggested that banquet attendees place their complaints in "writing" in order to "prove" these points. It was at this time that I got discouraged & just gave up. They are willing to just "write off" a HUGE potential market of attendees for our banquets.
May I politely remind the NRA higher ups that this web site is "AR15 dot com" & NOT "bolt action rifle dot com" or "pump shotgun dot com"????????
Thank you for your time & response, sir! Sorry, I missed this posting. I'm not sure how to respond, I've been to Friends Dinners where there have been many black guns and some where there are none. Maybe it's time to have more black gunners became involved with the committees. I know you would be welcome. Who did you have the discussion with? TK |
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BobCole
Team Member
Team Member
Joined: Oct 2001 TN, USA
Posts: 26510 Feedback: 100% (4) Link To This Post |
Posted: 3/6/2009 1:34:02 PM
[Last Edit: 3/6/2009 1:35:08 PM by BobCole]
Originally Posted By Tom_King:
Sorry, I missed this posting. I'm not sure how to respond, I've been to Friends Dinners where there have been many black guns and some where there are none. Maybe it's time to have more black gunners became involved with the committees. I know you would be welcome. Who did you have the discussion with? TK No problem, sir. I did not get the gentleman's name with whom I had my rather passionate plea to. I stress to add he was polite & professional, I don't wish to imply otherwise. But he certainly gave off a "it is what it is & we're not changing" vibe in his comments. This is NOT my first time on this committee either. A previous chairman was also a black rifle owner & added several items to the auction & they were clearly the overwhelming favorite that night. Perhaps what disappointed me the most was despite my laying out the reasons to move away from the bolt action rifles (lack of hunting opportunity in an urban area) & the cowboy revolvers (c'mon, everyone is wanting hi-caps!), he wanted WRITTEN responses/complaints from banquet attendees. 
There was another fellow committee member present whom seconded my comments as well, again to no avail. Mr. King, no one is bad mouthing hunters or their guns, nor the cowboy shooters & their guns. But as one whom is "in the trenches" (so to speak) at gun ranges & in arfcom defending the NRA & their actions, I'm urging those such as yourself to make the leap from the 1950's to the present, sir! Go to some of the NRA threads in the General Discussion forum of arfcom & read the comments. They're NOT all positive, nor all kind. Quite honestly, I have a difficult time to refute some of their criticism as they have strong points. While most everyone in arfcom IS a shooter, not half of us are hunters. Possibly even less. The vast, vast majority of us are gun range "commando's" (I use that term respectfully) or we shoot IPSC/IDPA or 3 Gun. Many of us do all of those, hunting excepted. Again, I understand the NRA will never be everything for everyone. I also know there's the "Fudd's" out there who love their O&U shotguns & bolt action Remington's & will gladly not lift a finger on a future gun ban. The reason I know this, they have PERSONALLY told me so to my face. However, these "gentlemen" are in a vast, vast minority these days. All one has to do is visit an outdoor range in a "free" state that allows black rifles & do a survey on what they see being shot there. I bet $1 black rifles will outnumber bolt actions by 3 or 4 to 1. Sadly, many of these black rifle owners are NOT NRA members due to their feeling (right or wrong) that the NRA is biased towards the bolt action crowd. Then *I* try to sell banquet tickets to these guys & they literally laugh at me when I show them the auction list of firearms available. Yes, I know this year's package includes a Kimber 1911 & a J-frame S&W, both non-hunting guns. Ok, that's what, 2 out of 7 or 8 guns being offered? It's grossly disproportionate to what current shooters are interested in & (more importantly) are BUYING at dealers & gun shows. IMO, we don't have to offer $1200 AR's at the banquets. We can offer an AK variant, a SKS or even some older mil-surp Mauser bolt actions from someone such as Mitchell's Mauser's. Point is, the banquet is in a rut & are offering the "SOS" (same old s***). I have been told this by multiple long-time banquet attendees whom will no longer buy tickets. My apologies for this being so long, but I feel like I'm talking to people whom won't see the forest from the trees in my regional reps, however polite they may be. Perhaps when the banquets begin setting records for low attendance as well as low amounts of funds raised, someone will begin to pay attention then? Thank you. |
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HiramRanger
Helldog's Nummy Nums
Moderator
Joined: Nov 2000 USA
Posts: 28689 Feedback: 100% (93) Link To This Post |
Posted: 3/7/2009 11:23:55 AM
Went to a Friends of the NRA dinner last night as Tom's guest. Among the firearms being offered last evening were a Bushmaster AR15 and a Beretta Storm. Just saying.
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BobCole
Team Member
Team Member
Joined: Oct 2001 TN, USA
Posts: 26557 Feedback: 100% (4) Link To This Post |
Posted: 3/7/2009 9:39:28 PM
Originally Posted By HiramRanger:
Went to a Friends of the NRA dinner last night as Tom's guest. Among the firearms being offered last evening were a Bushmaster AR15 and a Beretta Storm. Just saying. Shouldn't these guns be a part of the basic package instead of an additional purchase option, in your opinion? |
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silentmajority
I'll keep my guns, you can keep the 'Change'
Team Member
Joined: Apr 2007 USA
Posts: 3427 Feedback: 0% (0) Link To This Post |
Posted: 3/8/2009 11:20:49 AM
Mr. King,
Thank you for participating in this thread, and for giving your time to NRA and defense of 2A. I am a Life Endowment member living in PA. In November 2008, Glenn Thompson was elected to the U.S. House of Representatives for the 5th PA congressional district. I am not affiliated with Mr. Thompson, but would like to make sure the NRA administration maintains good relations with the freshman congressman. GT, as he is known to many of his constituents, is a strong advocate for 2A and conservative ideals in general. Mr. King, I share the deep concerns any Conservative with working eyes, ears, and brain feels regarding the increased speed of the governmental paradigm-shift to Socialism following this January's Presidential inauguration. We have an almost perfect storm of unchecked, out of control, Administrative and Legislative government branches implementing their radical-liberal agenda against the nation, facilitated (perhaps 'fellated' would be more accurately descriptive in the case of their treatment of our new, Dear Leader) by a mainstream media that is acting as the Democrat 'mainstream ministry of propaganda'. What can we do as individuals, and collectively through the NRA as a power block of political and social action, to legally *and* quickly reverse this decline into socialism and radical liberalism the country is descending into? Does the true commitment exist within the leadership of NRA to accept the vicious attacks of a leftist-controlled government and mainstream ministry of propaganda/disinformation, and to fight in every legal manner possible against the enemies of Conservatism? What, specifically, is NRA doing towards this end? |
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HiramRanger
Helldog's Nummy Nums
Moderator
Joined: Nov 2000 USA
Posts: 28703 Feedback: 100% (93) Link To This Post |
Posted: 3/8/2009 6:16:55 PM
Originally Posted By BobCole:
Originally Posted By HiramRanger:
Went to a Friends of the NRA dinner last night as Tom's guest. Among the firearms being offered last evening were a Bushmaster AR15 and a Beretta Storm. Just saying. Shouldn't these guns be a part of the basic package instead of an additional purchase option, in your opinion? You know Bob, I was glad to see they were there PERIOD. I'm not going to get upset that they weren't offered up as a door prize. It was a fund raiser, it raised funds and it was a black rifle with a prominent position in the evenings festivities. |
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Posted: 3/8/2009 6:37:21 PM
Rights, Not Privileges
"No State shall convert a liberty into a privilege, license it, and charge a fee therefor." ––Murdock v. Pennsylvania, 319 US 105, US Supreme Court, 1943. The U.S. Supreme Court broadly and unequivocally held that requiring licensing or registration of any constitutional right is itself unconstitutional. ––Follett vs. Town of McCormick, S.C., 321 U.S. 573 [1944] Article 2.4 of the Civil Rights Section of the Consolidated Laws of New York, is this: § 4. Right to keep and bear arms. A well regulated militia being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms cannot be infringed. Mr. Tom King Being a lifetime member of the NRA I have found nothing nor heard of anything comming from the NRA that addrees this issue for NYS lawfull people living under Federal and State unconstitutional law. If you know, what is the NRA's agressive stance on this issue? |
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Posted: 3/8/2009 9:46:09 PM
Originally Posted By BobCole:
Originally Posted By Tom_King:
Sorry, I missed this posting. I'm not sure how to respond, I've been to Friends Dinners where there have been many black guns and some where there are none. Maybe it's time to have more black gunners became involved with the committees. I know you would be welcome. Who did you have the discussion with? TK No problem, sir. I did not get the gentleman's name with whom I had my rather passionate plea to. I stress to add he was polite & professional, I don't wish to imply otherwise. But he certainly gave off a "it is what it is & we're not changing" vibe in his comments. This is NOT my first time on this committee either. A previous chairman was also a black rifle owner & added several items to the auction & they were clearly the overwhelming favorite that night. Perhaps what disappointed me the most was despite my laying out the reasons to move away from the bolt action rifles (lack of hunting opportunity in an urban area) & the cowboy revolvers (c'mon, everyone is wanting hi-caps!), he wanted WRITTEN responses/complaints from banquet attendees.
There was another fellow committee member present whom seconded my comments as well, again to no avail. Mr. King, no one is bad mouthing hunters or their guns, nor the cowboy shooters & their guns. But as one whom is "in the trenches" (so to speak) at gun ranges & in arfcom defending the NRA & their actions, I'm urging those such as yourself to make the leap from the 1950's to the present, sir! Go to some of the NRA threads in the General Discussion forum of arfcom & read the comments. They're NOT all positive, nor all kind. Quite honestly, I have a difficult time to refute some of their criticism as they have strong points. While most everyone in arfcom IS a shooter, not half of us are hunters. Possibly even less. The vast, vast majority of us are gun range "commando's" (I use that term respectfully) or we shoot IPSC/IDPA or 3 Gun. Many of us do all of those, hunting excepted. Again, I understand the NRA will never be everything for everyone. I also know there's the "Fudd's" out there who love their O&U shotguns & bolt action Remington's & will gladly not lift a finger on a future gun ban. The reason I know this, they have PERSONALLY told me so to my face. However, these "gentlemen" are in a vast, vast minority these days. All one has to do is visit an outdoor range in a "free" state that allows black rifles & do a survey on what they see being shot there. I bet $1 black rifles will outnumber bolt actions by 3 or 4 to 1. Sadly, many of these black rifle owners are NOT NRA members due to their feeling (right or wrong) that the NRA is biased towards the bolt action crowd. Then *I* try to sell banquet tickets to these guys & they literally laugh at me when I show them the auction list of firearms available. Yes, I know this year's package includes a Kimber 1911 & a J-frame S&W, both non-hunting guns. Ok, that's what, 2 out of 7 or 8 guns being offered? It's grossly disproportionate to what current shooters are interested in & (more importantly) are BUYING at dealers & gun shows. IMO, we don't have to offer $1200 AR's at the banquets. We can offer an AK variant, a SKS or even some older mil-surp Mauser bolt actions from someone such as Mitchell's Mauser's. Point is, the banquet is in a rut & are offering the "SOS" (same old s***). I have been told this by multiple long-time banquet attendees whom will no longer buy tickets. My apologies for this being so long, but I feel like I'm talking to people whom won't see the forest from the trees in my regional reps, however polite they may be. Perhaps when the banquets begin setting records for low attendance as well as low amounts of funds raised, someone will begin to pay attention then? Thank you. I understand your feelings but don't agree with your assumptions about the NRA's feelings towards shooters and black guns versus hunters. I know how much time and effort the NRA puts into the high power program at Camp Perry, the new M14 event and the 3 gun program but more importantly hunters say exactly the same thing that you do; the NRA spends too much time with black guns and not enough with the hunters. I know that I like all firearms; if you pull the trigger and it goes bang it is OK with me. I shoot pistols, rifles and shotguns in many different disciplines and so do many other NRA Board and Staff members. The Banquet Staff will change the make up of the standard package when there is enough demand from the people attending the banquets and committee members. TK |
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Posted: 3/8/2009 9:52:26 PM
Originally Posted By silentmajority:
Mr. King, Thank you for participating in this thread, and for giving your time to NRA and defense of 2A. I am a Life Endowment member living in PA. In November 2008, Glenn Thompson was elected to the U.S. House of Representatives for the 5th PA congressional district. I am not affiliated with Mr. Thompson, but would like to make sure the NRA administration maintains good relations with the freshman congressman. GT, as he is known to many of his constituents, is a strong advocate for 2A and conservative ideals in general. Mr. King, I share the deep concerns any Conservative with working eyes, ears, and brain feels regarding the increased speed of the governmental paradigm-shift to Socialism following this January's Presidential inauguration. We have an almost perfect storm of unchecked, out of control, Administrative and Legislative government branches implementing their radical-liberal agenda against the nation, facilitated (perhaps 'fellated' would be more accurately descriptive in the case of their treatment of our new, Dear Leader) by a mainstream media that is acting as the Democrat 'mainstream ministry of propaganda'. What can we do as individuals, and collectively through the NRA as a power block of political and social action, to legally *and* quickly reverse this decline into socialism and radical liberalism the country is descending into? Does the true commitment exist within the leadership of NRA to accept the vicious attacks of a leftist-controlled government and mainstream ministry of propaganda/disinformation, and to fight in every legal manner possible against the enemies of Conservatism? What, specifically, is NRA doing towards this end? Sir, the NRA is a 2nd Amendent Advocacy Organization. |
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BobCole
Team Member
Team Member
Joined: Oct 2001 TN, USA
Posts: 26596 Feedback: 100% (4) Link To This Post |
Posted: 3/8/2009 11:12:07 PM
Originally Posted By Tom_King:
I understand your feelings but don't agree with your assumptions about the NRA's feelings towards shooters and black guns versus hunters. I know how much time and effort the NRA puts into the high power program at Camp Perry, the new M14 event and the 3 gun program but more importantly hunters say exactly the same thing that you do; the NRA spends too much time with black guns and not enough with the hunters. I know that I like all firearms; if you pull the trigger and it goes bang it is OK with me. I shoot pistols, rifles and shotguns in many different disciplines and so do many other NRA Board and Staff members. The Banquet Staff will change the make up of the standard package when there is enough demand from the people attending the banquets and committee members. TK A) it's not MY assumptions, Mr. King. I repeatedly have asked you to visit the NRA threads in this web site to read firsthand what the black rifle shooters are saying about the NRA. How to make it clearer than that, I just don't honestly know how............. 
B) As for "demand" from the people attending, please be specific as to how to make their voices heard, sir? Do I have to hogtie the TN rep to a chair & have person after person after person come up to him & tell him so? We have multiple people on the committe NOW telling him this, as well as myself telling you this now, as well as asking you to visit the NRA threads. Quite honestly, Mr. King, it appears to me that the only thing that will get the NRA's attention is a much, much lower intake on the income at the banquets. And I pretty much guess that the NRA will turn around & blame it on the economy rather than dare to listen to the rank & file people whom buy the tickets.
Whatever. Good day to you, sir. |
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Posted: 3/9/2009 4:59:17 PM
Originally Posted By BobCole:
Originally Posted By Tom_King:
I understand your feelings but don't agree with your assumptions about the NRA's feelings towards shooters and black guns versus hunters. I know how much time and effort the NRA puts into the high power program at Camp Perry, the new M14 event and the 3 gun program but more importantly hunters say exactly the same thing that you do; the NRA spends too much time with black guns and not enough with the hunters. I know that I like all firearms; if you pull the trigger and it goes bang it is OK with me. I shoot pistols, rifles and shotguns in many different disciplines and so do many other NRA Board and Staff members. The Banquet Staff will change the make up of the standard package when there is enough demand from the people attending the banquets and committee members. TK A) it's not MY assumptions, Mr. King. I repeatedly have asked you to visit the NRA threads in this web site to read firsthand what the black rifle shooters are saying about the NRA. How to make it clearer than that, I just don't honestly know how.............
B) As for "demand" from the people attending, please be specific as to how to make their voices heard, sir? Do I have to hogtie the TN rep to a chair & have person after person after person come up to him & tell him so? We have multiple people on the committee NOW telling him this, as well as myself telling you this now, as well as asking you to visit the NRA threads. Quite honestly, Mr. King, it appears to me that the only thing that will get the NRA's attention is a much, much lower intake on the income at the banquets. And I pretty much guess that the NRA will turn around & blame it on the economy rather than dare to listen to the rank & file people whom buy the tickets.
Whatever. Good day to you, sir. No sir, you have to get involved, work on a committee and make your voice heard. Each individual committee has flexibility on what appears at their banquet and how it is presented. I know what people say about the NRA I used to say similar things until I became involved and found out the difficulties in running an association. Change only comes from the inside; get involved and do it. TK |
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silentmajority
I'll keep my guns, you can keep the 'Change'
Team Member
Joined: Apr 2007 USA
Posts: 3431 Feedback: 0% (0) Link To This Post |
Posted: 3/9/2009 5:19:23 PM
Originally Posted By Tom_King:
Originally Posted By silentmajority:
Mr. King,...What can we do as individuals, and collectively through the NRA as a power block of political and social action, to legally *and* quickly reverse this decline into socialism and radical liberalism the country is descending into?...What, specifically, is NRA doing towards this end? Sir, the NRA is a 2nd Amendent Advocacy Organization. Mr. King, I take your point. I guess I am thinking more about the root causes that lead to a social and political mindset that embraces infringement of our 2A protections. It seems like NRA will be forever reactive, solely countering anti-2A critics and legislation. I just wondered if there was a broader view towards spending some of the organization's money and political capital on educating the masses about the ideals the nation was founded upon, the relevant lessons of history, other activism geared towards eroding the power base of the Left, and in general acting as a sort of counterweight to the disinformation being passed off as facts to our youth and our media-lobotomized adult generations. There simply does not appear to be enough organizations with the resources and the will to take on the political and media power structure of the Left. I guess I am giving the NRA more hope as an overall conservative political action organization than is realistic. Sorry to take your time. |
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HiramRanger
Helldog's Nummy Nums
Moderator
Joined: Nov 2000 USA
Posts: 28704 Feedback: 100% (93) Link To This Post |
Posted: 3/9/2009 8:18:56 PM
I think that many of us would love to see the NRA do more politically... so I ask the question. How many people here give to the NRA-ILA? That is the body that is politically active and the hammer to smash down on those who would infringe upon our freedoms. I'll freely admit, I haven't and I need to. Last year I became a life member and than upgraded to endowment. This year my focus is on giving and doing for the ILA. Only one in 20 gun owners is a member of the NRA. What percentage of NRA members do you think support the ILA financially? I'm guessing it is pretty dismal. I can do more, and I will. I bet many here can as well.
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wise_jake
NRA Legacy Life Member, and unrepentant Old Whig
Team Member
Joined: Jun 2003 TX, USA
Posts: 27224 Feedback: 100% (1) Link To This Post |
Posted: 3/9/2009 9:56:33 PM
[Last Edit: 3/9/2009 10:01:24 PM by wise_jake]
Originally Posted By silentmajority: The NRA has to stay neutral (i.e. 'non-partisan') if it is to preserve the one [enumerated] right they specialize in protecting.Originally Posted By Tom_King: Mr. King, I take your point. I guess I am thinking more about the root causes that lead to a social and political mindset that embraces infringement of our 2A protections. It seems like NRA will be forever reactive, solely countering anti-2A critics and legislation. I just wondered if there was a broader view towards spending some of the organization's money and political capital on educating the masses about the ideals the nation was founded upon, the relevant lessons of history, other activism geared towards eroding the power base of the Left, and in general acting as a sort of counterweight to the disinformation being passed off as facts to our youth and our media-lobotomized adult generations. Originally Posted By silentmajority: Sir, the NRA is a 2nd Amendent Advocacy Organization.Mr. King,...What can we do as individuals, and collectively through the NRA as a power block of political and social action, to legally *and* quickly reverse this decline into socialism and radical liberalism the country is descending into?...What, specifically, is NRA doing towards this end? There simply does not appear to be enough organizations with the resources and the will to take on the political and media power structure of the Left. I guess I am giving the NRA more hope as an overall conservative political action organization than is realistic. Sorry to take your time. Democrats come in handy from time to time, and we can't 'make this' into a "conservative vs. liberal" issue, either.* This is kind of off-topic for an "NRA thread," but 'conservatism' is by its very nature reactive ("Why I Am Not A Conservative," by Friedrich Hayek, whom both Reagan and Thatcher were very fond of). I too wish NRA would be a bit more liberal (in the proper, etymological sense of the word). Less of the "parry, parry," and more of the "thrust!" And they are, to a degree, and you can see that in Heller II and the muti-pronged approach to the incorporation battle. * This was especially evident in Texas, in 2006, when we finally secured permitless "car carry" of handguns. It was a joint effort of TSRA (Texas State Rifle Association, the state-level NRA affiliate in Texas, and "State Association of the Year" in 2004) and ACLU-TX. Grits for Breakfast Lone Star Times In fact, the ACLU-TX involvement was crucial; we'd not have gotten "car carry" without it. A cadre of anti-gun Dems had us 'set' on a procedural issue (an error on our part), and it wasn't until a Dem legislator learned that TSRA and ACLU-TX were in together on this that he broke ranks with his party and helped us navigate the procedural blockade. |
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Posted: 3/10/2009 10:39:37 PM
Originally Posted By wise_jake:
Originally Posted By silentmajority:
The NRA has to stay neutral (i.e. 'non-partisan') if it is to preserve the one [enumerated] right they specialize in protecting.
Originally Posted By Tom_King:
Mr. King, I take your point. I guess I am thinking more about the root causes that lead to a social and political mindset that embraces infringement of our 2A protections. It seems like NRA will be forever reactive, solely countering anti-2A critics and legislation. I just wondered if there was a broader view towards spending some of the organization's money and political capital on educating the masses about the ideals the nation was founded upon, the relevant lessons of history, other activism geared towards eroding the power base of the Left, and in general acting as a sort of counterweight to the disinformation being passed off as facts to our youth and our media-lobotomized adult generations.
Originally Posted By silentmajority:
Sir, the NRA is a 2nd Amendent Advocacy Organization.
Mr. King,...What can we do as individuals, and collectively through the NRA as a power block of political and social action, to legally *and* quickly reverse this decline into socialism and radical liberalism the country is descending into?...What, specifically, is NRA doing towards this end? There simply does not appear to be enough organizations with the resources and the will to take on the political and media power structure of the Left. I guess I am giving the NRA more hope as an overall conservative political action organization than is realistic. Sorry to take your time. Democrats come in handy from time to time, and we can't 'make this' into a "conservative vs. liberal" issue, either.* This is kind of off-topic for an "NRA thread," but 'conservatism' is by its very nature reactive ("Why I Am Not A Conservative," by Friedrich Hayek, whom both Reagan and Thatcher were very fond of). I too wish NRA would be a bit more liberal (in the proper, etymological sense of the word). Less of the "parry, parry," and more of the "thrust!" And they are, to a degree, and you can see that in Heller II and the muti-pronged approach to the incorporation battle. * This was especially evident in Texas, in 2006, when we finally secured permitless "car carry" of handguns. It was a joint effort of TSRA (Texas State Rifle Association, the state-level NRA affiliate in Texas, and "State Association of the Year" in 2004) and ACLU-TX. Grits for Breakfast Lone Star Times In fact, the ACLU-TX involvement was crucial; we'd not have gotten "car carry" without it. A cadre of anti-gun Dems had us 'set' on a procedural issue (an error on our part), and it wasn't until a Dem legislator learned that TSRA and ACLU-TX were in together on this that he broke ranks with his party and helped us navigate the procedural blockade. The NRA for years has espoused the values of the Founding Fathers and preached that the 2nd Amendment is the cornerstone/protector of the Bill of Rights. Supporting other issues or causes dilutes the issue and detracts from the message. |
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postpostban
ELECTRICIAN EXTRAORDINAIRE
Team Member
Joined: Sep 2004 IL, USA
Posts: 5185 Feedback: 100% (3) Link To This Post |
Posted: 3/12/2009 9:02:49 PM
Will the NRA do anything about this?link
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HiramRanger
Helldog's Nummy Nums
Moderator
Joined: Nov 2000 USA
Posts: 28731 Feedback: 100% (93) Link To This Post |
Posted: 3/12/2009 9:26:07 PM
While it is just another idiotic DoD policy, what infringement of the 2nd amendment is this, why would the NRA get involved and why should they waste valuable resources and political capital on this? |
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Posted: 3/13/2009 3:54:01 PM
[quote]Originally Posted By postpostban:
Will the NRA do anything about this?link[/quote Are you kidding me? When I went to the link it said "No Mutilation Required". Why would anybody think any group could require the DOD to not get the highest price for scrap metal? Are you looking for something else to blame on the NRA? TK |
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Masha
Lemon of Troy
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Joined: Sep 2007 VA, USA
Posts: 2649 Feedback: 0% (0) Link To This Post |
Posted: 3/13/2009 4:03:30 PM
 Tom King rules! |
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Posted: 3/13/2009 9:11:29 PM
Originally Posted By Masha:
Tom King rules!Thanks |
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BobCole
Team Member
Team Member
Joined: Oct 2001 TN, USA
Posts: 26703 Feedback: 100% (4) Link To This Post |
Posted: 3/13/2009 9:15:44 PM
Originally Posted By Tom_King:
Are you looking for something else to blame on the NRA? My Jeep doesn't get enough MPG, can the NRA do something about that?  
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