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Posted: 4/14/2015 12:19:40 PM EDT
[#1]
I agree with this 100%. I never really "got" Christianity until I started learning about the more traditional, solemn expressions of it. Same with my wife. We are in our 20s and attend Latin Mass every Sunday.
 
I'm sure there are people who can really connect to God with more contemporary worship, but I am definitely not one of them. |
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Posted: 4/14/2015 3:29:00 PM EDT
[#2]
I like the article. But, I'm not sure I get it. I agree we should DEFINITELY not follow trends. If what we have taught for 2000 yrs is Truth, it does not change, it is constant. I agree we each have our own paths to take to find God, but to skip mass "Just because" doesn't sit well with me.
Yes, the Church is everywhere. We interact every day with it. But Mass, the Sabbath, is a Sanctuary. A time to retreat & be revived & revised. A time to sit with & be with OUR GOD. To Receive Our Lord in the Eucharist. Growing up, I hated mass. But my parents had me do what the Catholic Church required. I am indebted to them for the rest of my life. Because they gave me this constant, I have been able to have an anchor point to guide me into adulthood & parenthood. If this had constantly changed with the latest trends, I wouldn't have that. I have raised a "millennial" into adulthood. She has her ups & downs. "tried" different churches. But, continues to come back. She says, it is the Sacrifice of the mass. The Eucharist. The constant reverence. The peace, without the noise to jumble the message. I think we need to go to Church. It helps us bring it to the living Church outside. I don't know. Maybe I read the article wrong. |
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Posted: 4/14/2015 3:58:12 PM EDT
[#3]
We should bring in bands, speakers to the ceiling, lasers and light show, coffee counters as you walk in. Don't call it a sanctuary...that sounds to church like. Call it a gathering hall. No pews..to formal. How about theatre seats with padding and cup holders. Music should be songs you hear on the radio so they are hip. Need a stage so people can come down to be noticed as they pray in front of everyone so everyone can see how holy they are. And church should not be a service or mass..it should be an experience.
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Posted: 4/14/2015 4:18:31 PM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
We should bring in bands, speakers to the ceiling, lasers and light show, coffee counters as you walk in. Don't call it a sanctuary...that sounds to church like. Call it a gathering hall. No pews..to formal. How about theatre seats with padding and cup holders. Music should be songs you hear on the radio so they are hip. Need a stage so people can come down to be noticed as they pray in front of everyone so everyone can see how holy they are. And church should not be a service or mass..it should be an experience. I'm guessing, I should have my GD sarcasm meter on? 
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Posted: 4/14/2015 4:22:28 PM EDT
[#5]
A little ironic, that opinion coming from Relevant Magazine.
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Posted: 4/14/2015 4:22:39 PM EDT
[#6]
I have been known to say that the strange fire in the Bible that they brought into worship and that God killed them because of was probably praise music. I can be sarcastic. |
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Posted: 4/14/2015 4:33:20 PM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I have been known to say that the strange fire in the Bible that they brought into worship and that God killed them because of was probably praise music. I can be sarcastic.  even as a child, I remembered kneeling after the consecration & being jarred by loud "praise" music.
Hey, some like it. But give me Gregorian Chant any day of the week. While at Church, that is.
BTW- I'm known to be the smarta&&
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Posted: 4/14/2015 4:58:27 PM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryQuoted: A little ironic, that opinion coming from Relevant Magazine. |
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Posted: 4/14/2015 5:06:04 PM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I like the article. But, I'm not sure I get it. I agree we should DEFINITELY not follow trends. If what we have taught for 2000 yrs is Truth, it does not change, it is constant. I agree we each have our own paths to take to find God, but to skip mass "Just because" doesn't sit well with me. Yes, the Church is everywhere. We interact every day with it. But Mass, the Sabbath, is a Sanctuary. A time to retreat & be revived & revised. A time to sit with & be with OUR GOD. To Receive Our Lord in the Eucharist. Growing up, I hated mass. But my parents had me do what the Catholic Church required. I am indebted to them for the rest of my life. Because they gave me this constant, I have been able to have an anchor point to guide me into adulthood & parenthood. If this had constantly changed with the latest trends, I wouldn't have that. I have raised a "millennial" into adulthood. She has her ups & downs. "tried" different churches. But, continues to come back. She says, it is the Sacrifice of the mass. The Eucharist. The constant reverence. The peace, without the noise to jumble the message. I think we need to go to Church. It helps us bring it to the living Church outside. I don't know. Maybe I read the article wrong. The article is talking about what appeals to millennials. It isn't slick marketing with cool church names, big worship productions, and other "marketing". What matters is authenticity, sincerity, etc., which the author claims is why they are flocking to the traditional churches (Catholicism, Episcopalians, etc). The author seems to think she represents millennials though, so take it with a grain of salt. I agree some churches are too wrapped up in production value. There's a mega church in my area with six (soon to be seven) campuses. The main campus resembles a convention center, with a bookstore. The sanctuary is massive, with a professional stage, pro lighting, pro event cameras for instant streaming online, professional level musicians with pro sound; and I couldn't get away fast enough. |
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Posted: 4/14/2015 5:11:39 PM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
The article is talking about what appeals to millennials. It isn't slick marketing with cool church names, big worship productions, and other "marketing". What matters is authenticity, sincerity, etc., which the author claims is why they are flocking to the traditional churches (Catholicism, Episcopalians, etc). The author seems to think she represents millennials though, so take it with a grain of salt. I agree some churches are too wrapped up in production value. There's a mega church in my area with six (soon to be seven) campuses. The main campus resembles a convention center, with a bookstore. The sanctuary is massive, with a professional stage, pro lighting, pro event cameras for instant streaming online, professional level musicians with pro sound; and I couldn't get away fast enough. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
I like the article. But, I'm not sure I get it. I agree we should DEFINITELY not follow trends. If what we have taught for 2000 yrs is Truth, it does not change, it is constant. I agree we each have our own paths to take to find God, but to skip mass "Just because" doesn't sit well with me. Yes, the Church is everywhere. We interact every day with it. But Mass, the Sabbath, is a Sanctuary. A time to retreat & be revived & revised. A time to sit with & be with OUR GOD. To Receive Our Lord in the Eucharist. Growing up, I hated mass. But my parents had me do what the Catholic Church required. I am indebted to them for the rest of my life. Because they gave me this constant, I have been able to have an anchor point to guide me into adulthood & parenthood. If this had constantly changed with the latest trends, I wouldn't have that. I have raised a "millennial" into adulthood. She has her ups & downs. "tried" different churches. But, continues to come back. She says, it is the Sacrifice of the mass. The Eucharist. The constant reverence. The peace, without the noise to jumble the message. I think we need to go to Church. It helps us bring it to the living Church outside. I don't know. Maybe I read the article wrong. The article is talking about what appeals to millennials. It isn't slick marketing with cool church names, big worship productions, and other "marketing". What matters is authenticity, sincerity, etc., which the author claims is why they are flocking to the traditional churches (Catholicism, Episcopalians, etc). The author seems to think she represents millennials though, so take it with a grain of salt. I agree some churches are too wrapped up in production value. There's a mega church in my area with six (soon to be seven) campuses. The main campus resembles a convention center, with a bookstore. The sanctuary is massive, with a professional stage, pro lighting, pro event cameras for instant streaming online, professional level musicians with pro sound; and I couldn't get away fast enough. Thank you. I think, that with cradle Christians, they do want more traditional ritual. I also, believe the same for many older (in years) converts. I have a few friends that converted later in life or in college. The, in your face, marketing & fancy services don't appeal to their intellectual search of Christ. I sometimes wonder if it is the "teenage" style, that tends to turn people away. Then again, nobody likes to be told that suffering is a Grace. They want to know everything will be awesome. |
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Posted: 4/14/2015 5:26:05 PM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Pretty much. The author has gotten some flak on their FB page for the 'irony' too. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
A little ironic, that opinion coming from Relevant Magazine. 
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Posted: 4/14/2015 5:35:32 PM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryQuote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: A little ironic, that opinion coming from Relevant Magazine. http://i57.photobucket.com/albums/g213/rbwater/relevant_zpsfgirjbxv.jpg |
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Posted: 4/14/2015 5:41:38 PM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
The article is talking about what appeals to millennials. It isn't slick marketing with cool church names, big worship productions, and other "marketing". What matters is authenticity, sincerity, etc., which the author claims is why they are flocking to the traditional churches (Catholicism, Episcopalians, etc). The author seems to think she represents millennials though, so take it with a grain of salt. I agree some churches are too wrapped up in production value. There's a mega church in my area with six (soon to be seven) campuses. The main campus resembles a convention center, with a bookstore. The sanctuary is massive, with a professional stage, pro lighting, pro event cameras for instant streaming online, professional level musicians with pro sound; and I couldn't get away fast enough. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
I like the article. But, I'm not sure I get it. I agree we should DEFINITELY not follow trends. If what we have taught for 2000 yrs is Truth, it does not change, it is constant. I agree we each have our own paths to take to find God, but to skip mass "Just because" doesn't sit well with me. Yes, the Church is everywhere. We interact every day with it. But Mass, the Sabbath, is a Sanctuary. A time to retreat & be revived & revised. A time to sit with & be with OUR GOD. To Receive Our Lord in the Eucharist. Growing up, I hated mass. But my parents had me do what the Catholic Church required. I am indebted to them for the rest of my life. Because they gave me this constant, I have been able to have an anchor point to guide me into adulthood & parenthood. If this had constantly changed with the latest trends, I wouldn't have that. I have raised a "millennial" into adulthood. She has her ups & downs. "tried" different churches. But, continues to come back. She says, it is the Sacrifice of the mass. The Eucharist. The constant reverence. The peace, without the noise to jumble the message. I think we need to go to Church. It helps us bring it to the living Church outside. I don't know. Maybe I read the article wrong. The article is talking about what appeals to millennials. It isn't slick marketing with cool church names, big worship productions, and other "marketing". What matters is authenticity, sincerity, etc., which the author claims is why they are flocking to the traditional churches (Catholicism, Episcopalians, etc). The author seems to think she represents millennials though, so take it with a grain of salt. I agree some churches are too wrapped up in production value. There's a mega church in my area with six (soon to be seven) campuses. The main campus resembles a convention center, with a bookstore. The sanctuary is massive, with a professional stage, pro lighting, pro event cameras for instant streaming online, professional level musicians with pro sound; and I couldn't get away fast enough. The problem with at some traditional churchs is that their doctrine and beliefs left Christianity behind and now they are secular services with a traditional liturgy, people are fooling themselves if they think they are following Christianity at these places. I am speaking of the views of the churches...not saying the members aren't Christian because they go there. |
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Posted: 4/14/2015 5:45:45 PM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
LOL. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
A little ironic, that opinion coming from Relevant Magazine. http://i57.photobucket.com/albums/g213/rbwater/relevant_zpsfgirjbxv.jpg Do you want my hypothesis? I think she switched to the Episcopalian Church solely because of their stance on things like ordaining women and gays. And now she writes articles saying she switched because she prefers the liturgical atmosphere. |
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Posted: 4/14/2015 5:48:55 PM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Do you want my hypothesis? I think she switched to the Episcopalian Church solely because of their stance on things like ordaining women and gays. And now she writes articles saying she switched because she prefers the liturgical atmosphere. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: A little ironic, that opinion coming from Relevant Magazine. http://i57.photobucket.com/albums/g213/rbwater/relevant_zpsfgirjbxv.jpg Do you want my hypothesis? I think she switched to the Episcopalian Church solely because of their stance on things like ordaining women and gays. And now she writes articles saying she switched because she prefers the liturgical atmosphere. Probably some truth to that. Last I read, the liberal churches were hurting in membership compared to the conservative ones. |
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Posted: 4/14/2015 5:57:08 PM EDT
[#16]
Pcusa is dropping members like crazy.
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Posted: 4/14/2015 6:18:23 PM EDT
[#17]
SBC stats look like more churches but fewer members every year. So I guess we're expanding our presence but not replacing the old folks who pass on each year at the older churches.
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Posted: 4/14/2015 6:24:21 PM EDT
[#18]
Some stats: http://religions.pewforum.org/affiliations
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Posted: 4/14/2015 11:31:34 PM EDT
[#19]
Something we saved from a Greg Laurie daily devotional. Harvest Church Riverside Cal.
We get these every day in an email. If anyone speaks, let him speak as the oracles of God. If anyone ministers, let him do it as with the ability which God supplies, that in all things God may be glorified through Jesus Christ, to whom belong the glory and the dominion forever and ever. Amen. —1 Peter 4:11 We are living in a time in which some people are saying that we need to re-envision the church or reinvent the church. But I beg to differ. I think we need to rediscover the church. I don't think we need a new version of it as much as we need to get back to the original version that Jesus himself established. That is the church that changed the world. That is the church that turned its world upside down. I don't know about the church of today. It seems to me the world today is turning the church upside down. I think the answer is to get as close as we can to the original foundation and template for the church that Jesus himself established. This is God's original design for the church. My goal as a senior pastor is not to have a big church; it is to have a strong church—and even more to the point, a biblical church. Having said that, there should be church growth, and I think the best kind of growth is through the addition of new believers. A trend in a lot of churches today is to be relevant to the culture, so they are trying to do everything they can to connect. I am all for relevance. However, I do not believe in relevance at the expense of reverence. This is still the church. And when I stand up to speak, I am not there to entertain or to give my personal philosophy or political views. I am there to teach the Word of God and to call people to Jesus Christ. I think sometimes we are trying so hard to be cool that we have forgotten how to be biblical. Let's keep the integrity of our message intact. |
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Posted: 4/15/2015 12:08:34 AM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Something we saved from a Greg Laurie daily devotional. Harvest Church Riverside Cal. We get these every day in an email. If anyone speaks, let him speak as the oracles of God. If anyone ministers, let him do it as with the ability which God supplies, that in all things God may be glorified through Jesus Christ, to whom belong the glory and the dominion forever and ever. Amen. —1 Peter 4:11 We are living in a time in which some people are saying that we need to re-envision the church or reinvent the church. But I beg to differ. I think we need to rediscover the church. I don't think we need a new version of it as much as we need to get back to the original version that Jesus himself established. That is the church that changed the world. That is the church that turned its world upside down. I don't know about the church of today. It seems to me the world today is turning the church upside down. I think the answer is to get as close as we can to the original foundation and template for the church that Jesus himself established. This is God's original design for the church. My goal as a senior pastor is not to have a big church; it is to have a strong church—and even more to the point, a biblical church. Having said that, there should be church growth, and I think the best kind of growth is through the addition of new believers. A trend in a lot of churches today is to be relevant to the culture, so they are trying to do everything they can to connect. I am all for relevance. However, I do not believe in relevance at the expense of reverence. This is still the church. And when I stand up to speak, I am not there to entertain or to give my personal philosophy or political views. I am there to teach the Word of God and to call people to Jesus Christ. I think sometimes we are trying so hard to be cool that we have forgotten how to be biblical. Let's keep the integrity of our message intact. Pretty hard to say the Sacrifice of the mass isn't the Original way of the Church. At least the Catholic Church hasn't really changed much. Maybe refined. But not changed. |
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Posted: 5/26/2015 3:59:17 PM EDT
[#21]
Wants vs. Needs
Many are attracted to a certain church because they receive things they want, be it entertainment, social interaction, etc. I am a member of the RCC because I am given what I need, the Body and Blood of Christ. I dont go to mass to be entertained or see friends. I go to be humble in the face of God, reverant in rememberance of Christ's Passion and filled with sadness that His suffering was necessary because of my sins. |
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Posted: 5/26/2015 10:49:16 PM EDT
[#22]
I read the first post and almost replied. Then realized I had posted in the past....then I read further and saw a great reply I was gonna agree with.... Then sw I had posted it...
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Posted: 5/27/2015 9:43:45 AM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Wants vs. Needs Many are attracted to a certain church because they receive things they want, be it entertainment, social interaction, etc. I am a member of the RCC because I am given what I need, the Body and Blood of Christ. I dont go to mass to be entertained or see friends. I go to be humble in the face of God, reverant in rememberance of Christ's Passion and filled with sadness that His suffering was necessary because of my sins. Not to mention reminding myself how utterly unable I am to live a life like that of Christ, no matter how hard I think I try or how pious I may try to be. In all, I am a failure. So I go to Mass to beg Him to be with me, and to beg forgiveness for when I turn Him away... |
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Posted: 5/27/2015 12:12:56 PM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Wants vs. Needs Many are attracted to a certain church because they receive things they want, be it entertainment, social interaction, etc. I am a member of the RCC because I am given what I need, the Body and Blood of Christ. I dont go to mass to be entertained or see friends. I go to be humble in the face of God, reverant in rememberance of Christ's Passion and filled with sadness that His suffering was necessary because of my sins. |
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Posted: 5/27/2015 1:52:56 PM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
While that is true, I can tell you for certain that my worst church experiences have been where I felt isolated and not welcome as part of the community there. There are far too many churches that are clique oriented which shuts out new people. Also, as the article pointed out, there's a HUGE problem with way too many churches treating single 18-30 year old people as if they don't exist or as the target of "everything you like is a sin" by old fogeys and snotty cloistered 22-25 yr old straight out of college married the first person they met has 2-3 kids already types. Because of that garbage I avoided church when I needed it most and it has cost me severely. But hey, that's not your problem, right, so who cares? Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Wants vs. Needs Many are attracted to a certain church because they receive things they want, be it entertainment, social interaction, etc. I am a member of the RCC because I am given what I need, the Body and Blood of Christ. I dont go to mass to be entertained or see friends. I go to be humble in the face of God, reverant in rememberance of Christ's Passion and filled with sadness that His suffering was necessary because of my sins. So you didn't get the social interaction that you wanted? Thats pretty much what I said in the first sentence so I see which category you fall into. Isolated? Some of my favorite masses are on weekday mornings when I am almost alone. Different strokes for different folks but I rely on the church to give me what I need, not particularly what I want. Half of our problem is that we are so self centered and pretentious that we presume to know what is in our best interest, myself included. I am sorry that you felt abandoned by the church during your time of need. But I think that you must ask yourself what role you played during that time. Did your actions or expectations lead you to a dead end? If so, that is not the church's fault. Peace be with you. |
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Posted: 5/27/2015 5:47:42 PM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
While that is true, I can tell you for certain that my worst church experiences have been where I felt isolated and not welcome as part of the community there. There are far too many churches that are clique oriented which shuts out new people. Also, as the article pointed out, there's a HUGE problem with way too many churches treating single 18-30 year old people as if they don't exist or as the target of "everything you like is a sin" by old fogeys and snotty cloistered 22-25 yr old straight out of college married the first person they met has 2-3 kids already types. Because of that garbage I avoided church when I needed it most and it has cost me severely. But hey, that's not your problem, right, so who cares? Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Wants vs. Needs Many are attracted to a certain church because they receive things they want, be it entertainment, social interaction, etc. I am a member of the RCC because I am given what I need, the Body and Blood of Christ. I dont go to mass to be entertained or see friends. I go to be humble in the face of God, reverant in rememberance of Christ's Passion and filled with sadness that His suffering was necessary because of my sins. I care, and I'm sorry you ran across that. It is a sad fact that Christians all claim to strive to be like Christ, but some are more successful at it than others. Wish I could welcome you to the church I attend (notice I don't say "my" church, as its God's, not mine). I know that being alone during hard times is tough... |
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Posted: 5/29/2015 8:45:40 AM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
While that is true, I can tell you for certain that my worst church experiences have been where I felt isolated and not welcome as part of the community there. There are far too many churches that are clique oriented which shuts out new people. Also, as the article pointed out, there's a HUGE problem with way too many churches treating single 18-30 year old people as if they don't exist or as the target of "everything you like is a sin" by old fogeys and snotty cloistered 22-25 yr old straight out of college married the first person they met has 2-3 kids already types. Because of that garbage I avoided church when I needed it most and it has cost me severely. But hey, that's not your problem, right, so who cares? Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Wants vs. Needs Many are attracted to a certain church because they receive things they want, be it entertainment, social interaction, etc. I am a member of the RCC because I am given what I need, the Body and Blood of Christ. I dont go to mass to be entertained or see friends. I go to be humble in the face of God, reverant in rememberance of Christ's Passion and filled with sadness that His suffering was necessary because of my sins. Your experience is sadly a common thing in some churchs. If we Christians are to be the hands and feet of Christ then we need to serve and comfort the needy and hurting. Now, churchs are full of people who are less than perfect no matter how much they strive to be Christlike, so we do need to take that into consideration. On the other hand, we can learn from our experiences and let it transform the way we behave towards others. Now that you've experienced a negative you are prepared to act in the opposite, or positive way. You should be the guy that's greeting the visitors, along with the old members to give them an example, to make them feel comfortable and important. The person that God puts in your path may be going through something similar that you were going through when you needed help. Christ said the two greatest commands was to love God with everything and love your neighbor. Basically, we need to not dwell on the wrongs someone has committed against us, but do our best not to commit these wrongs against others. |
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Posted: 5/31/2015 1:30:45 AM EDT
[#28]
I can agree with it. I'm not Christian, and one of the things that kept me from looking into most churches was change. If every time a new social trend comes out you have to accept it and change your beliefs I find it hard to believe you have the truth. For example, homosexuality was considered wrong for almost two-thousand years but you figured out it was okay ten years ago? I'm not buying it.
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Posted: 5/31/2015 11:00:03 AM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I can agree with it. I'm not Christian, and one of the things that kept me from looking into most churches was change. If every time a new social trend comes out you have to accept it and change your beliefs I find it hard to believe you have the truth. For example, homosexuality was considered wrong for almost two-thousand years but you figured out it was okay ten years ago? I'm not buying it. The RCC has been rock-solid in its opposition to things that have become "common". It's one of the reasons it is so despised by some. There are other churches that have done similarly, to their credit. I invite you to look again. A very good number of us take the Lord's Word very seriously, and always will. 
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Posted: 5/31/2015 3:22:58 PM EDT
[#30]
Speaking of pandering to trends:
"With that complicated history looming, Pope Francis, once a chemist, will soon issue an authoritative church document laying out the moral justification for fighting global warming, especially for the world’s poorest billions." Welp, I guess AGW will actually become a real religion. Yay  |
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Posted: 5/31/2015 5:43:36 PM EDT
[#31]
The Pope needs to stay out of the Global Warming theory (in my opinion) cause he's gonna look bad when it is never proven that it is happening...in fact I thought they had changed to climate change because global warming wasn't happening.... And before someone says I'm anti pope, I'd say the same thing about ANY religious group on this subject....or Gun Control...like the UMC...or any other feel good emotional driven cause. We should protect the earth..yes...we should do what we can to keep things nice. But this is NOT REAL.
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Posted: 5/31/2015 7:46:29 PM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
The RCC has been rock-solid in its opposition to things that have become "common". It's one of the reasons it is so despised by some. There are other churches that have done similarly, to their credit. I invite you to look again. A very good number of us take the Lord's Word very seriously, and always will. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
I can agree with it. I'm not Christian, and one of the things that kept me from looking into most churches was change. If every time a new social trend comes out you have to accept it and change your beliefs I find it hard to believe you have the truth. For example, homosexuality was considered wrong for almost two-thousand years but you figured out it was okay ten years ago? I'm not buying it. The RCC has been rock-solid in its opposition to things that have become "common". It's one of the reasons it is so despised by some. There are other churches that have done similarly, to their credit. I invite you to look again. A very good number of us take the Lord's Word very seriously, and always will. I might do some reading and think on it again. I read a Theology book not too long ago and discarded the Church. The idea of me wanting to go to hell instead of my soul being destroyed due to pride seemed rather silly. I wen't through RCIA a few times before but I could never get past it. Our local one was a bunch of Social Liberals. More of a women's "I'm doing this to get married" club. |
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Posted: 5/31/2015 10:16:07 PM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I might do some reading and think on it again. I read a Theology book not too long ago and discarded the Church. The idea of me wanting to go to hell instead of my soul being destroyed due to pride seemed rather silly. Quote HistoryQuoted:
I might do some reading and think on it again. I read a Theology book not too long ago and discarded the Church. The idea of me wanting to go to hell instead of my soul being destroyed due to pride seemed rather silly. 
Uh... Wha? I wen't through RCIA a few times before but I could never get past it. Our local one was a bunch of Social Liberals. More of a women's "I'm doing this to get married" club. Like anywhere else, some folks join for the wrong reasons, or don't know what their church stands for... |
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Posted: 5/31/2015 10:17:04 PM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Speaking of pandering to trends: "With that complicated history looming, Pope Francis, once a chemist, will soon issue an authoritative church document laying out the moral justification for fighting global warming, especially for the world’s poorest billions."
Welp, I guess AGW will actually become a real religion. Yay
Last I heard, this issue was on hold due to the people shouting about what a fraud AGW is... |
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Posted: 5/31/2015 10:50:26 PM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I like the article. But, I'm not sure I get it. I agree we should DEFINITELY not follow trends. If what we have taught for 2000 yrs is Truth, it does not change, it is constant. I agree we each have our own paths to take to find God, but to skip mass "Just because" doesn't sit well with me. Yes, the Church is everywhere. We interact every day with it. But Mass, the Sabbath, is a Sanctuary. A time to retreat & be revived & revised. A time to sit with & be with OUR GOD. To Receive Our Lord in the Eucharist. Growing up, I hated mass. But my parents had me do what the Catholic Church required. I am indebted to them for the rest of my life. Because they gave me this constant, I have been able to have an anchor point to guide me into adulthood & parenthood. If this had constantly changed with the latest trends, I wouldn't have that. I have raised a "millennial" into adulthood. She has her ups & downs. "tried" different churches. But, continues to come back. She says, it is the Sacrifice of the mass. The Eucharist. The constant reverence. The peace, without the noise to jumble the message. I think we need to go to Church. It helps us bring it to the living Church outside. I don't know. Maybe I read the article wrong. OK period to be catholic is to say he didn't get his word right the first time. Also it goes against the will and word of God completely. Vain repetition in prayer, praying to Mary and the saints etc. Carimonial religion is not what Christ made. If you guys want to get caught up in legalism get caught up in actually following the word of God. |
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Posted: 6/1/2015 10:08:07 AM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Like anywhere else, some folks join for the wrong reasons, or don't know what their church stands for... Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
I wen't through RCIA a few times before but I could never get past it. Our local one was a bunch of Social Liberals. More of a women's "I'm doing this to get married" club. Like anywhere else, some folks join for the wrong reasons, or don't know what their church stands for... The very first thing I was told when I asked a priest about converting was, "You need to be very sure this is what you want for you. Not anyone else. |
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Posted: 6/1/2015 10:11:11 AM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
OK period to be catholic is to say he didn't get his word right the first time. Also it goes against the will and word of God completely. Vain repetition in prayer, praying to Mary and the saints etc. Carimonial religion is not what Christ made. If you guys want to get caught up in legalism get caught up in actually following the word of God. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
I like the article. But, I'm not sure I get it. I agree we should DEFINITELY not follow trends. If what we have taught for 2000 yrs is Truth, it does not change, it is constant. I agree we each have our own paths to take to find God, but to skip mass "Just because" doesn't sit well with me. Yes, the Church is everywhere. We interact every day with it. But Mass, the Sabbath, is a Sanctuary. A time to retreat & be revived & revised. A time to sit with & be with OUR GOD. To Receive Our Lord in the Eucharist. Growing up, I hated mass. But my parents had me do what the Catholic Church required. I am indebted to them for the rest of my life. Because they gave me this constant, I have been able to have an anchor point to guide me into adulthood & parenthood. If this had constantly changed with the latest trends, I wouldn't have that. I have raised a "millennial" into adulthood. She has her ups & downs. "tried" different churches. But, continues to come back. She says, it is the Sacrifice of the mass. The Eucharist. The constant reverence. The peace, without the noise to jumble the message. I think we need to go to Church. It helps us bring it to the living Church outside. I don't know. Maybe I read the article wrong. OK period to be catholic is to say he didn't get his word right the first time. Also it goes against the will and word of God completely. Vain repetition in prayer, praying to Mary and the saints etc. Carimonial religion is not what Christ made. If you guys want to get caught up in legalism get caught up in actually following the word of God. You forgot: Not biblical. Infant baptism doesn't count. Stole pagan holidays and customs. Cannibalism. No need for Pope or Reconciliation |
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Posted: 6/1/2015 11:39:16 AM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
A little ironic, that opinion coming from Relevant Magazine. 
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Posted: 6/1/2015 11:41:01 AM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
OK period to be catholic is to say he didn't get his word right the first time. Also it goes against the will and word of God completely. Vain repetition in prayer, praying to Mary and the saints etc. Carimonial religion is not what Christ made. If you guys want to get caught up in legalism get caught up in actually following the word of God. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
I like the article. But, I'm not sure I get it. I agree we should DEFINITELY not follow trends. If what we have taught for 2000 yrs is Truth, it does not change, it is constant. I agree we each have our own paths to take to find God, but to skip mass "Just because" doesn't sit well with me. Yes, the Church is everywhere. We interact every day with it. But Mass, the Sabbath, is a Sanctuary. A time to retreat & be revived & revised. A time to sit with & be with OUR GOD. To Receive Our Lord in the Eucharist. Growing up, I hated mass. But my parents had me do what the Catholic Church required. I am indebted to them for the rest of my life. Because they gave me this constant, I have been able to have an anchor point to guide me into adulthood & parenthood. If this had constantly changed with the latest trends, I wouldn't have that. I have raised a "millennial" into adulthood. She has her ups & downs. "tried" different churches. But, continues to come back. She says, it is the Sacrifice of the mass. The Eucharist. The constant reverence. The peace, without the noise to jumble the message. I think we need to go to Church. It helps us bring it to the living Church outside. I don't know. Maybe I read the article wrong. OK period to be catholic is to say he didn't get his word right the first time. Also it goes against the will and word of God completely. Vain repetition in prayer, praying to Mary and the saints etc. Carimonial religion is not what Christ made. If you guys want to get caught up in legalism get caught up in actually following the word of God. Think this should be a separate topic; no need to derail |
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Posted: 6/1/2015 12:30:00 PM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Speaking of pandering to trends: "With that complicated history looming, Pope Francis, once a chemist, will soon issue an authoritative church document laying out the moral justification for fighting global warming, especially for the world’s poorest billions." Welp, I guess AGW will actually become a real religion. Yay Last I heard, this issue was on hold due to the people shouting about what a fraud AGW is... |
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Posted: 6/1/2015 1:14:51 PM EDT
[#41]
Quote HistoryQuoted: OK period to be catholic is to say he didn't get his word right the first time. Also it goes against the will and word of God completely. Vain repetition in prayer, praying to Mary and the saints etc. Carimonial religion is not what Christ made. If you guys want to get caught up in legalism get caught up in actually following the word of God. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: I like the article. But, I'm not sure I get it. I agree we should DEFINITELY not follow trends. If what we have taught for 2000 yrs is Truth, it does not change, it is constant. I agree we each have our own paths to take to find God, but to skip mass "Just because" doesn't sit well with me. Yes, the Church is everywhere. We interact every day with it. But Mass, the Sabbath, is a Sanctuary. A time to retreat & be revived & revised. A time to sit with & be with OUR GOD. To Receive Our Lord in the Eucharist. Growing up, I hated mass. But my parents had me do what the Catholic Church required. I am indebted to them for the rest of my life. Because they gave me this constant, I have been able to have an anchor point to guide me into adulthood & parenthood. If this had constantly changed with the latest trends, I wouldn't have that. I have raised a "millennial" into adulthood. She has her ups & downs. "tried" different churches. But, continues to come back. She says, it is the Sacrifice of the mass. The Eucharist. The constant reverence. The peace, without the noise to jumble the message. I think we need to go to Church. It helps us bring it to the living Church outside. I don't know. Maybe I read the article wrong. OK period to be catholic is to say he didn't get his word right the first time. Also it goes against the will and word of God completely. Vain repetition in prayer, praying to Mary and the saints etc. Carimonial religion is not what Christ made. If you guys want to get caught up in legalism get caught up in actually following the word of God. |
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Posted: 6/1/2015 2:12:37 PM EDT
[#42]
I'm not Catholic but I will address the repetition in prayer...God set a litergy of worship in the old testament. He let the people know what was acceptable in worship. I think you will see MUCH more repetition in worship when you look at what God laid down as the standard than what .an has added. I'm not saying worship never changed in the new testament , just that you can't claim that because worship and prayers are repetitive they are wrong.
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Posted: 6/1/2015 3:37:37 PM EDT
[#43]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Last I heard, this issue was on hold due to the people shouting about what a fraud AGW is... Apparently not. The issue of course is, why now? If the Pope is God's voice on earth, and AGW is a fact, then why has their not been a previous proclamation? Why wait until now, when the pews are becoming more empty and AGW is settled science in the minds of brainwashed millennials? If it is a fraud, then why consider it at all? It reeks of politics. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Speaking of pandering to trends: "With that complicated history looming, Pope Francis, once a chemist, will soon issue an authoritative church document laying out the moral justification for fighting global warming, especially for the world’s poorest billions." Welp, I guess AGW will actually become a real religion. Yay
Last I heard, this issue was on hold due to the people shouting about what a fraud AGW is... Apparently not. The issue of course is, why now? If the Pope is God's voice on earth, and AGW is a fact, then why has their not been a previous proclamation? Why wait until now, when the pews are becoming more empty and AGW is settled science in the minds of brainwashed millennials? If it is a fraud, then why consider it at all? It reeks of politics. Our Pope is not God's voice on Earth. I don't know where you came up with that. The Pope is the head of our Church and the person entrusted to care for the Church. The Pope is also the Bishop of Rome. |
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Posted: 6/1/2015 5:43:28 PM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Our Pope is not God's voice on Earth. I don't know where you came up with that. The Pope is the head of our Church and the person entrusted to care for the Church. The Pope is also the Bishop of Rome. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Speaking of pandering to trends: "With that complicated history looming, Pope Francis, once a chemist, will soon issue an authoritative church document laying out the moral justification for fighting global warming, especially for the world’s poorest billions." Welp, I guess AGW will actually become a real religion. Yay Last I heard, this issue was on hold due to the people shouting about what a fraud AGW is... Apparently not. The issue of course is, why now? If the Pope is God's voice on earth, and AGW is a fact, then why has their not been a previous proclamation? Why wait until now, when the pews are becoming more empty and AGW is settled science in the minds of brainwashed millennials? If it is a fraud, then why consider it at all? It reeks of politics. Our Pope is not God's voice on Earth. I don't know where you came up with that. The Pope is the head of our Church and the person entrusted to care for the Church. The Pope is also the Bishop of Rome. You might want to check with the Catholic Church's history on that. The New York Catholic Catechism, under: Pope, says, "The Pope takes the place of Jesus Christ on earth...by divine right the pope has supreme and full power in faith and morals over each and every pastor and his flock. He is the true Vicar of Christ, the head of the entire church, the father and teacher of all Christians He is the infallible ruler, the founder of dogmas, the author of and the judge of councils; the universal ruler of truth, the arbiter of the world, the supreme judge of heaven and earth, the judge of all, being judged by one, God himself on earth." In his encyclical, "The Reunion of Christendom" (1885), Pope Leo XIII stated that the pope holds "upon this earth the place of God Almighty." The Council of Trent declared: "Sitting in that chair in which Peter, the Prince of the Apostles, sat to the close of life, the Catholic Church recognizes in his person the most exalted degree of dignity, and the full jurisdiction not based on constitutions, but emanating from no less authority than from God Himself. As the Successor of St. Peter and the true and legitimate Vicar of Jesus Christ, he therefore, presides over the Universal Church, the Father and Governor of all the faithful, of Bishops, also and of all other prelates, be their station, rant, or power, what they may be." The Catholic book, "My Catholic Faith" which is based on the Baltimore Catechism, on page 251, says, "The Pope can make and unmake laws for the entire Church; his authority is supreme and unquestioned. Every bishop, every priest, every member of the Church is subject to him." Not to mention they hold the keys to salvation apparently. |
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Posted: 6/1/2015 6:39:31 PM EDT
[#45]
When the Pope speaks it is not God's word. If he speaks of political things that is his opinion. He is capable of making errors just like any other man.
The Infallibility of the Pope refers to when the Pope defines a matter of Doctrine. In these matters he is guided by the Holy Spirit and protected from error. In history, the Pope has only done this on a couple occasions. Yes, the Pope is the Vicar of Christ. He takes Jesus' place on earth as the leader of the Church. Jesus gave his Church to Peter to care for because He knew He would be put to death. Pope Francis is a successor of Peter. He is not the knew Jesus. We do not worship the Pope. We treat him with honor as the head of our Church. If the Pope wants to accept or deny global climate change that is his opinion. He is not going to make a doctrine about it. In political areas it is not uncommon for the Pope to use his influence in political matters. |
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Posted: 6/1/2015 8:40:40 PM EDT
[#46]
Quote HistoryQuoted: When the Pope speaks it is not God's word. If he speaks of political things that is his opinion. He is capable of making errors just like any other man. The Infallibility of the Pope refers to when the Pope defines a matter of Doctrine. In these matters he is guided by the Holy Spirit and protected from error. In history, the Pope has only done this on a couple occasions. Yes, the Pope is the Vicar of Christ. He takes Jesus' place on earth as the leader of the Church. Jesus gave his Church to Peter to care for because He knew He would be put to death. Pope Francis is a successor of Peter. He is not the knew Jesus. We do not worship the Pope. We treat him with honor as the head of our Church. If the Pope wants to accept or deny global climate change that is his opinion. He is not going to make a doctrine about it. In political areas it is not uncommon for the Pope to use his influence in political matters. Oh popes have traditionally abused their influence in political matters. And if you actually pay attention to what is being said by past popes (instead of the most current truth) then they every much see themselves as they are quoted as saying. The problem is that they have contradicted each other, and the apostle Peter. BTW are you familiar with Cornelius and the apostle Peter in Acts 10:25-26? Where Cornelius knelt before Peter? See, most Bibles translate what he as "worship"; however, the Greek word is proskyneo, which actually means: to kiss the hand to (towards) one, in token of reverence among the Orientals, esp. the Persians, to fall upon the knees and touch the ground with the forehead as an expression of profound reverence in the NT by kneeling or prostration to do homage (to one) or make obeisance, whether in order to express respect or to make supplication
This is from two Greek words, pros and kyon, "meaning to kiss, like a dog licking his master's hand." And Peter rebuked Cornelius, saying, "Rise up! I am also a man!" Well, what are these men doing? They are contradicting Peter, a real apostle, who apparently was wrong:   [/span]  [/span]  [span] [/span] |
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Posted: 6/1/2015 10:01:52 PM EDT
[#47]
You are very far off base and I'm not even going to respond to you accusations.
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Posted: 6/1/2015 10:41:07 PM EDT
[#48]
I gotta go with m-1975 on this one...if he is wrong please let us know why. I don't see bowing to anyone but Christ as biblical. Prove me wrong.
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Posted: 6/2/2015 1:41:03 AM EDT
[#49]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I gotta go with m-1975 on this one...if he is wrong please let us know why. I don't see bowing to anyone but Christ as biblical. Prove me wrong. Me too, and not a man conceived image of Christ! |
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Posted: 6/2/2015 8:35:16 AM EDT
[#50]
I'm not explaining anything. It has been brought up many times here and your accusations are insulting. You have been brainwashed by your churches about what Catholics do and what we believe. You have been lied to by your own churches. The truth has been told but the same old fallacies are brought up time and time again. It was my fault that I took the bait. It doesn't matter what anyone tells you, you will believe what you want to believe.
I find it very interesting that non-Catholic churches must constantly be informing their congregations about their perceived evils of the Catholic Church. At Mass we are too busy worshipping Christ to speak of other religions. Maybe if your churches focused more on Christ you wouldn't spout such vile things of others. |
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