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Posted: 3/14/2017 9:52:36 AM EDT
[Last Edit: DeathMetal]
Looking to put together a 100 yard 1/2 MOA .223 rifle for under $1000 and was wondering if it is even possible.
If so what are your suggestions? Would like to stick with .223 as I have access to some great reloaders in the area that are very good with that cartridge. |
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Are you talking about just rifle or rifle/scope/rings/base for $1000
I've always like Remington 700's. I had one of their old Police rifles from the late 90's and my .308 would routinely do 5 shot .50 groups almost effortlessly. My best was around .35" If you want a complete package, you could do the shorter barrel version. I would be surprised if this rifle didn't give you .50" groups with proper match ammo. https://www.remington.com/rifles/bolt-action/model-700/model-700-sps-tactical 20" .223 is $600 at Bud's Gun Shop. $400 left for scope/rings/mount. SWFA 10x42 scope for $300...you can pick any of 3 versions (moa/mil/reticle type) Then $100 for rings and base. SWFA low rings $40 (I'm almost positive low rings will work on a 700 and 42mm objective) https://swfa.com/swfa-ss-tac-30mm-1-quot-rings.html?___SID=U Then just a standard picatinny base, 1 or 2 piece. I like Leupold Mk4 ($50ish) If you want to spend $1000 just on a gun, you can just get a heavy barrel 26" Police. https://www.budsgunshop.com/catalog/product_info.php/cPath/2084_36_57_981/products_id/95714/Remington+700+Police+223REM+26+HB That's similar to what I had. |
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I was able to accomplish this by building an AR with cheap parts and a decent 18" barrel, rock river 2 stage trigger (lightly polished), and a vortex crossfire ii 6-18 that was on sale on Amazon, still well under the $1,000.00 range and was able to shoot a five round group 1/2 moa at 100 yards (I know it's not a 10 round group), but for me and my tight budget I'm totally satisfied, however, I may have gotten lucky with the barrel shooting as well as it does...
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I'm assuming he's wanting to do a bolt action since it's in this section.
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I have seen factory rifles in 223 that will shoot consistent 1/2 MOA at 100yds with factory match ammo at 100yds for 5 shots, but I think that level of accuracy isnt going to be something each rifle off the line will produce. Quality heavy BBL ARs and many bolt action varmint rifles will shoot sub 1 MOA, some consistently will do 3/4 MOA. To get consistent 1/2 MOA even at 100yds would require a good shooter, a very good rifle, and excellent match grade ammo that will work with the twist rate in your rifle.
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I've always had good luck with the 1990's era Remington 700 Varmint Synthetic. Good base action for a future build, as well.
Here is an example at the link, local prices are usually better than GB. All my GAP rifles started out as 700 VS's and shot well in factory form. What sucks is the .223 has a 1-12" twist. The newer 700 LTR has a 1-9", which really should be 1-7 or 1-7.7" twist. Just depends what bullet range you want to shoot. I went with 1-9 on my .22-250 for 60-75 grain bullets. 700 VS .223 |
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Goldie, did you say Wing Attack Plan R?
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My two cents.... Anything bolt action will be tough to do with an optic at that price point. If your will to do an AR I built a 7 twist 20" AR for right at 650.. now squeezing any decent optic and mount in there with the remaining balance will be tough.
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I don't really think there's a problem, without optics. The catch is that there's no way to know until you shoot it. Certain models and brands are more likely than others. The Tikka T3's, Savages with 5R rifling, some of the Remingtons... I'm sure there are others that are often that good at under $1k base price. But not ALL of them. The ratio varies, lately it seems like we hear about a lot of the Tikkas and Savages being quite accurate out of the box and the Remingtons in this price range needing some help.
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Originally Posted By YoteSlayer69:
My two cents.... Anything bolt action will be tough to do with an optic at that price point. If your will to do an AR I built a 7 twist 20" AR for right at 650.. now squeezing any decent optic and mount in there with the remaining balance will be tough. View Quote |
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If you have the time, this guy does a pretty good video series trying to get 1000 yards for $500; doesn't succeed but has very good points and it exposes some decent ideas to consider. I know 1000 yrds vs 1/2 MOA are two different animals.. still...
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Originally Posted By Remyrw:
I don't really think there's a problem, without optics. The catch is that there's no way to know until you shoot it. Certain models and brands are more likely than others. The Tikka T3's, Savages with 5R rifling, some of the Remingtons... I'm sure there are others that are often that good at under $1k base price. But not ALL of them. The ratio varies, lately it seems like we hear about a lot of the Tikkas and Savages being quite accurate out of the box and the Remingtons in this price range needing some help. View Quote My .02 |
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Search on YouTube for "1000 yard $1000 dollar rifle"
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Well you sure as hell don't want a 7 twist barrel for 100yds and 1/2 moa.
You will want a very slow twist like a 14 twist and shoot 50-55gr flat based bullets. With a $1k budget and 1/2moa requirement you will need all the help you can get, the 14twist will help toward getting smaller groups. If couse one mans 1/2moa is another mans 1moa. |
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MOA ALL DAY- 169 Arfcom rifles confirmed
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Originally Posted By popnfresh:
Well you sure as hell don't want a 7 twist barrel for 100yds and 1/2 moa. You will want a very slow twist like a 14 twist and shoot 50-55gr flat based bullets. With a $1k budget and 1/2moa requirement you will need all the help you can get, the 14twist will help toward getting smaller groups. If couse one mans 1/2moa is another mans 1moa. View Quote There are many factory rifles on the market that are capable of 3/4ish MOA, and very few 1/2 MOA. You are probably gonna pay to get half MOA, unless you get lucky. Flat based bullets are more accurate by design than boattail bullets, because it is easier to make a more precise flat base than boattail, and that's the last thing that touches your barrel. |
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1 MOA All Day member
NRA Patron Life Member |
What is your goal? Type of shooting? Benchrest? Informal target shooting at 100 yards? 1/2 MOA with 223 is more about reading the wind than the rifle. A 55 grain bullet will move .2" with a 5MPH gust.
There is no guarantee when purchasing a factory rifle what you are getting. For instance- I have a Remington 700 VS that I picked up in the 90's and have shot many sub 1/2MOA groups with it. Friend #1 picked up a Remington 5r Milspec in 223 1:9 twist in 2013 and we could not get that gun to shoot under 1MOA with a variety of loads and bullet choices. He ended up having it blueprinted, bedded, and putting a Bartlein barrel on it, and the gun will shoot .3's now. Friend #2 picked up a Remington 783, 1:9 22" barrel, last year for under $300. The gun shoots really amazing for what it is,, typical groups are in the .5's at 100 yards using 55-70 grain bullets. It loves the new Nosler 70 RDF. I have seen some Savages shoot amazing out of the box and others that had to go back to the factory. The issue is that unless you buy a rifle that has a 1/2MOA guarantee, the factory does not have to do anything for you if it doesn't. My recommendation- 1. Tikka T3 Varminter. It is probably the closest to a 1/2 MOA out of the box gun that you can buy. 2. Purchase a Remington 700 223 action, install a Remage style barrel and a good trigger on it, then put it in a good stock. That will put you around $1K without glass. 3. Take your chances with a factory Savage. The odds are in your favor but no guarantees. |
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Originally Posted By sigman68:
What is your goal? Type of shooting? Benchrest? Informal target shooting at 100 yards? 1/2 MOA with 223 is more about reading the wind than the rifle. A 55 grain bullet will move .2" with a 5MPH gust. There is no guarantee when purchasing a factory rifle what you are getting. My recommendation- 1. Tikka T3 Varminter. It is probably the closest to a 1/2 MOA out of the box gun that you can buy. 2. Purchase a Remington 700 223 action, install a Remage style barrel and a good trigger on it, then put it in a good stock. That will put you around $1K without glass. 3. Take your chances with a factory Savage. The odds are in your favor but no guarantees. View Quote Trying to keep the whole package under $1K so the T3 would be out. Savage model 10 with a SWFA SS? |
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Originally Posted By DeathMetal:
I plan on using it benchrest to no more than 400 yards Trying to keep the whole package under $1K so the T3 would be out. Savage model 10 with a SWFA SS? View Quote |
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MOA ALL DAY- 169 Arfcom rifles confirmed
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Nickname: Doc. Came with wild hair and a DeLorean
OH, USA
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An honestly consistent 0.5 MOA rifle + optic at 400 yards is a pretty tall order. You'll probably have to tune the reloads to the rifle pretty specifically.
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"We're all new here, kid. The old ones are either dead or in the hospital. What the hell did you expect, a two week pass to Paris? Get in line and do what you're told, or you'll be dead before sunup."
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If you got a deal on a used savage or remington heavy barreled rifle in a decent stock (say an HS Precision or Mcmillan) and then found a budget scope like an SWFA it might be possible to get something that shoots 1/2" groups with the right handload under the right conditions.
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My Savage 10T on sale, then a Vortex 6.5-20 (non PST), plus harris bipod came in right about $1k a few years back. I haven't priced it recently so I don't know if that's still possible. Mine is 308 and a 1/2moa rifle on occasion, a consistent .75-1 if conditions are suitable for the ammo. By that I mean the rifle really likes those handloads between 60 and 80 degrees and moderate humidity. Colder or hotter, or really dry or really humid and the groups seem to grow no matter how well I feel I'm shooting. Not a huge difference, but I've got quite a few rounds through the rifle and seeing groups crop above 1moa most of the time rather than once in a while is significant for me. The load uses IMR 4064, which isn't super sensitive so I'm guessing it's a combination of factors not just a velocity change. Hell, for all I know it's a slight difference in how I settle behind the rifle outside that range. *shrug* My best group was early on with the rifle and .38 moa at 200 for five rounds. Even better from my perspective, they were exactly where I'd intended them to go. You wouldn't believe the number of rounds I fired over the next few weeks trying to get that small a group again. Well, nm, in this area of the forums you probably would.
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going with NO for $500 Alex.
Everyone i seen swear by their Rem 700 or Savage to shoot sub MOA has never been able to duplicate it at the range when I am there. Best Rem 700 I have seen was around 2 MOA at 600 yards and it was customized rifle and he used handloads. |
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Originally Posted By RocketmanOU:
An honestly consistent 0.5 MOA rifle + optic at 400 yards is a pretty tall order. You'll probably have to tune the reloads to the rifle pretty specifically. View Quote 85% of the rifles that shoot MOA at 100 don't at 400~600. |
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Originally Posted By DeathMetal:
Looking to put together a 100 yard 1/2 MOA View Quote I have a M40 that will consistently do one 0.35", two 0.45-0.50" and one 0.6x" inch groups from a box of 20 rounds. I consider this a 1.0 MoA rifle because I am highly confident that if there is something 1.0 MoA away from what needs to be hit, that something will be missed. |
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I have a Tikka T3 Lite in .223 with the 1/8 twist that is probably close to 1/2 MOA. I run 77gr in it, but it likes the single-feed-only 75gr Amax even better. It has a 3-9x Leupold Mark AR scope on it, and an EGW 20MOA base. This is pretty much a $1000 package that is ready for the field. The quality of the rifle is 10x better than anything Remington or Savage have kicked out in the last 20 years.
If you're just bench shooting, then substitute an SWFA 12x or 16x scope instead. |
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