When you say tomato paste can, I'll assume it's a #10 that is 6 3/16" x 7"... at 700... So go MOA all day that -06 or I call bullshit.

You're new and that a lot of talk there partner. Shoot the MOA challenge or shut it.

Wow your all that is man. 06 and tomato cans you cant make that shit up lmao.

Here you go... http://www.ar15.com/forums/t_16_17/4880__Official_ARFCOM_1_MOA_ALL_DAY_LONG__Challenge_Discussion_Thread.html

Let's see what your ought 6 will do.  

I believe the preferred nomenclature is "odd six."

I that second call of BS.

Some #'s off JBM

30-06----178grn ELD X with a BC of .552 @ 2880fps 24" barrel altitude 2000ft

1300 yards-----1119 fps--------495 ft lbs------note that the 30-06 goes subsonic at 1300 yards
1400 yards-----subsonic N/A-----------

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6.5 creedmoor----- 22" Krieger(mine),  factory hornady 143 grn ELD X @ 2680 fps with a BC of .623 altitude 2000 ft

1300 yards------1194 fps--------453 ft lbs-------note that the 30-06 only makes 40 ft lbs more energy at this range, -----------------------------------------------------how ever does one handle all that extra power?????

1400 yards------1109 fps--------391 ft lbs-------note that the 6.5 CM out ranges the 30-06 by 100 yards with a 2"--------------------------------------------------------shorter barrel, less poweder, and a longer barrel life

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But if you want more power then why go 30-06 when a 300WM is just one step bigger??????

300 Win Mag-----24" barrel(mine), 230 grn VLD @ 2750 fps 2000 ft altitude

1300 yards-------1443 fps--------1063 ft lbs--------------------------------------------------------------------------

1700 yards-------1126 fps--------648 ft lbs--------note it absolutely towers over 30-06 yet is only one step up-------------------------------------------------------------in cartridge also size caliber is sonic out to 1700 yards


30-06 is NOT the be all end all long range caliber nor is any other caliber. Different calibers appeal to different people for different reasons. Anyone choosing a long range caliber should do some due diligence reseaching calibers and pick what suits them and their goals best and should do so leaving ego a side. Getting into long range shooting can be outrageously expensive with the cost of the rifle/optic/mount and other items new shooters don't initially realize they need such as a Kestrel ($650), reloading supplies, a chronograph, a spoting scope and the costs add up fast. Add to that a rangefinger (sig kilo $500) or if you either require the ability to range tomato paste cans at 800 yards, or you require ranging at beyond 800 yards on non reflective targets/1, 200  yards on reflective targets (ie you have a 300 Win mag or bigger) you will want to step up to milspec rangefinder (vectronix PLRF25 $8, 700). There is no majic bullet that makes you so cool that everyone on the internet runs for cover with tall tales of tomato paste cans at 800 yards. Don't let ego steer your caliber selection like the joker with the 30-06 or the costs will kill you.

I misspelled ought, it is aught.  

You have no idea what you're talking about.  

I just took a quick inventory-

He's either mostly wrong or completely wrong on every statement he made.  

But then I've got a friend who loves to talk about how he simply popped the bullets out of his .30-40 Krag and replaced them with some good 220gr to take deer at 1200 yards.  He even believes his own crap.

Reading this thread has been a roller coaster of excitement and depression over my decision to buy a 6.5 Creedmoor barrel for my AI AE MkIII.  

Still not sure what to make of barrel life. I hear low estimates of 2000 rounds and high estimates of 4000 rounds. I will be really stocked when I can find 143 grain ELD-X bullets.



Not meaning to sound rude but what does this even mean? Stopped the treat? Did you mean to say threat? Who is threatening you 1200 yards away while you are target shooting?

Pushing reloads hard and trying to keep .5 MOA, you might be at that low estimate. Keep factory pressure and 1 MOA, and you'll be much higher up. Also the way you treat a barrel will affect the life some.

I wouldn't worry about barrel life too much with the Creedmoor. It's not super overbore like a 6.5 Win Mag or 6.5-300.

 
They just announced the 2017 line up.  There will be a 147 ELD M


 

The 140 ELDM hs a higher BC than the ELDx.  No reason to shoot the X unless you're hunting.

I do hunt a bit and I only wanted one round that's why I went with the ELD-X ammo. I have thirteen boxes of it. When I shoot that up if it is accurate I was hoping to duplicate the Hornady factory load if possible. The ELD-X don't cost that much more than the ELD-M bullets.

Does anyone know what type of powder Hornady uses in their factory 6.5 CM ammo? I would guess H4350 but I dont know for sure. I'm hoping it is as that tends to be very temperature stable and I shoot in a wide range of temperatures.

Chronograph the Hornady before you burn it all up. That's usually my first step in duplicating factory loads.

 
Likely non canister grade.

Saw that 6mm Creedmoor is going to be a option as well from hornady

I can get H4350 so that will work.

To you guys promoting next year's bullets, I'm still waiting to try last year's bullets here in Canada! Our supply chain is a bit slow. They have to bring them down the Ho Chi Minh trail or something.

I talked to a guy at the range that's an avid shooter and reloaded for many years. He swears Hornady is using RL-17. He pulled the ELD bullets and compared it to RL-17 and said they look identical. Am having great success with RL-17. Using 42.0 grains with 140 ELD-M. Am still doing load development with H4350 but so far RL-17 is my choice of powder until proven otherwise.

Do you think RL-17 is less temperature sensitive than RL-15?

Or should I say, significantly less sensitive, because it wouldn't take much to just be less sensitive.

Hornady promotes the temperature stability of their ELD-X and ELD-M ammo so they must use something good.

Ok. Explain?

RL17 is very temp sensitive the hornady ammo isn't.  Most commercial ammo is not the same powders you buy on the shelf.

 
For the same reason GM makes the Impala. Not everyone needs or wants a Corvette.

Can you say what the present powder is similar to? Superformance?

I added a poll for fun.  I'm not sure I got all of the "standard/magnum" examples right, but you get the gist.

First to vote!

I went with 6.5, specifiy the Creedmoor for long range shooting and hunting up to deer sized game.

Long Range Hunting for tougher/ bigger game will be my 7mm Rem Mag.

I didn't vote.  I am shooting 308 right now, but want to re-barrel to 260 Rem.

Any reason for 260 over the other 6.5's?  

Yes, for probably a dumb reason.  I have a 308 tri-way trimmer.  It works for all 308 based cartridges, 243, 260, 7mm-08, so I have a powered trimmer that will work for 260 Rem and not for other 6.5 cartridges.  

I believe 260 can be loaded a little hotter than 6.5CM too.  One last reason, which may be moot, Lapua offers 260 brass and doesn't offer 6.5CM right now, but that is changing.

ETA: one more dumb reason.  I have 1000's of large rifle primers and not too many small rifle primers.

 
Fair enough.  I've a a 260 and a 6.5x47.  I'm going to be adding a Saum to the stable too.  The 260 is going to become something else once the barrel is toast in it.    I prefer the x47 even though it is quite a bit slower than the 260

This. I take it to 900 regularly, that being said I wouldn't mind adding a 6.5.

Shit ya can do that with 223.

6.5 SAUM gets my vote, its a bamf.

I bet it is.  It's a bit of a barrel burner though, isn't it?

not loaded to medium pressures with H1000.  It's not a good PRS cartridge though, more recoil, less rounds in the magazine.

Initial estimates from George were 2500, and with a sane firing schedule thats turning out to be conservative.

With H1000 (and it seems like IMR 7977 too) and 61/63 gr under a 130/140 it stays in the 55-58k range.

I only have 40 rounds through mine so far with a mild break in load of 60 gr H1000 over a 130 VLD @ 2.850 COAL.

The 6.5 SAUM thread on both new/old 'Hides has quite a few reports at 2000+ rds.

I personally consider a barrel burner to be less than 1000 rds but to each his own.

Here are a couple old pics from Pat Sinclair who IIRC had the #2 rifle in 6.5 SAUM.

That's freakin' cool.

Excuse my ignorance, but would there be any reason not to seriously consider a 7mm-08?  With a high BC bullet like the 162gr ELD, there is only about an inch more drop than a 6.5cm out to 1200 yards and the 7mm has less wind drift.  More energy on target with the 7mm-08 also, though I guess that's not really a concern on steel.

I use a 7-08 for hunting. Love the round and it's very effective.

You could consider it, and there aren't a lot of downsides.

It's not as good of a gaming round because of recoil, seating to mag length may be a bit of an issue, but i have no idea without looking at the bullet measurements.

I'm not a big fan of 20 degree shoulders rounds but thats nitpicky. 

Why is that?  Is it a performance/efficiency thing or just personal preference?

efficiency and just an outdated case design, but like I said nitpicky. 


There is a 7 creedmor wildcat.

So the 260 is nominally 50 fps faster than the 6.5 CM, but needs more powder than than just the ratio of the velocity increase, right?

Yeah somewhere around there more of less.  My 260 has always run fast.  My 140 load does 2925 which a lot of people would say is too hot, but i have no pressure signs and my brass is lasting.  That load I was using 42.8 of 4451 or 42.9 of 4350.  260 and 6.5 creed more are really close so that powder ratio isn't really out of whack.

Drop really isn't something I worry about with all the modern ballistics tools.  My primary rifle is a 6.5x47 which I run a 140 at 2780, and that performance works for me.

6.5 saum for instance is using about 60 grains of powder and only running a 140 around 3050, but there ar reasons for that.

New "What the pros use" article

http://precisionrifleblog.com/2017/02/16/long-range-calibers-cartridges-what-the-pros-use/

While that may be what the top 100 guys use it is not totally representative of what's in a brass pile at a typical prs match.   You'll see more 6 and 6.5 creedmoor than anything.