Warning

 

Close

Confirm Action

Are you sure you wish to do this?

Confirm Cancel
BCM
User Panel

Posted: 8/9/2017 11:50:22 AM EDT
Federal 223 new brass at Brownells for that price is that a good brass to reload or not I'm still learning. Thank you very much.
Link Posted: 8/9/2017 12:21:03 PM EDT
[Last Edit: popnfresh] [#1]
If it's for precision work I would (and do) just get Lapua. 
Lapua is consistent and requires no prep work, no sorting, it is concentric and uniform.


It is on sale now at Brownells for $55/100. Well worth the extra 15cents per

If you have some other things to get they have a code for $15 off $150 " H7M"
Link Posted: 8/9/2017 1:13:52 PM EDT
[#2]
Federal .223 brass has a reputation for being totally junk for reloading. Their pistol brass is respected; however, not their rifle brass.
One thing that it is good for is scrap.
Link Posted: 8/9/2017 1:27:57 PM EDT
[#3]
Thanks I didn't know you get that good of a brass for that price I think that's what I'm going to get me some. Thanks a lot
Link Posted: 8/9/2017 1:30:00 PM EDT
[#4]
Federal rifle brass is soft, needs lighter loads if you want it to last and is usually only good for one or two reloads. Many people refuse to reload it. I like prefer Federal brass and CCI/Blazer brands for my pistols.

Once fired U.S. government surplus 5.56mm brass is very good and can be purchased for around .07 cents a piece if you shop around. $70.00 per thousand is common if you are a patient shopper. You will have to remove the primer crimp which only has to be done once and that guarantees the brass was indeed once fired. I use Dillon's Super Swage and it's fast and easy. Some people cut the crimp out, very little metal needs to be removed to make way for the new primer.

Lake City surplus 5.56mm brass is some of the best available IMO. It has good case capacity, holds up well after repeated firings and is capable of excellent accuracy.

Like Popnfresh stated, Lapua brass is the best on the market and if you compete at longer range targets (at least 600 yards) buying some of it for dedicated competition rounds isn't a bad idea. I happen to like Winchester brass in .223, but large quantities from the same lot are hard to come by nowadays. There was a time when you could buy 4450 cases in a bulk box for $450.00 new, but I'm dating myself, those days are gone. I haven't seen these large bulk cases of brass for sale in probably close to twenty years. You could also perform bench rest tweaking on some Lake City for your dedicated 600+ loads and save money.
Link Posted: 8/9/2017 1:41:34 PM EDT
[#5]
Thank you very much this is all very good information. The Lupa brass if you're only shooting it out of a out of one gun same II are automatic with a 1:7 twist how many reloads could you get out of it if you only neck size it
Link Posted: 8/9/2017 2:19:52 PM EDT
[Last Edit: popnfresh] [#6]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By ldw263:
Thank you very much this is all very good information. The Lupa brass if you're only shooting it out of a out of one gun same II are automatic with a 1:7 twist how many reloads could you get out of it if you only neck size it
View Quote
I use Lapua for my Grendel and .223 ARs.
The .223 I use a Forster neck bushing bump die, never size the body. I am on 7x firings. On my Grendel I have to use a full length bushing die(fewer choices) and  I  am on 6x firings. No lost cases. 
These are 99% single feed loads, I  only bump the shoulder back about .001". I go for .002" neck tension.

Depending on how far the case stretches from the first firing a later sizing, I would guess you can get 8-10 firings maybe more. Hard to say. 

If you want to neck size and want to go for a specific neck tension then Lapua is about your only option(Norma cost more than Lapua)......unless you want to turn necks.
Link Posted: 8/9/2017 3:18:23 PM EDT
[#7]
One thing I've seen happen frequently with Lapua brass is that Lapua AMMO can often be purchased for less than the cost of buying the brass and loading it the first time. Sometimes less than the then-current price of the brass alone.

Just a heads up . . . so you might take a look around and compare. Even if the ammo doesn't happen to use the same bullet you plan on, you'll get the first fire-forming use out of the way for cheap. That often turns out to be useful.
Link Posted: 8/9/2017 3:57:36 PM EDT
[#8]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By borderpatrol:
Federal rifle brass is soft, needs lighter loads if you want it to last and is usually only good for one or two reloads. Many people refuse to reload it.
View Quote
The "soft brass" Federal is from many years ago and easy to identify by the large-font FC headstamp.

Anything with the smaller font, or anything with the NATO proof, or anything with a 2-digit year along with the FC stamp is perfectly good for multiple loads.  The FC brass with the NATO proof mark is essentially Lake City brass.
Link Posted: 8/9/2017 4:22:25 PM EDT
[Last Edit: lazyengineer] [#9]
In general Federal brass is considered to be one of the lower quality offerings, and few people would recommend it as a first choice for reloading.  Further, you can purchase completely loaded ammunition for that price.  Some people say FC brass has gotten better, that hasn't been my experience.  Still Junk

Best deal going, is the Norma TAC 55gr ammo being sold at Brownells right now.  Wait for the right code, and you can get it for about 28 cents a shot delivered.  That's one Hell of a deal for what many consider match-quality ammo. The new brass casing alone are selling for about 60 cents, so I'm not sure how they are able to do this.   Fire-form that to your chamber with some highly accurate commercial ammo, and you'll be left with near-Lapua quality brass - for one Hell of a deal.

Regarding your original question - no, I'd pass on buying that new Federal brass at pretty much any price.
Link Posted: 8/9/2017 9:03:59 PM EDT
[#10]
Thanks again I'll keep my eye out for that ammo that you're talking about I'll make a note start keep my check at Brownells. I'm starting out with some IMI first time brass shot by me for my first three loads that were loaded with 62 grain steel penetrator tips. I also have some GGG Lithuanian 62 grain with new brass.
Link Posted: 8/9/2017 9:11:19 PM EDT
[#11]
I found some at LAX ammunition will be $0.29 around shipped to me have to buy 1600 rounds I think I'm going to pull the trigger.
Link Posted: 8/9/2017 9:13:04 PM EDT
[#12]
Will the 55 grain do good in my 20 inch PSA 1 in 7 twist AR. Or should I just shoot it in my 16 in 1 in 9 twist AR
Link Posted: 8/9/2017 9:20:10 PM EDT
[#13]
55gr is fine in 1:7.

Just so you know, XM193I is loaded by IMI for federal. It's 5.69/box at outdoorunlimited. Then you can use federal .05/rd rebate on it. Depending on shipping cost to your area, it may be cheaper.

www.outdoorlimited.com/ProductDetails.asp?ProductCode=XM193I&CartID=1

https://www.federalpremium.com/news/promotions_rebates.aspx

I believe all the current XM193 qualifies for their rebate.
Link Posted: 8/10/2017 7:56:51 AM EDT
[Last Edit: Happy2shoot] [#14]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By lazyengineer:

Best deal going, is the Norma TAC 55gr ammo being sold at Brownells right now.  Wait for the right code, and you can get it for about 28 cents a shot delivered.  That's one Hell of a deal for what many consider match-quality ammo. The new brass casing alone are selling for about 60 cents, so I'm not sure how they are able to do this.  
View Quote
I don't think Norma TAC brass is the same as Norma brass. I think Norma TAC brass is just renamed GECO brass.

https://www.ar15.com/forums/t_3_16/701395_85__Sure_Norma_USA_TAC_223_and_GECO_223_are_the_same_thing_.html
Link Posted: 8/11/2017 6:51:12 AM EDT
[#15]
Link Posted: 8/11/2017 7:16:57 AM EDT
[Last Edit: popnfresh] [#16]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By cruze5:
Wow this thread is bad news I me I've been reloading federal brass for some time with no issues along with Nosler... I did buy some Lapua on sale last year I've been happy with the federal so I just continued to reload it
View Quote
Yes pretty much any brass will work. Lake City is great. If you want consistency in all your components then you go to Lapua or Norma( I am currently testing against Lapua).
I have not tried Federal but I know Hornady sucks, outside of a basic setup with basic dies.
Link Posted: 8/11/2017 2:23:33 PM EDT
[Last Edit: borderpatrol] [#17]
I have had excellent results with (free) Federal brass. All once fired and nickel plated. Because of Federal's checkered past I only use it for modest loads driving lightweight bullets. Local police agencies leave it at my home range after their practice sessions.

22.3 grains of LT-32 under a 52 grain Hornady hpbt match bullet. Seating depth 2.200". Russian kvb-5,56m (5.56mm Magnum) primers. Average velocity of 2920 fps from a 20" White Oak service rifle barrel. 12 rounds in an inch including the called flier at 100 yards. The other eleven rounds went through a 5/8" hole. This is Western Powders starting load in their 5.56mm load data. It's in the middle range of their .223 data.

This same load fired from Lake City brass achieved the same velocity but grouped closer to 1.25" at 100 yards. The only difference was the brass used.
Link Posted: 8/11/2017 2:36:07 PM EDT
[#18]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Happy2shoot:
I don't think Norma TAC brass is the same as Norma brass. I think Norma TAC brass is just renamed GECO brass.

https://www.ar15.com/forums/t_3_16/701395_85__Sure_Norma_USA_TAC_223_and_GECO_223_are_the_same_thing_.html
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Happy2shoot:
Originally Posted By lazyengineer:

Best deal going, is the Norma TAC 55gr ammo being sold at Brownells right now.  Wait for the right code, and you can get it for about 28 cents a shot delivered.  That's one Hell of a deal for what many consider match-quality ammo. The new brass casing alone are selling for about 60 cents, so I'm not sure how they are able to do this.  
I don't think Norma TAC brass is the same as Norma brass. I think Norma TAC brass is just renamed GECO brass.

https://www.ar15.com/forums/t_3_16/701395_85__Sure_Norma_USA_TAC_223_and_GECO_223_are_the_same_thing_.html
Might be true - but from the way people talk, the GECO brass is also excellent, with more uniform dimensions than US LC brass, and with drilled flash holes rather than punched (i.e. more uniform and centered, and no flash-hole burrs).   I'm looking forward to seeing what @popnfresh, planned test's that he comments on, show us.
Link Posted: 8/14/2017 7:18:22 AM EDT
[#19]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By lazyengineer:


Might be true - but from the way people talk, the GECO brass is also excellent, with more uniform dimensions than US LC brass, and with drilled flash holes rather than punched (i.e. more uniform and centered, and no flash-hole burrs).   I'm looking forward to seeing what @popnfresh, planned test's that he comments on, show us.
View Quote
I am comparing the Norma reloading brass(a box of 25) for .308, may be a different animal at $1 per case. 
Link Posted: 8/14/2017 11:26:03 AM EDT
[#20]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By popnfresh:
I am comparing the Norma reloading brass(a box of 25) for .308, may be a different animal at $1 per case. 
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By popnfresh:
Originally Posted By lazyengineer:


Might be true - but from the way people talk, the GECO brass is also excellent, with more uniform dimensions than US LC brass, and with drilled flash holes rather than punched (i.e. more uniform and centered, and no flash-hole burrs).   I'm looking forward to seeing what @popnfresh, planned test's that he comments on, show us.
I am comparing the Norma reloading brass(a box of 25) for .308, may be a different animal at $1 per case. 
I weight checked a bunch of brass last night.  Results are here.  Bottom line the FC brass weighs the same and has the same standard deviation as LC brass, which was better than I was expecting.  But that the NORMA brass is better.
Link Posted: 8/14/2017 11:35:21 AM EDT
[Last Edit: popnfresh] [#21]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By lazyengineer:


I weight checked a bunch of brass last night.  Results are here.  Bottom line the FC brass weighs the same and has the same standard deviation as LC brass, which was better than I was expecting.  But that the NORMA brass is better.
View Quote
What were the capacity spreads, how about neck wall thinkness, consistency and concentricity? 

There is little correlation between case weight and case capacity.
Link Posted: 8/14/2017 11:49:35 AM EDT
[#22]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By popnfresh:
What were the capacity spreads, how about neck wall thinkness, consistency and concentricity? 

There is little correlation between case weight and case capacity.
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By popnfresh:
Originally Posted By lazyengineer:


I weight checked a bunch of brass last night.  Results are here.  Bottom line the FC brass weighs the same and has the same standard deviation as LC brass, which was better than I was expecting.  But that the NORMA brass is better.
What were the capacity spreads, how about neck wall thinkness, consistency and concentricity? 

There is little correlation between case weight and case capacity.
Not yet measured.  Got the expedient data first, the other is much more involved, but will probably test that some time next month - as time allows.
Link Posted: 8/14/2017 11:44:18 PM EDT
[#23]
Federal brass is fine for plinking ammo.  I had actually reloaded a ton of it for a 243 bolt action and a M1 Garand before the internet told me it was bad.  I have a ton of federal 223 brass I've saved from cheap factory that sits in my emergency, "can't find any components" reserve.

Norma brass is excellent stuff and I too have harvested it from their cheap tac ammo line.  

Amazingly, some of my best ar-15 groups have been shot with good old Winchester brass.  Biggest problem with the Winchester stuff is loose primer pockets after a few reloads.

Have not tried lapua brass in my 223 ar-15, but I have in my Grendel.  Good stuff but the hornady brass has also been pretty good in the Grendel.  I get a couple more reloads out of the Lapua, the primer pockets stay tigher longer but after 10 reloads, both are beat up pretty good anyway.

Lapua is all I shoot out of my 260.  Good stuff.  Will last a very long time in a bolt action.
Close Join Our Mail List to Stay Up To Date! Win a FREE Membership!

Sign up for the ARFCOM weekly newsletter and be entered to win a free ARFCOM membership. One new winner* is announced every week!

You will receive an email every Friday morning featuring the latest chatter from the hottest topics, breaking news surrounding legislation, as well as exclusive deals only available to ARFCOM email subscribers.


By signing up you agree to our User Agreement. *Must have a registered ARFCOM account to win.
Top Top