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Posted: 12/28/2015 12:00:37 PM EDT
I went to the lease last Tuesday with my AR. I had a 20 rd mag loaded up with cheap Tula FMJ for pigs and a 5 rd mag with Hornady Vmax for deer. I forgot to put my 5 rd mag in when I went looking for deer, but it didn't seem to matter. At +/- 100 yds I hit a doe quarting toward me in the throat, exiting the right shoulder and she went maybe 10 yds. Her running buddy took one broadside through the heart/lungs with a pass through at 125-ish yds and she ran a good 50 or more yds before she fell. One, don't get in a hurry when preparing to hit the field. Two, don't panic, just make a good shot.
Link Posted: 12/29/2015 10:09:35 AM EDT
[#1]
I'm glad it worked out for you and congrats on your success, but what you did is an exaple of "What NOT to do when hunting".
FMJ's on a deer hunt I feel are unethical, unwarranted, and downright stupid.  IMHO You showed little respect for the game you
were persuing.  A problem easily solved by going back to the truck, house, camp or closest store.  

I'm glad your a good shot.
Link Posted: 12/29/2015 6:27:39 PM EDT
[#2]
I couldn't disagree more. FMJ is capable of passing though the animals and causing sufficient damage to vitals to kill quickly. The exit wound on the heart of the broadside doe was more than two inches wide. Lets just skip past the endless debates of balistics, hydrostatic shock, 50 years of military use, blah blah blah... lets beat the dead horse known as shot placement. The only deer I've shot and not killed was wounded using a 7x57 with a JSP. Had I taken bad shots with a larger caliber and/or "acceptable" round I would have wounded or failed to recover these does. Had I used .17, .22, or at these distances used buck shot, then I would accept your shaming and mold my future decision making accordingly.
Link Posted: 12/29/2015 6:53:53 PM EDT
[#3]
Link Posted: 12/29/2015 7:51:50 PM EDT
[#4]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:  I don't know about laws in your state, but FMJs are illegal for hunting here.
View Quote


He's good.  He didn't use a rimfire or an airgun.  Good shooting, OP!  What were the dressed weights?
Link Posted: 12/30/2015 12:15:44 PM EDT
[#5]
I don't have scales backbencher. I can say this pair had a significant ammount more fat than any other deer I've harvested. But I'm sure a bumper crop of food and lack of hard summer or winter played a part in that.
Link Posted: 12/30/2015 9:34:12 PM EDT
[#6]
"I couldn't disagree more. FMJ is capable of passing though the animals and causing sufficient damage to vitals to kill quickly"

Why bother with the Vmax then?
Link Posted: 12/30/2015 10:44:41 PM EDT
[#7]
Link Posted: 1/1/2016 12:55:06 PM EDT
[#8]
Being blunt............did they die?  did they die humanly as possible?
FMJ is not my first choice either, however, it will do the job..........with accurate point of impact.
Link Posted: 1/3/2016 12:43:57 AM EDT
[#9]
Nice shots.  

I could use FMJ, but opt for a different bullet choice.  I only use my VMAX's on yotes and cats.
Link Posted: 1/4/2016 1:28:58 PM EDT
[#10]
Vmax shreds the vitals in the deer and pigs I shoot with it. Why do I need my deer to explode like a prairie dog shot with Vmax?
Link Posted: 1/4/2016 1:42:08 PM EDT
[#11]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Being blunt............did they die?  did they die humanly as possible?
FMJ is not my first choice either, however, it will do the job..........with accurate point of impact.
View Quote


Does a complete pass through with double lung plus heart meet your standards for humane?
Link Posted: 1/5/2016 2:31:03 PM EDT
[#12]
While using FMJ bullets is legal in Texas, it has a much higher risk of wounding an animal rather than humanly killing one.  Did your experience have a positive outcome?  Yes it sounds like it did.  But what if your shot hadn't been as good as it was?  A FMJ that misses the vitals by just a small amount will likely pass through the animal leaving only a small entrance and exit wound.  To ensure ethical kill shots you should be using bullets designed to kill deer size game.  Even a basic cup and core soft point offers good expansion on deer.  This means more damage to vital organs and the exit wound, if there is pass through will be larger.  This means the animal will die much quicker.  

Vmax bullets are also a poor choice for deer size game.  Can you kill a deer with one, sure.  But the Vmax is a varmint bullet with a very thin jacket.  It's designed to basically "explode" into a bunch of small fragments after very minimal penetration.  If your shot with these isn't perfect and you hit a shoulder bone the vmax will likely only leave a large surface wound that will cause the animal to die a very slow death, or maybe not kill it at all.  

Please use bullets designed for killing deer size game, it's the ethical thing to do.
Link Posted: 1/5/2016 2:33:36 PM EDT
[#13]
LOL, I'm not sure why morality is such a sticky subject when it's applied to anything but hunting.

I'm pretty sure the people always crying about "ethical kills" would cry even more if I tried to force my morality on them.
Link Posted: 1/6/2016 2:07:41 PM EDT
[#14]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
While using FMJ bullets is legal in Texas, it has a much higher risk of wounding an animal rather than humanly killing one.  Did your experience have a positive outcome?  Yes it sounds like it did.  But what if your shot hadn't been as good as it was?  A FMJ that misses the vitals by just a small amount will likely pass through the animal leaving only a small entrance and exit wound.  To ensure ethical kill shots you should be using bullets designed to kill deer size game.  Even a basic cup and core soft point offers good expansion on deer.  This means more damage to vital organs and the exit wound, if there is pass through will be larger.  This means the animal will die much quicker.  

[/span**]Missing the vitals with SP or ballistic tip is still missing the vitals. Most misses of vitals are going to be by more than the 2-3mm (?) of expansion. I've had equally accurate shots from my 7x57 with Hornady Superformance that obliterated the heart and lungs that led to the deer taking a similar number of SECONDS to die.

Vmax bullets are also a poor choice for deer size game.  Can you kill a deer with one, sure.  But the Vmax is a varmint bullet with a very thin jacket.  It's designed to basically "explode" into a bunch of small fragments after very minimal penetration.  If your shot with these isn't perfect and you hit a shoulder bone the vmax will likely only leave a large surface wound that will cause the animal to die a very slow death, or maybe not kill it at all.  

Please use bullets designed for killing deer size game, it's the ethical thing to do.
View Quote

[span style='color: red;']**I've taken a moderate number of deer and pigs with Vmax and similar Federal American Eagle. The outcomes were the same as this situation, well placed shot = dead prey in a matter of seconds. And with every one taken, bones were broken by the bullet. I've killed enough game with .223 to confidently tell you that I already am.
Link Posted: 1/13/2016 12:48:45 AM EDT
[#15]
Depends on what caliber the V-Max is in. A 55gr v-max is a little light, but as long as you don't hit major bones it would be fine imo. I've shot clean through frying pans with it. 110gr V-Max in a 6.8SPC is plenty. As far as FMJ's.. If it's supposed to kill people, it should kill deer as well. However it's definitely not the best choice. If I was trying to survive and it's all I had I'm confident I could make due but there are obviously better things out there. If it's accepted to shoot hogs with FMJ, a deer now and then shouldn't really hurt anything IMO.
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