User Panel
[#2]
Tiny increases in traffic produces gridlock. If 10% of the population hits the highway, there will be a parking lot as far as you can see, in most situations..
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[#3]
I bugged out from Houston for Rita in 2005. Got out of the city early enough to avoid that mess, but I-10 was a mess all the way to San Antonio, and what's usually a 3 hour trip turned into a 9 hour trip. I was in the National Guard at the time, had been released from Operation Katrina duty to get family to safety, and after getting my family to safety had to turn right around and drive back to Houston to work Rita... Interesting times.
My biggest mistake was bugging out in the first place. IMHO determining whether to bug out is arguably more important than when to do it. Even had the hurricane hit Houston directly it's unlikely that we'd have sustained more than some downed trees or maybe broken windows. Should have just remained in place. A few years later when Ike hit Houston directly, we stayed home and rode it out. Had some minor damage and lost power for a week or so, but nothing we couldn't handle easily. If it's a situation in which you *must* leave immediately (chemical spill or something), then you'd better be quick, because gridlock takes only a matter of minutes to set in. And if you think you're going to be sly and take the back roads, think again. Everyone has a map in their pocket now with their phones and will be thinking the same thing. |
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[#4]
Very little could cause me to bug out, especially emergency situations. I am pretty much limited to HAZMAT spills, in which case there isn't enough of a population out here to worry about gridlock.
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[#6]
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[#7]
The thought and planning for bugging out of South jersey gives me nightmares.
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[#9]
Motorcycles, horses, bicycles or on foot, unless you have a plane or helicopter at your house.
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[#10]
Bugged out to a small town a long time ago.
But wife wants to travel in an RV and staying aware of things to head home early on will be important. |
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[#11]
Quoted:
GET OUT NOW! That is the only way to be sure... View Quote I sat in a miles long line of traffic in BFE South Georgia during the Hurricane Floyd evac of N. Florida in 1999. I remember looking back towards Jax and thinking "damn if something real had happened you'd be screwed." I moved to my retreat full time a few months later. |
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[#12]
Bugging out of Hampton Roads is a nightmare and a joke. Most people have no idea of the back ways out of this area. I like it that way.
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[#13]
Quoted:
Bugging out of Hampton Roads is a nightmare and a joke. Most people have no idea of the back ways out of this area. I like it that way. View Quote |
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[#14]
I knew many of us were already living in our bug out location and would poke our heads out of our burrows and yell "MOVE." I, too have only lived in small towns and rural areas since I left the Baltimore/DC area in 1969.
However, there are some youngsters out there that need to do some realistic evaluations of their plans. Some folks have worked on their bug out locations but only have nebulous plans on how to get there when the flags go up. Timing is the key to evacuation and an hour or two delay in starting may mean you won't make it. If it is 2:00-3:00AM, don't wait til morning - leave NOW. If you are evacuating, it means that you and your family's lives are potentially in danger. Don't spend precious time putting paper towels, emptying your gun safe, ammo hoard, and the kids favorite toys into the "bug out vehicle or trailer." All that stuff is just stuff - let it go and just go. If a fire is coming over the mountain, a chemical-laden train is on fire, or the nuclear plant is in meltdown, the deputies knocking on your door will be making you leave now or maybe within 5 minutes, leaving all your pets, 11,000 rounds of .22LR, beanie baby collection and everything else behind. In this case, the bug out bags you made up last summer may not be current if you haven't maintained them, replaced the batteries in the lights and radios, and copied your computer files recently. With hurricanes, you can have several days of warning to prepare to evacuate, and as shown in the Houston photo, very few people took advantage of that time. Forest fires usually can be seen coming, but it's amazing how many people wait until their shingles are smoldering before they start packing their car. Try not to be like these people. |
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[#15]
I've lived in N. Ga for all of my 47 years and have never seen an evacuation event. My grandfather lived here since 1900 (he passed in 98) and couldn't recall one.
We live in the suburbs because of the schools for our kids. The wife and I would rather be in Blue Ridge or Blairsville (pop. 500-ish), but it doesn't make sense for our family or our jobs. The only scenarios I can foresee that would rate bugging out, would make the area impossible to bug out from. |
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[#16]
Something also to consider is the stupidity of people.
I was in Virginia last week and we ended up in pumper to pumper traffic for about half an hour at what I was told was an unusual time for such traffic. I thought it must have been a large traffic accident or something of that nature... ...It turned out that a cop had simple pulled someone over for speeding. That is all. Everyone was rubbernecking, which caused traffic to slow down and then virtually stop for those far enough behind them. Now imagine what will happen with a small crisis and someone gets in a wreck at some point in that same traffic congestion as everyone is trying to get out of dodge. |
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[#17]
I was living in an apartment in Edison New Jersey back in the late 80’s and was told to get out twice, once for fire and once for flood. A few things stuck with me and have influenced my preps, such as they are. An overriding influence is being a suburbanite. Someone living rural will no doubt have a different perspective and come to different conclusions about what’s right or wrong.
First, you can’t count on having enough information to make good choices. You may have several days’ notice about a hurricane but there are lots of things that can come out of nowhere to turn your life upside down. In both cases for me I was awakened from a sound sleep by a first responder banging on the door yelling “GET OUT NOW”. These folks don’t spend any time answering your questions or explaining to you the precise nature of the disaster. They just make sure you’re up and then they move on to the next door. I knew there was a fire and I knew there was a flood and that’s about it. You often see responses to questions about what to pack that include the words “It depends”. No it doesn’t. Your BOB needs to be as broad based and flexible as you can make it because you can’t count on knowing the nature or duration of the event. You might, you just can’t count on it. Second, you may have very little time to get out. Like a couple of minutes or less. You need to have at least the basics ready to go immediately. I knew a girl who was living in the Durham Woods apartments in Edison in ’94 when the pipeline that ran by blew up. Google it. Seconds may count. Third, other people can (will?) get in the way. If the disaster is bad enough to get you moving then it’s probably getting everyone around you moving too, all at the same time. Being a suburbanite, that may mean millions of people on the move. My apartment was kind of at the end of the line and by the time I was up and out for the flood the only way out of the parking lot was blocked by the cars of people who had tried to drive out and failed. My truck could have made it through the water but not through the stuck cars. My flood turned out to be a very local event but we’ve all seen these pics posted by the OP before. You can’t count on being the first guy out or having a clear path to get where you want to go. People are going to run out of gas, get in accidents or break down in just the right spot to block you from going anywhere. Because of all this and more, you better be prepared to walk if you have to, carrying the essentials you need to get by. When it comes to the BOB, it’s not easy to balance the first (broad based and flexible) with the third (easily carried) but the older I’ve gotten the smaller my BOB has become. Other life lessons have influenced it but basically I’ve come to understand you don’t need to pack the kitchen sink. A few trusted things can see you through most of life’s awful moments, at least for a while. |
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[#18]
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[#19]
A couple posters up raised a great point regarding not knowing everything when something is happening.
Too often preppers get caught in this "I have to have all the facts, look at them for six months before I make a decision" analysis paralysis deal. That could kill you when time is of the essence. 9/11 NO ONE KNEW what was coming next. Sure we can look back now and think "I was o.k. to not bug out" but THEN you had no idea what shoe was going to drop next. I would submit that the reality of the situation was much dire than we realize. Yet how many people you know bugged out that day? Compare that to how many sat and stared at TV screens. People will do the same next time, probably see a few posts on survival forums like "what does the "hive" think? Is it time to bug out?" while people sit and contemplate and "research" the situation, etc. It's that lack of good, quick decision making that will be the undoing of many people with big stores of ammo, food, guns, etc. |
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[#20]
What's being discussed in this thread is "Mass Exodus". That's about a worse case scenario for bugging out.
That said, my experience with this, I didn't even bother. I bugged in. By the time, they called for evacuation in my area, they had already done the coastal areas and I'd rather whether a storm in a building than a vehicle. That said, I have motorcycles which can spit lanes and a boat with a 300 mile range. Permanent mass exodus is a different scenario entirely. Now you are talking you best have a BOL or the best you are is a well to do refugee. That can be as simple as the family farm, a distant cabin you have, and or a boat that you can live on. The number 1 tool in any bug out is your head. Have plans. Plans have alternatives or its not a plan its a decision. Its "If Then". Unless you live in an RV or boat already, bugging out by its nature then is last resort, not the first. Having plans to weather the most likely scenarios without bugging out is preferable to a bug out. That said, one good fire and we're all bugging out. BTW, House fire is the number 1 bugout scenario. Its a sad reality the unprepared bug out first and anything we can think of a 1,000 others will before us. That's why we have thread after thread on bugout vehicles. What you are looking for in a bug out vehicle is specific to your needs but the basic concept is a feature that gives you an edge, advantage, whether its speed, distance, or route. Like anything else have a plan not a decision and this is where everyone sitting still in a crisis makes their mistake. What if I'm stuck in bumper to bumper is big deal but its not impossible. I like the end scenes of the movie "Deep Impact" on this topic because unlike people leaving a storm, facing imminent death, vehicles sat idle as people took to motorcycles, bicycles, and even foot. Others like the people who decided to bug in as an only option sat in their cars waiting on death to take them. Most importantly, "Prepare for the most likely scenario first and least likely last". Though easily prepared or a week with no utilities actually without much discomfort, I can't tell how stupid I felt having the option of bugout taken from me. I probably still wouldn't have used it, but its not like Hurricanes didn't happen where I lived nor I hadn't been tracking the storm knowing it was going to close. In fact, the eye went right over me. Despite probably not using it, that time to bugout when the bugging out was good passed right over me and I was making the Decision then when it was too late. I should have known that decision point as part of my thinking. Don't rely on others to do your thinking. During 9/11, that morning I was on an airplane when the first planes went in. Stranded hundreds of miles from home, I ignored the media telling us we'd be back in the air the next day. Why? I learned that hurricane the media goes into calm the sheep mode and to think for yourself. I pretty much kept a rental car and told them they could pick it up then made my way home not the most direct route but the route I knew I had friends and family I could rely on. In the end, I was home in bed while many were stranded sleeping God knows where waiting on they'll take care us. Now I'm not going to advise to go experience a hurricane. I can advise you to be aware of your surroundings and follow trends. Past events will give you guidance on future events, plan accordingly, and practice better be safe than sorry. My boss on 911 was telling me to go another 400 miles from home. I'll pay for it is not much comfort when there isn't anything to buy. "Prepare for the Most Likely Scenario First and Least Likely last", "Think for yourself", "If you can think of it 1,000 others will.", "Plan has alternative or its not a plan but a decision." and "A bugout without a bugout plan/destination just makes us well to do refugees." Tj |
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[#21]
Quoted:
Too often preppers get caught in this "I have to have all the facts, look at them for six months before I make a decision" analysis paralysis deal. That could kill you when time is of the essence. View Quote |
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[#22]
The problem with Rita was when they gave the word for coastal ares to evacuate, everyone in the Houston area decided to evacuate. I don't know if the staged evacuation that was intended would have worked (I suppose it would have in theory ??), but the reality was gridlock and a stripping of the store shelves of stock.
The problem with Houston is the exits out of the city are limited to a few main highways (I-45, I-10, 290, & 59) and there are limited backroads. The lesson I learned, get out the day before or figure on riding it out. |
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[#23]
Quoted:
The problem with Rita was when they gave the word for coastal ares to evacuate, everyone in the Houston area decided to evacuate. I don't know if the staged evacuation that was intended would have worked (I suppose it would have in theory ??), but the reality was gridlock and a stripping of the store shelves of stock. The problem with Houston is the exits out of the city are limited to a few main highways (I-45, I-10, 290, & 59) and there are limited backroads. The lesson I learned, get out the day before or figure on riding it out. View Quote Contrast it with Ike a few years later - which was a much, much worse storm than Rita and caused significantly more damage, and which we all pretty much knew was coming our way - and you see the difference. In Rita, the city was thinking about Katrina, and in Ike, it was thinking about what a clusterfuck Rita was - and decided to stay home. So the problem with Rita was that everyone - city officials included - made the wrong decision to evacuate, when only the coastal areas really needed to evacuate. the city collectively made the wrong decision, due to irrational fears derived from recent visions of Katrina. By the time Ike rolled around most of the city remembered how to deal with hurricanes and made the correct decision not to BO. |
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[#24]
Don't forget that all those people in the picture were heading somewhere for their bugout. I lived in DFW during those times and while we didn't get any bad weather really we did get a butt load of people. Resources held up ok for the short term. Some gas stations were low on fuel and some common resources ran low for awhile.
Supposedly? a lot of the shipments of fuel for N. Texas were routed to the evacuation routes to try to keep the folks moving along. Same with bottle water, generators, etc. I get it and have no problems with getting stuff to the folks that need it. Just a heads up for those not evacuating because you may be the place they are evacuating to. |
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[#25]
The gas stations along the evac routes all ran out of gas, as well as food and water. Keep the tanks full and keep food and water in the vehicle.
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[#26]
Lots of great information, truth and discussion in this thread. My solution, and I think the best one is to bug out of major cities and population centers right now. Go.
Living rural gives me major peace of mind. I love to go to the city, but I love coming home so much more. |
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[#27]
Quoted:
The lesson I learned, get out the day before or figure on riding it out. View Quote ROCK6 |
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[#28]
I'm glad some of you guys mentioned about Hampton Roads, as I live in Virginia Beach. The evacuation plan is ridiculous, no way in hell that would work with the population that keeps on growing here on the southside. My plan of action is to bug out before everybody else does. And yes there are backroads, just not many exits to take.
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[#29]
If that kind of evac scenario hits Hampton Roads we are just fucked. No amount of pre-planning can help when you have a small handful of river crossing chokepoints, the main ones of which are tunnels and will be unusable. Going south would be the only option, which is still a pretty bad one given that's where the hurricane is going to be coming from, and it's swamp down there. Best to ride it out. I'm on a third floor apartment, should only have to worry about the roof getting torn off/tree falling on it. Downside is I rarely have stored food. I live like a college kid eating boxed dinners and fast food all the time. I'm getting better about water, have a few large containers these days.
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[#30]
If you have an off road capable vehicle following railroads or utilizing jeep trails if your area has them aren't a bad idea either.
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[#31]
Quoted:
I've lived in N. Ga for all of my 47 years and have never seen an evacuation event. My grandfather lived here since 1900 (he passed in 98) and couldn't recall one. We live in the suburbs because of the schools for our kids. The wife and I would rather be in Blue Ridge or Blairsville (pop. 500-ish), but it doesn't make sense for our family or our jobs. The only scenarios I can foresee that would rate bugging out, would make the area impossible to bug out from. View Quote |
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[#32]
like Rock6, I have a pre determined fail safe point ... I live on the central Gulf Coast of Florida, about 3miles inland at 32' elevation... on site hand pump well... old frame home with 5 year old roof with peel and stick under layer that has gone 125mph sustained...my matrix is to board up for a high CAT3 and for anything higher a short distance evacuation to a relative's post Andrew code block home with well and whole house gen system... I have a light weight utility trailer and a small PU truck for most of my valuables ala "place with no name" evacuation as Mr Broccoli commented
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[#33]
Why run from a hurricane? I've never understood this.
If your area is low, and could go under, absolutely. I was in Chalmette 2 days, and for months after Katrina, and saw things you would not believe. But otherwise, why? I've sat through many. Alicia in Houston, Fredrick in Mobile, Ivan in Mobile, and Katrina in Madisonville. Rain, wind, trees fall, some hit house, scary, but that's it. You're not some kind of bad ass if you stay, frankly I think it's more risky to run. |
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[#34]
Quoted:
Why run from a hurricane? I've never understood this. If your area is low, and could go under, absolutely. I was in Chalmette 2 days, and for months after Katrina, and saw things you would not believe. But otherwise, why? I've sat through many. Alicia in Houston, Fredrick in Mobile, Ivan in Mobile, and Katrina in Madisonville. Rain, wind, trees fall, some hit house, scary, but that's it. You're not some kind of bad ass if you stay, frankly I think it's more risky to run. View Quote |
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[#35]
I rode out Hurricane Katrina in Gulfport,Mississippi on the SeaBee base one mile off shore ( not by choice, I was stationed there ) and have no intentions of dealing with that again. I am in Jacksonville,FL and bugged out two days before Hurricane Matthew got close. I would have probably rode it out if I was by myself, but having a 2 year old and a 8 month pregnant wife at the time, it was not even an consideration. Leaving 48 hours prior, I had no issues on the road and ironically went back to Mississippi to ride hand with the in-laws.
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[#36]
Quoted:
Why run from a hurricane? I've never understood this. If your area is low, and could go under, absolutely. I was in Chalmette 2 days, and for months after Katrina, and saw things you would not believe. But otherwise, why? I've sat through many. Alicia in Houston, Fredrick in Mobile, Ivan in Mobile, and Katrina in Madisonville. Rain, wind, trees fall, some hit house, scary, but that's it. You're not some kind of bad ass if you stay, frankly I think it's more risky to run. View Quote |
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[#37]
I have all my preps/ supplies here. I'm to old/ broken to even consider bugging out.
I'm staying here and guarding my stuff/ family. |
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[#38]
Quoted:
I have all my preps/ supplies here. I'm to old/ broken to even consider bugging out. I'm staying here and guarding my stuff/ family. View Quote ROCK6 |
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[#39]
I used to live in Florida before I moved to Ga. I stopped bugging out from hurricanes while I lived down there .
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[#40]
The only thing I may have to evacuate is a Yellowstone explosion, in which case I cannot possibly drive fast enough to escape. Even if I had the road to myself.
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[#42]
I am pretty certain that I won't ever have to 'bug out'. Advanced age and infirmities pretty much exclude my hitting the road with a pack. Still have the BOB, and it gets inventoried, topped off, from time to time, but it is not likely to ever be used now.
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[#43]
Quoted:
I'm glad some of you guys mentioned about Hampton Roads, as I live in Virginia Beach. The evacuation plan is ridiculous, no way in hell that would work with the population that keeps on growing here on the southside. My plan of action is to bug out before everybody else does. And yes there are backroads, just not many exits to take. View Quote |
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[#45]
Quoted:
Very little could cause me to bug out, especially emergency situations. I am pretty much limited to HAZMAT spills, in which case there isn't enough of a population out here to worry about gridlock. View Quote |
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[#46]
Something interesting I found recently...
I live in Ft. Lauderdale, FL and my BOL is my farm 108 miles away in center of state north of Lake O. It usually takes be 125 minutes from my driveway to the farm gate by the fastest route but I know 11 other routes including 5 which requires driving on farm/dirt roads and levy roads. Couple weeks ago I looked up on Google Map, MapQuest, Waze, etc. to see all the different roads I could take to get from my house to my farm and found 19 different routes some which takes you through roads which doesn't exist yet. So if you think you'll bug out quickly through your secret route, forget it, as thousands of others will be on that same road following direction from one of the direction app. |
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[#47]
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[#48]
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[#49]
Here's a halffast story about a bug out
https://www.thehighroad.org/index.php?threads/the-bug-out-a-short-story.172494/ |
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[#50]
Unless you have a boat, you're not leaving the San Francisco Bay Area.
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