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Posted: 12/21/2014 10:47:10 PM EDT
[#1]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
After the Simi Valley earthquake, my best friend and his family lived in a cabover camper for a year or so. We lost contact with each other; I think it was because he didn't want me to see how he was living. He said it was the pits. His boy was 4 or 5,and that was the most difficult part. +1 on full-time living being hard on the hardware. Stuff wore out continually, and he didn't have the home facilities to fix stuff (couldn't do the repairs in the park where he lived). Cabover...like a truck camper? Those actually seem to offer more by comparison. Can tow a trailer with gear behind the truck, sleeps the same as the smaller trailers, plus they can be removed from the truck bed for errands. Not sure if they can be occupied when on the jacks though. We'd have a 4-5 year old as well assuming we needed it in the next year or two. He gets wrestless in a 2000sqft. home....I can only imagine being in a 150-200sqft. camper! That's something we rarely focus on...kids. How would that adjustment work?? Personally, a personal SHTF is far more likely than one from natrural disaster or civil unrest. Again, at least it would give us some place to sleep and protect us from the elements. Most of all it's at least something to call "home"...shitty as that home may be. -Emt1581 |
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Posted: 12/21/2014 10:48:33 PM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
One (relatively minor) disadvantage of "stealth cargo trailers" is that some privately-run campgrounds and "RV resorts" don't allow them. Ditto for converted school buses.  I don't understand...what's a stealth trailer? Is that a normal utility trailer you might keep motorcycles/etc in...converted for beds/bath/kitchen/etc.? If so, why don't resorts allow them? Thanks -Emt1581 |
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Posted: 12/21/2014 11:16:38 PM EDT
[#3]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
One (relatively minor) disadvantage of "stealth cargo trailers" is that some privately-run campgrounds and "RV resorts" don't allow them. Ditto for converted school buses. One LARGE advantage is this year's taxes were $68 IIRC. 
My buddy who is now, uh, RV 'poor', having lost his brand new $1/2 Million DP to the bank after throwing mucho BUENO dinaro after BAD, at it, and constantly chided me to buy one similar to his and get rid of our lowly Stealth Trailer, that my SO and I converted and immeasurably have enjoyed... All done for less than $40k if I had to guess... [ trailer itself cost ~$7k new, for a good quality 14 x 7 or so foot one] Besides in 80,000 miles of travel, and nights I've lost count of, we rarely stayed at the 'structured' camp grounds with the snooty old timers, kids, and noise, preferring to boondock in all sorts of weird places, as it is far more 'adventurous'. 
Bunch of threads here abt it: Stealth Trailer and here Moar |
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Posted: 12/21/2014 11:28:53 PM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I don't understand...what's a stealth trailer? Is that a normal utility trailer you might keep motorcycles/etc in...converted for beds/bath/kitchen/etc.? If so, why don't resorts allow them? Thanks -Emt1581 Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
One (relatively minor) disadvantage of "stealth cargo trailers" is that some privately-run campgrounds and "RV resorts" don't allow them. Ditto for converted school buses. I don't understand...what's a stealth trailer? Is that a normal utility trailer you might keep motorcycles/etc in...converted for beds/bath/kitchen/etc.? If so, why don't resorts allow them? Thanks -Emt1581 See links above... 
Why don't some resorts allow them, why to keep rif-raf like my SO and I, who could likely buy and sell them, from harming the view of their snooty clients. 
In our case, the Stealth Trailer is rather plain and neat, and attracts little attention, at least until it's opened up. Otherwise it wouldn't be a Stealth Trailer... 
At various 'inspections' by Fed or State agents, they loved getting a 'tour' to see the inside. 
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Posted: 12/22/2014 12:32:56 AM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
See links above...
Why don't some resorts allow them, why to keep rif-raf like my SO and I, who could likely buy and sell them, from harming the view of their snooty clients.
In our case, the Stealth Trailer is rather plain and neat, and attracts little attention, at least until it's opened up. Otherwise it wouldn't be a Stealth Trailer...
At various 'inspections' by Fed or State agents, they loved getting a 'tour' to see the inside.
I saw a few of the stealth trailers...and some stealth vans (I kept seeing flashes of Matt Foley ...down by the river )
Honestly the stealth trailers that I saw didn't look nearly as comfortable as the campers that were professionally designed. More like someone threw all the necessities into a floor plan without much planning. Heat and A/C were almost always absent. But I can see the advantages of having it be stealth. So I suppose that would compensate for less amenities/engineering. Still not sure how living in the stealths would be long term. Seems like they would be far less enjoyable. Interesting concept though. -Emt1581 |
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Posted: 12/22/2014 12:51:32 AM EDT
[#6]
Never heard of him...
The issue it seems is that most 'campers' are designed to look like your living room and bedroom, to a degree, to be able to market them to the Sheeple. If you were to see ours [you won't], it wouldn't look like that, and it is EXTREMELY comfortable and functional, and does have heat and AC. You must not have examined the links I provided above.
ETA, we've spent overnight in temps down to 15F [or was it 12F] I forget and it was completely doable. That said we plan travel during the night and sleep during the day when not as much propane is required for the VENTED catalytic heater, during very cold periods. Most of the 'stealth trailers' you will find on the net are cobbled up nightmares made with 2x4's nailed together, with little thought and resources, and lack most any concept of 'creative' and 'tasteful' engineering. |
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Posted: 12/22/2014 12:55:07 AM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
The issue it seems is that most 'campers' are designed to look like your living room and bedroom, to a degree, to be able to market them to the Sheeple. If you were to see ours [you won't], it wouldn't look like that, and it is EXTREMELY comfortable and functional, and does have heat and AC. You must not have examined the links I provided above.
ETA, we've spent overnight in temps down to 15F [or was it 12F] I forget and it was completely doable. That said we plan travel during the night and sleep during the day when not as much propane is required for the VENTED catalytic heater, during very cold periods. Nope, didn't check the links yet. Heading to bed now. Just curious, cost-wise, what would it be to run your setup in that 12F temp each 24 period (propane, batteries, water, etc.)? Boy would it be nice to be able to travel again!!
-Emt1581 |
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Posted: 12/22/2014 1:04:16 AM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Nope, didn't check the links yet. Heading to bed now. Just curious, cost-wise, what would it be to run your setup in that 12F temp each 24 period (propane, batteries, water, etc.)? Boy would it be nice to be able to travel again!!
-Emt1581 Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
The issue it seems is that most 'campers' are designed to look like your living room and bedroom, to a degree, to be able to market them to the Sheeple. If you were to see ours [you won't], it wouldn't look like that, and it is EXTREMELY comfortable and functional, and does have heat and AC. You must not have examined the links I provided above.
ETA, we've spent overnight in temps down to 15F [or was it 12F] I forget and it was completely doable. That said we plan travel during the night and sleep during the day when not as much propane is required for the VENTED catalytic heater, during very cold periods. Most of the 'stealth trailers' you will find on the net are cobbled up nightmares made with 2x4's nailed together, with little thought and resources, and lack most any concept of 'creative' and 'tasteful' engineering. Nope, didn't check the links yet. Heading to bed now. Just curious, cost-wise, what would it be to run your setup in that 12F temp each 24 period (propane, batteries, water, etc.)? Boy would it be nice to be able to travel again!!
-Emt1581 The heater is 12,000 BTU [maybe only 8,000BTU], IIRC, battery cost is nothing, charged by solar. Current draw to run is very little, compared to say an RV furnace like an Atwood, like we use in the shipping container, that requires something like 2 amps for the 12,000 BTU one ---and ~3 amps for the 18,000BTU one, and they are noisy as hell. 12,000BTU is ~1/2 pound of propane per hour, so 8 hours run time per gallon times what a gallon of propane costs. $4? We tried to insulate our trailer well, but it isn't as good as it could have been since we didn't foam more than a few places, near the corners at the front. I wanted to keep easy access to everything and have the insulation removable for service and modifications. The rear drop down door is a source of some air leakage, and when we know we're going to travel into cold, we buy pipe foam tubular insulation to stuff around it. |
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Posted: 12/22/2014 1:05:47 AM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
The issue it seems is that most 'campers' are designed to look like your living room and bedroom, to a degree, to be able to market them to the Sheeple. That's very true. Your average RV manufacturer is downright anal about upholstery fabrics, floor coverings, wall paper and bathroom fixtures - but couldn't care less about space utilization or durability. |
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Posted: 12/22/2014 3:19:21 AM EDT
[#10]
Why not look into a Ice castle fish house just like a camper but made for cold climates and there about the same cost.
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Posted: 12/22/2014 10:08:26 AM EDT
[#11]
The wife and I lived in an 11.5’ Lance slide in camper for a month once. On nice days, when it was just a place to cook and sleep, it was fine. On cold/rainy/nasty days, when we were stuck inside, it got old quick. Now we have a 36' Keystone Outback toyhauler.
IMHO most RV parks won’t allow stealth campers because: 1. they don’t want (what they perceive as) low rent, trailer trash in their park, driving away good customers. 2. They are afraid that the trailer contains a traveling meth lab. |
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Posted: 12/22/2014 10:31:41 AM EDT
[#12]
Quote History[b]
The heater is 12,000 BTU [maybe only 8,000BTU], IIRC, battery cost is nothing, charged by solar. Current draw to run is very little, compared to say an RV furnace like an Atwood, like we use in the shipping container, that requires something like 2 amps for the 12,000 BTU one ---and ~3 amps for the 18,000BTU one, and they are noisy as hell. 12,000BTU is ~1/2 pound of propane per hour, so 8 hours run time per gallon times what a gallon of propane costs. $4? We tried to insulate our trailer well, but it isn't as good as it could have been since we didn't foam more than a few places, near the corners at the front. I wanted to keep easy access to everything and have the insulation removable for service and modifications. The rear drop down door is a source of some air leakage, and when we know we're going to travel into cold, we buy pipe foam tubular insulation to stuff around it. Isnt a gal 8lbs... so if .5lb per hour one gal per 16 hours? So roughly 45 gals per month. Not nearly as much as I imagined. Edit: wait I see you mentioned two locations and combining btu and amps...are you running a generator to power an electric heater using propane? Just a little confused about what you are using and where. Thanks -Emt1581 |
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Posted: 12/22/2014 1:06:36 PM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Isnt a gal 8lbs... so if .5lb per hour one gal per 16 hours? So roughly 45 gals per month. Not nearly as much as I imagined. Edit: wait I see you mentioned two locations and combining btu and amps...are you running a generator to power an electric heater using propane? Just a little confused about what you are using and where. Thanks -Emt1581 Quote HistoryQuoted:
[b]
The heater is 12,000 BTU [maybe only 8,000BTU], IIRC, battery cost is nothing, charged by solar. Current draw to run is very little, compared to say an RV furnace like an Atwood, like we use in the shipping container, that requires something like 2 amps for the 12,000 BTU one ---and ~3 amps for the 18,000BTU one, and they are noisy as hell. 12,000BTU is ~1/2 pound of propane per hour, so 8 hours run time per gallon times what a gallon of propane costs. $4? We tried to insulate our trailer well, but it isn't as good as it could have been since we didn't foam more than a few places, near the corners at the front. I wanted to keep easy access to everything and have the insulation removable for service and modifications. The rear drop down door is a source of some air leakage, and when we know we're going to travel into cold, we buy pipe foam tubular insulation to stuff around it. Isnt a gal 8lbs... so if .5lb per hour one gal per 16 hours? So roughly 45 gals per month. Not nearly as much as I imagined. Edit: wait I see you mentioned two locations and combining btu and amps...are you running a generator to power an electric heater using propane? Just a little confused about what you are using and where. Thanks -Emt1581 That's water's approximate density. Propane is about 4.1 lbs/gallon, so about half that of water. |
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Posted: 12/22/2014 3:02:42 PM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Isnt a gal 8lbs... so if .5lb per hour one gal per 16 hours? So roughly 45 gals per month. Not nearly as much as I imagined. Edit: wait I see you mentioned two locations and combining btu and amps...are you running a generator to power an electric heater using propane? Just a little confused about what you are using and where. Thanks -Emt1581 Quote HistoryQuoted:
[b]
The heater is 12,000 BTU [maybe only 8,000BTU], IIRC, battery cost is nothing, charged by solar. Current draw to run is very little, compared to say an RV furnace like an Atwood, like we use in the shipping container, that requires something like 2 amps for the 12,000 BTU one ---and ~3 amps for the 18,000BTU one, and they are noisy as hell. 12,000BTU is ~1/2 pound of propane per hour, so 8 hours run time per gallon times what a gallon of propane costs. $4? We tried to insulate our trailer well, but it isn't as good as it could have been since we didn't foam more than a few places, near the corners at the front. I wanted to keep easy access to everything and have the insulation removable for service and modifications. The rear drop down door is a source of some air leakage, and when we know we're going to travel into cold, we buy pipe foam tubular insulation to stuff around it. Isnt a gal 8lbs... so if .5lb per hour one gal per 16 hours? So roughly 45 gals per month. Not nearly as much as I imagined. Edit: wait I see you mentioned two locations and combining btu and amps...are you running a generator to power an electric heater using propane? Just a little confused about what you are using and where. Thanks -Emt1581 Do you even read bro? Do you ackshully get paid to counsel folks? Are there pre-written scripts to follow for various, ---challenges?
How do I get part of that action? Specific density of liquids varies wildly, as do the densities of things like feathers, which reminds me of the age old question... Which weighs more, a pound of feathers or a pound of lead... |
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Posted: 12/22/2014 5:49:13 PM EDT
[#15]
The truck campers for the back of a pickup bed can be used when not in the truck. People will generally get them unloaded and then lower the camper to the lowest setting. This takes some of the wobble out and depending on your specific setup you might want to brace it really well for stability. Stock, you might need to be really careful moving around. Braced, should not be a big deal if you pay attention to how you do it.
Home made or really old stuff tends to be frowned upon in many campgrounds. But the more I watch youtube and see how packed some of those places are I know I would not want to stay there. One fella needing to repair his camper had a tarp on the roof, all campgrounds in his area said no. It started him on urban camping. Making your own camper or buying one is something everyone has to decide. With all the stuff I have for car camping I can toss stuff in my stepvan and feel dang comfy if I arrive somewhere. Sure it looks bad compared to store bought stuff. I also use the van for moving and storage so having the ability to remove everything is nice. The stealth camper has some stuff the owners required and they skipped some of the stuff they don't care about. |
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Posted: 12/23/2014 11:34:02 AM EDT
[#16]
I lived out of my camper for 3 months a year ago in MN winter.
some campers are set up for cold weather, all plumbing and tanks enclosed underneath. electric heaters on the tanks, thicker insulation and bigger furnaces. mine is not as well set up as all that, but it does have a larger furnace and all the piping enclosed. a 100lb tank ran about a month and a half 70* inside and down to -10* outside. I did #1 outsider and #2 at the gas station when I could. black water tank filled up at about 2 months. I left the plumbing system winterized and used water out of a 7 gal tote, heated it on the stove when I wanted hot water. I dont THINK the pipes would have froze , but I didnt want to take the chance and the tanks are all external so they WOULD have froze. you can live out of a camper just fine. they are a house on wheels!
outside of winter we have moved into the camper on occasion when the power has gone out after a storm so I didnt have to run the generator to power the house. running water, heat, TV and movies for the kids. very handy to have a second house that can operate completely detached from the grid. |
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Posted: 12/23/2014 2:45:23 PM EDT
[#18]
that is nearly exactly what my wife and I want to set ourselves up for camping or bug out possibilities
great pics Quote HistoryQuoted:
I have a tiny Aliner Classic that's 15 feet long including the hitch. I'm still working on it but it would be way way better than living on the ground or in a tent. Like living anywhere there would be compromises. For me it's another 800 pounds worth of cargo that I can bring with me should I have to bug out. Living in it long term is possible but there's the requirement for water and food at least. Based on the amount of water I could bring I could likely do three to four weeks with it. http://i104.photobucket.com/albums/m168/AR-15_Paul/Aliner%20Classic/Desert01_zpsf513e33d.jpg http://i104.photobucket.com/albums/m168/AR-15_Paul/Aliner%20Classic/FIrstTimeOffRoad1-Copy_zps5f68e568.jpg I'm looking to add a Honda 2000i generator and a couple hundred watts worth of solar panels to make the boondock camping that we do easier. http://i104.photobucket.com/albums/m168/AR-15_Paul/Aliner%20Classic/Desert05_zpscaee817a.jpg |
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Posted: 12/23/2014 3:07:10 PM EDT
[#19]
My brother lives in a 5th wheel in the mountains of Colorado during the winter for work.
He has the bottom spray foamed. He dumps a bunch of salt in the holding AND waste tanks to keep them from freezing. He skirted the RV with hay bales, and put an electric heater down there that he plugs in if needed (but hasn't needed to yet). All his water is salt water, so it can drop below freezing and he is still good. He drinks/cooks with water from a jug inside. Water in the holding tank is just for toilet/washing hands. His grey/black water has never froze. Single young guy and his dog, they have no problems. 30ft 5th wheel with big popout though.
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Posted: 12/23/2014 3:48:46 PM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
here is my old home built toy hauler. 24' car hauler trailer, 11.5' real-lite pickup camper. camper is loaded with bathroom/shower, AC/heat, fridge ect. I framed in the sides and sheeted them in aluminum with large doors. gives me 8 foot long storage compartments on both sides, and the doors lay flat when open to give work space. the camper is attached to the trailer by 6 cable tie downs each with a weight rating high enough to hang the camper from a single hard point. camper can be removed in about 10 minutes to use the whole trailer. with the camper mounted there is enough room on the rear to haul 2 full size 4wheelers a 60ish qt cooler and my generator. with all the gear unloaded the rear deck makes a elevated platform to use for camp chairs or whatever. <a href="http://s27.photobucket.com/user/J75player/media/camping/0529091940.jpg.html" target="_blank">http://i27.photobucket.com/albums/c183/J75player/camping/0529091940.jpg</a> <a href="http://s27.photobucket.com/user/J75player/media/camping/morecamper.jpg.html" target="_blank">http://i27.photobucket.com/albums/c183/J75player/camping/morecamper.jpg</a> <a href="http://s27.photobucket.com/user/J75player/media/camping/camper.jpg.html" target="_blank">http://i27.photobucket.com/albums/c183/J75player/camping/camper.jpg</a> it worked great until we had a couple of kids. then it started getting small fast. we upgraded the tow rig and camper a couple years ago to a 28' dutchmen 5thwheel and a duramax pickup. ALOT more room inside, and lets me pull another trailer behind, tho I do miss the usefulness of my homebuilt. <a href="http://s27.photobucket.com/user/J75player/media/truck/IMG_20130428_183551_zps9e9931d8.jpg.html" target="_blank">http://i27.photobucket.com/albums/c183/J75player/truck/IMG_20130428_183551_zps9e9931d8.jpg</a> <a href="http://s27.photobucket.com/user/J75player/media/Mobile%20Uploads/NCM_0355_zpsb5b4b700.jpg.html" target="_blank">http://i27.photobucket.com/albums/c183/J75player/Mobile%20Uploads/NCM_0355_zpsb5b4b700.jpg</a> That's a cool set up. I have also seen people buy a cheap used pop up and mount it on a trailer in a similar way. They pull the wheels and axles off it and bolt it straight to the trailer. And just pop it up when they get set up. Works really well if your trying to haul 4 wheelers and motorcycles. |
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Posted: 12/30/2014 2:03:51 PM EDT
[#21]
I don't know if it is a problem everywhere but in the PNW perspiration and cooking water quickly invade the structure and mold quickly develops, with little sunshine and near 100% humidity wood framed trailers rot in as little as 4 years when lived in full time.
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Posted: 12/30/2014 3:43:04 PM EDT
[#22]
Greetings, These are the exact short comings we had with a travel trailer used as temporary housing while we were building our house during the winter in PA. Both the black and grey water tanks froze solid overnight more than once. It was quite the adventure getting them thawed out and emptied. Which brings up another point.............do you have relatively easy/close by facilities available to empty them into? It was a major difficulty due to the small size of the tanks. The one we rented also had some type of proprietary (well, non-standard anyway) propane fill port and the single tank was only 10 gal (EDIT: 10 Pound) capacity. We'd actually considered purchasing one, but were happy we'd not done that after the winter experience. They all seem to be made (in regards to insulation, etc.) for much warmer climets. I imagine someone could set up a trailer they owned to deal with these issues, but I don't see a factory build being up to the task. Good luck! Regards, Jim Quote HistoryQuoted:
Don't forget in the winter you have to work out how to keep water from freezing It's a real bitch to empty a frozen shitter tank also |
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Posted: 12/30/2014 8:01:23 PM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I don't know if it is a problem everywhere but in the PNW perspiration and cooking water quickly invade the structure and mold quickly develops, with little sunshine and near 100% humidity wood framed trailers rot in as little as 4 years when lived in full time. We've found condensation to be an issue living in a shipping container below an ODT of 30 degrees F. There are ways to mitigate it, tho it's a pain. |
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Posted: 12/30/2014 8:08:55 PM EDT
[#24]
http://cheap-easy-living.weebly.com/
here is a cheap air to air heat exchanger to mitigate moisture, I think "the wave " copied this method for their units. |
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Posted: 1/10/2015 12:08:51 AM EDT
[#25]
I saw this and thought of this thread.
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Posted: 1/10/2015 8:08:02 AM EDT
[#26]
When my parents were first married in 1960 dad was in college; they lived in a really small travel trailer in OH. When he graduated and they moved back to NY the trailer came back with them
I showed up and it was the three of us in this tiny little trailer. It's way before any personal recollection I have, but they often told the stories and the pictures tell the tale as well. By the time I was two dad was breaking his back to put up a house for the family. Point is,living in those small spaces can be done. Don't expect it to be comfortable or up to todays modern living standards of having every piece of consumer garbage society throws at you |
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