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Posted: 9/30/2014 2:47:12 AM EDT
[#1]
Contact a 2-way radio co like Motorola and rent time on one of their 'community' repeaters, and they will have the radios as well.
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Posted: 9/30/2014 8:09:46 AM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Contact a 2-way radio co like Motorola and rent time on one of their 'community' repeaters, and they will have the radios as well. Will these be working during a power outage? Even the ham repeaters around here will day after a few days of no power. |
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Posted: 9/30/2014 9:15:58 AM EDT
[#3]
Why isn't ham radio an option? The technician test is easy and the questions & answers are published. Getting some cheap UHF/VHF handsets and using a repeater will be a lot cheaper than a sat phone.
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Posted: 9/30/2014 9:31:52 AM EDT
[#4]
Ham is the way to go. If you have a week of evenings you can sit thru classes online via YouTube and take practice exams.
A crossband repeater is a few hundred dollars and simple to set up. here it is!!. Throw a line over a tall tree and hoist this puppy up. There are no code requirements anymore. Tech and general are very similar and one could easily get both in a sitting if you studied 15 hours or so. If everyone passed General then NVIS High Frequency comms would be available 500 miles or so. This will require a bit more practice than the crossband VHF UHF repeater above. CB and any of the other unlicensed bands FRS and MURS are not long haul enough. GMRS is a possibility if no one wants to spend a week of evenings studying. The cost for your GMRS repeater is going to be around a grand though. One 85 dollar lisence covers a "family". It does mean under one roof. Quoted:
Will these be working during a power outage? Even the ham repeaters around here will day after a few days of no power. Hams own quite a few generators. This and Solar will keep the repeaters up for a long time. We have Hams with trailers that have telescoping towers and spare repeaters just waiting for SHTF to roll this stuff out. |
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Posted: 9/30/2014 11:33:47 AM EDT
[#5]
If you're willing to squander that kind of cash for a sat. phone that isn't all that reliable. Buy some commercial Kenwoods or Motorola HTs and a couple desk top repeaters. build your own system.
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Posted: 9/30/2014 12:12:21 PM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Will these be working during a power outage? Even the ham repeaters around here will day after a few days of no power. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Contact a 2-way radio co like Motorola and rent time on one of their 'community' repeaters, and they will have the radios as well. Will these be working during a power outage? Even the ham repeaters around here will day after a few days of no power. I have a solar panel I put out in my backyard, with a battery inside, I am good to go all day long and half the night--HF, talking to the world, literally. The ham test questions are on line, and with a little bit of study (and I am talking a little bit)--just taking the practice exams, you can get your general license easy peasy. |
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Posted: 9/30/2014 12:37:37 PM EDT
[#7]
Your not getting 20 miles unless you're working HAM.
VHF/UHF have line of sight restrictions that would require tall antennas to see over the curvature of the earth. To get a 20 mile range you'd need a tower (on both ends) that is about 20 meters (66 feet) tall; preferably with no buildings or hills in between. Realistically I'd also up the power beyond what a 4-5watt HT will do (typical HAM HT). Can't position the antenna up high? Then HF will allow you to bounce the signals off the atmosphere easily getting the 20 miles. Again you'd need a HAM license (General Class) to do this with voice. Getting both the Tech and General is pretty easy. There are PDF study guides that actually give you all the answers while teaching the basics of radio and radio operations/safety; then take the online practice tests till you can't fail. |
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Posted: 9/30/2014 1:42:55 PM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Why isn't ham radio an option? The technician test is easy and the questions & answers are published. Getting some cheap UHF/VHF handsets and using a repeater will be a lot cheaper than a sat phone. How'd you get all of your extended family interested in studying and taking the test? |
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Posted: 9/30/2014 1:52:07 PM EDT
[#9]
Quoted:
SNIP All the 35-50 mile radios basically need to be on a clear line of site to work over anything over a mile (or so i read in reviews) SNIP This isn't correct or even close. It might be that with clever capitalization of the 4+ story units, direct commo between family members can be practical. Would need more info to make an informed guess. Since you have made clear [that many may have missed and responded with Wishful Thinking] that ham radio is out of the question... Once the practicality of VHF repeater commo is established [using 5 watt handhelds from the buildings to points around the area], I'd call a frequency coordination company and get a system licensed. You might be surprised what a small Yagi covered with a bag with flowers hanging from it, will do from a balcony. 
What's your budget, and geographical considerations/locations/elevations for the points you want to use? Years ago, we were able to maginally commo between an Expo W/T [or maybe it was an MX300] and my repeater with a commercial omni-gain antenna at ~35 feet, across half a city and river. probably ~10 to 15 miles. Gasfet preamp on the repeater end, and at ~460 mhz. VHF and high power would be far better. Sometimes the refraction of RF by 'obstructions' can be your friend. 
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Posted: 9/30/2014 2:02:10 PM EDT
[#10]
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Posted: 9/30/2014 2:03:36 PM EDT
[#11]
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Posted: 9/30/2014 2:48:35 PM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Once the practicality of VHF repeater commo is established [using 5 watt handhelds from the buildings to points around the area], I'd call a frequency coordination company and get a system licensed. Repeaters are great, one can get some serious range with them. However they have the following issues: 1) Cost - it costs to build and maintain a repeater. Not to mention building it with a SHTF capable type power source. 2) Altitude - you still need a tower to get the repeater's antennas up high enough so everyone can get LOS. Though this also works as an advantage as you'll only need 1 tower, instead of 1 at every location. 3) Still need a license. Even GRMS repeaters will require someone to get a license, as will a ham repeater. |
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Posted: 9/30/2014 3:24:57 PM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Repeaters are great, one can get some serious range with them. However they have the following issues: 1) Cost - it costs to build and maintain a repeater. Not to mention building it with a SHTF capable type power source. 2) Altitude - you still need a tower to get the repeater's antennas up high enough so everyone can get LOS. Though this also works as an advantage as you'll only need 1 tower, instead of 1 at every location. 3) Still need a license. Even GRMS repeaters will require someone to get a license, as will a ham repeater. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Once the practicality of VHF repeater commo is established [using 5 watt handhelds from the buildings to points around the area], I'd call a frequency coordination company and get a system licensed. Repeaters are great, one can get some serious range with them. However they have the following issues: 1) Cost - it costs to build and maintain a repeater. Not to mention building it with a SHTF capable type power source. 2) Altitude - you still need a tower to get the repeater's antennas up high enough so everyone can get LOS. Though this also works as an advantage as you'll only need 1 tower, instead of 1 at every location. 3) Still need a license. Even GRMS repeaters will require someone to get a license, as will a ham repeater. All trivial if the OP has the budget. BTW, you must be a 'flat-lander'... 
There are more options for elevation. Hills, mountains, tall condos. 
Have used them all....
There's radios now on ebay that I could put on the air for ~$100 in a couple hours and have a top quality Tait repeater. Oh, re repeater cost, I've posted REPEATEDLY abt REPEATERS [no pun intended] being able to be built at low cost [by MOTIVATED folks] on the Ham forum. |
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Posted: 9/30/2014 3:34:34 PM EDT
[#14]
It's certainly easy to build a low duty cycle repeater on the cheap. Better train your users on that limitation.
I agree mountains and tall buildings can and are used for repeaters, if you have access to them, and IF locating the repeater there will produce a footprint that will cover all the places you need. Repeater is an option, with most of the same issues as just getting ham radios, plus an infrastructure burden. |
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Posted: 9/30/2014 3:42:03 PM EDT
[#15]
Go old school.
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Posted: 9/30/2014 7:33:28 PM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
It's certainly easy to build a low duty cycle repeater on the cheap. Better train your users on that limitation.
I agree mountains and tall buildings can and are used for repeaters, if you have access to them, and IF locating the repeater there will produce a footprint that will cover all the places you need. Repeater is an option, with most of the same issues as just getting ham radios, plus an infrastructure burden. The Tait repeaters are top notch commercial repeater radios. Duty cycle is no issue for the commercial license/operation likely to be granted to the OP. The issue the OP seems to have is getting the family away from their distractions, the flat screen, and a seriousness of purpose, to get a ham license. The infrastructure, as you say, also requires a seriousness of purpose and motivation. |
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Posted: 10/1/2014 12:01:23 AM EDT
[#17]
Quoted:HAM radio really isn't an option.  I got nothing.
I'm looking at expanding my amateur radio into packet communications. |
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Posted: 10/1/2014 8:38:54 AM EDT
[#18]
in theory you could get a business license and run mobile radios with external antennas - have HTs for walking about.....
but at that point you're spending multiple thousands of dollars, and you'll still need the knowledge that ham radio will give you. so why isn't ham an option besides the testing (which for a tech ticket is easy enough for kids to do) |
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Posted: 10/1/2014 10:37:15 AM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted: How'd you get all of your extended family interested in studying and taking the test? Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Why isn't ham radio an option? The technician test is easy and the questions & answers are published. Getting some cheap UHF/VHF handsets and using a repeater will be a lot cheaper than a sat phone. How'd you get all of your extended family interested in studying and taking the test? The technician test is really easy. I passed tech and general my first try. If I can, anyone can but you make a good point some people just aren't motivated and won't try. If you can get at least one person at each location, I'd go the ham route. If you have the money go with HF equipment. I love knowing I can talk to anyone worldwide with nothing but the radio and an antenna. Well I can when my transmitter is working but that's another story. |
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Posted: 10/1/2014 10:58:23 AM EDT
[#20]
OP, I just took the HAM test and passed. The free online practice tests on QRZ helped me pass. I already have FD/EMS radios, but this opened up many more doors. You can, and it will be easy to do HAM. You can get gear cheaper than sat phones. GO for HAM OP.
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Posted: 10/1/2014 11:56:03 AM EDT
[#21]
Quoted:
My immediate family (parents) (sibling) and I all live with in about a 20 mile radius of one another, recently my father asked my to look into radios for us to communicate in a disaster type situation given the current political climate as this would be most important to us. We live in Dallas, Downtown to North Suburbs, so lots of obstructions. Though two of us live (adult children) live in 4+ story units, even then line of site is limited by surrounding obstructions. All the 35-50 mile radios basically need to be on a clear line of site to work over anything over a mile (or so i read in reviews) HAM radio really isn't an option. I've looked at SAT phones and data devices, which seem plausible. You can buy a device for $300-$800 and then get a prepaid SIM for roughly $100 for 100 Minutes. There are some more reasonable "data only" devices that will essentially allow you to connect a wifi device and then send texts / emails. Just wondering what others suggest. Guys, I know we all do this, but lets stay on subject! 
In my opinion the best solution is get your ham ticket, as others have said Tech license is not difficult at all. After that, GMRS is the way to go and since you mentioned application is for Disasters, I would build a repeater setup like the referenced youtube video using the Chinese uv-5r or uv-82 radios. They are cheap and also transmit and receives on the entire Ham and GMRS bands. Get permission and put that on top of a high building and you are good to go. I would also add two slimjim rollup (or something similar for portability) antennas, a 7 Amp Hour battery and a solar panel setup to your repeater and you dont have to visit your set up too often. Also after you get your Ham license, you can switch frequencies and use it during non disaster times. This is the end product I would shoot for but not necessarily start at if you think it is overwhelming. Just start with a set up using Chinese radios and built the setup in the video! BTW, your range is purely a function of Effective Radiated Power (ERP) and height of the antenna. Also, its much easier and efficient to increase the ERP using higher gain antennas than increasing power! |
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Posted: 10/1/2014 2:14:34 PM EDT
[#22]
There is one point of logic I haven't seen anyone mention.
Typically people like the OP are novices in the field of radio communication and they're looking for the most bang for their buck, in both time and money. The cost of implementing a solution OUTSIDE of ham radio requires SO MUCH MORE of both (time first to learn about the stuff then ongoing to maintain it) and money (to reinvent the wheel putting in your own equipment instead of using the vast network of ham repeaters and authorized frequencies). By the time you research and figure out all you need to implement a private repeater system, you could have easily passed 35 multiple choice questions and jumped on the bandwagon for nearly free. A very nominal front-end investment of energy to pick up a license opens the door to so many resources that are freely available and already figured-out. There's a reason the slang term for a ham license is a "ticket." Now I completely realize OP needs a solution that accommodates other family members too, but this is the reality. I'm toying with the idea of trying to ham cram my family to get them on board. Maybe another year or two to get the kids old enough. Remember the reason public safety workers can afford to just be plug-n-play appliance users is because beaucoup $$ have been spent purchasing, engineering and licensing radio systems that facilitate such ease of use. 35 questions and $15 fee opens the door (for life) to a world that in some respects can run circles around said public safety systems. |
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Posted: 10/1/2014 2:57:01 PM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
. 35 questions and $15 fee opens the door (for life) to a world that in some respects can run circles around said public safety systems. In some locations the test is free. I know one of our local clubs runs tests twice a month for free (both my Tech and General all I had to to was show up - and I'm wasn't a member of the club). So even the measly $15 shouldn't be an issue with a little looking around. |
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Posted: 10/1/2014 4:05:09 PM EDT
[#24]
Do folks ever read and comprehend the various posts incl the OP's original one???
He said ham is NOT an option. Yet the wishful thinking crowd keep rambling for the OP to get his family to get their ham license.
Also, to the poster who says it will cost 'thousands' for a commercial system, did you even read where it can be done for far less??? Reading comprehension in so many of these threads is completely out the window. I can't fathom how some get thru the day....
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Posted: 10/1/2014 4:13:54 PM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Do folks ever read and comprehend the various posts incl the OP's original one??? He said ham is NOT an option. Yet the wishful thinking crowd keep rambling for the OP to get his family to get their ham license.
Also, to the poster who says it will cost 'thousands' for a commercial system, did you even read where it can be done for far less??? Reading comprehension in so many of these threads is completely out the window. I can't fathom how some get thru the day....
Perhaps OP could take the time to explain why ham is "really not an option" with no further qualification, when it's pretty well established as the standard solution for this type of communications problem?
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Posted: 10/1/2014 4:15:48 PM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Do folks ever read and comprehend the various posts incl the OP's original one??? He said ham is NOT an option. Yep, I read it very clearly...and rejected his conclusion. He doesn't have to accept it, but his wouldn't be the first mind that was opened by persuasive reasoning of Arfcommers.
My premise is that ham may have been ruled out prematurely and, like other posters, I sought to provide insight on that avenue. If after my best efforts that dog still won't hunt, OP can scroll right on past. So relax, bud. No need for the reading police. Congrats on the economical repeater -- sounds cool. |
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Posted: 10/1/2014 4:32:52 PM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Perhaps OP could take the time to explain why ham is "really not an option" with no further qualification, when it's pretty well established as the standard solution for this type of communications problem?
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Do folks ever read and comprehend the various posts incl the OP's original one??? He said ham is NOT an option. Yet the wishful thinking crowd keep rambling for the OP to get his family to get their ham license.
Also, to the poster who says it will cost 'thousands' for a commercial system, did you even read where it can be done for far less??? Reading comprehension in so many of these threads is completely out the window. I can't fathom how some get thru the day....
Perhaps OP could take the time to explain why ham is "really not an option" with no further qualification, when it's pretty well established as the standard solution for this type of communications problem?
I think it may have to do with the number of family folks he want's to have commo capability, and their 'Sheeple type' lack of interest due to their million other distractions, and complete disinterest. My engineer neighbor in the mountains 3/4 mile away, just poo-poos the fact that I offered him commo at no friggin cost to him, to stay in touch if he should have an emergency or injury. He barely will touch a radio, I really don't know what his issue is. Of the folks I know, family or not, I can't think of ONE who would seriously entertain having a serious interest in coms, even if they Magically got a ham radio license with no effort. In fact, I think if you asked 99% of folks to just drive across town to pick up their license, they'd rather watch Opera and drink wine instead. That's the sad reality and part of the reason the US is heading downhill -fast. As far as ham being the 'standard solution' ---it wasn't for me [at several locations and times] because of the [lack of interest] reasons enumerated above, so I elected to take the next best solution.
Or in my case, the BEST! |
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Posted: 10/1/2014 4:41:51 PM EDT
[#28]
It takes a 'special' mindset to be 'prepared' with commo and ensure it's available 24/7, maintained and charged and working, and I'll bet $5 to a donut that the OP will be amazed at the lack of family interest, in general, in the unlikely event he should establish a commo system.
Pathetic reality of human nature. |
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Posted: 10/1/2014 4:44:27 PM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I think it may have to do with the number of family folks he want's to have commo capability, and their 'Sheeple type' lack of interest due to their million other distractions, and complete disinterest. My neighbor in the mountains 3/4 mile away, just poo-poos the fact that I offered him commo at no friggin cost to him, to stay in touch if he should have an emergency or injury. Of the folks I know, family or not, I can't think of ONE who would seriously entertain having a serious interest in coms, even if they Magically got a ham radio license with no effort. In fact, I think if you asked 99% of folks to just drive across town to pick up their license, they'd rather watch Opera and drink wine instead. That's the sad reality and part of the reason the US is heading downhill -fast. As far as being the 'standard solution' ---it wasn't for me [at several locations and times] because of the [lack of interest] reasons enumerated above, so I elected to take the next best solution.
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Do folks ever read and comprehend the various posts incl the OP's original one??? He said ham is NOT an option. Yet the wishful thinking crowd keep rambling for the OP to get his family to get their ham license.
Also, to the poster who says it will cost 'thousands' for a commercial system, did you even read where it can be done for far less??? Reading comprehension in so many of these threads is completely out the window. I can't fathom how some get thru the day....
Perhaps OP could take the time to explain why ham is "really not an option" with no further qualification, when it's pretty well established as the standard solution for this type of communications problem?
I think it may have to do with the number of family folks he want's to have commo capability, and their 'Sheeple type' lack of interest due to their million other distractions, and complete disinterest. My neighbor in the mountains 3/4 mile away, just poo-poos the fact that I offered him commo at no friggin cost to him, to stay in touch if he should have an emergency or injury. Of the folks I know, family or not, I can't think of ONE who would seriously entertain having a serious interest in coms, even if they Magically got a ham radio license with no effort. In fact, I think if you asked 99% of folks to just drive across town to pick up their license, they'd rather watch Opera and drink wine instead. That's the sad reality and part of the reason the US is heading downhill -fast. As far as being the 'standard solution' ---it wasn't for me [at several locations and times] because of the [lack of interest] reasons enumerated above, so I elected to take the next best solution.
From what I've seen of your posts, I don't think I'd consider you 'standard'... ... and that's meant as a compliment, not a jab. You bring a lot to the forum.
As for the family/ham issues, I have the same problem. I'm working on my license now, but no way I can get the rest of the family interested. Doesn't matter to me... in a true SHTF situation, I have no qualms about handing each family member a HT and giving them a quick primer on how to use it. FCC regs will not be at the top of my list if the New Madrid fault has just turned Missouri into a giant sinkhole. For that matter, I believe the FCC clears ham use for non-licensees in an emergency situation. |
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Posted: 10/1/2014 4:53:02 PM EDT
[#30]
Thanks...
I know exactly what you're saying, and I've been a ham for a long time. Anything goes in an actual emergency, and I would do the same thing. But, without the 'experience' [I know, to get them to get it is like pulling teeth from a chicken] will they be able to effectively communicate with whatever you hand them? Especially if they have to use a ham repeater, that who knows what reaction other hams may have in an emergency environment to untrained 'strangers'. [Assuming they need to use a repeater to com over an extended distance, that mobile or hand-helds won't cover] [Just because someone is a ham doesn't imply they have mental stability, I can assure you of that, and won't uh, interrupt, their coms] Do you have sufficient need and budget to set up an alternate commo system for friends and family outside of the ham arena? Actually, we're right back to the OP's dilemma.... |
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Posted: 10/1/2014 5:03:00 PM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Actually, we're right back to the OP's dilemma.... Indeed. After re-reading the OP, I see now that it's parents/siblings, and so the "emergency only" ham solution probably isn't the best. It might work, but it'd definitely be at the very edge of HT range... nearest repeater I can hear with the standard whip antenna is right at 20 miles away, and I doubt seriously I'd be able to transmit to it. Wonder if MURS is an option? I don't know the range of those, but always figured it was similar to FRS/GMRS. |
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Posted: 10/1/2014 5:08:22 PM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
There's radios now on ebay that I could put on the air for ~$100 in a couple hours and have a top quality Tait repeater. Quote HistoryQuoted:
There's radios now on ebay that I could put on the air for ~$100 in a couple hours and have a top quality Tait repeater. Where are you finding those deals, I can't find ANY repeaters Tait or otherwise on eBay or Amazone at 7 times that price. A good inexpensive repeater would be a good thing to have. For the repeater to not be ham we'd be talking a GRMS repeater. Not a bad option if you got the right location to place it, but it sounds like the 4 story buildings won't be tall enough to get the signal to the other side of Dallas. Also instead of a free-$15 license renewed every 10 years, each family will be legally obligated to get a $85 license every 5 years. Oh, re repeater cost, I've posted REPEATEDLY abt REPEATERS [no pun intended] being able to be built at low cost [by MOTIVATED folks] on the Ham forum. Easy to do with a couple HTs, but then again we're going back to HAM; and these would be low duty. |
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Posted: 10/1/2014 5:21:17 PM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Where are you finding those deals, I can't find ANY repeaters Tait or otherwise on eBay or Amazone at 7 times that price. A good inexpensive repeater would be a good thing to have. For the repeater to not be ham we'd be talking a GRMS repeater. Not a bad option if you got the right location to place it, but it sounds like the 4 story buildings won't be tall enough to get the signal to the other side of Dallas. Also instead of a free-$15 license renewed every 10 years, each family will be legally obligated to get a $85 license every 5 years. Easy to do with a couple HTs, but then again we're going back to HAM; and these would be low duty. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
There's radios now on ebay that I could put on the air for ~$100 in a couple hours and have a top quality Tait repeater. Where are you finding those deals, I can't find ANY repeaters Tait or otherwise on eBay or Amazone at 7 times that price. A good inexpensive repeater would be a good thing to have. For the repeater to not be ham we'd be talking a GRMS repeater. Not a bad option if you got the right location to place it, but it sounds like the 4 story buildings won't be tall enough to get the signal to the other side of Dallas. Also instead of a free-$15 license renewed every 10 years, each family will be legally obligated to get a $85 license every 5 years. Oh, re repeater cost, I've posted REPEATEDLY abt REPEATERS [no pun intended] being able to be built at low cost [by MOTIVATED folks] on the Ham forum. Easy to do with a couple HTs, but then again we're going back to HAM; and these would be low duty. You must not have looked very hard...
Search on ebay... tait (receiver, module, transmitter, speaker, panel, manual, repeater, radio, t300, t800, vhf, uhf, mobile) -cable -songs -battery -t20 Tons of amazing deals for top notch easy to service radios, and the documentation and SW is readily available. I like these FAR better than Motorola, because they are so easy to service and mod. The receiver modules can be interfaced to a transmitter module with 4 wires to make a repeater. Also, to avoid a duplexer, the receiver has a balanced audio transformer built in to connect to a transmitter module some distance away, 10 feet or miles via a phone line. You're thinking a $100 or so is a stumbling block??? Chump change for the capability. As far as building height, you're purely speculating. I suggested the OP take a couple 5 watt handhelds and run some tests.
"Easy to do with a couple HTs, but then again we're going back to HAM; and these would be low duty." I have no idea what point you're trying to make. 
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Posted: 10/1/2014 5:25:38 PM EDT
[#34]
I am not going to echo what everyone else already said, But if you want to get ham radio equipment you don't need a license to buy it. The FCC is not going to be standing outside your door waiting to bust in and throw cuffs on when you key up without a license. Just don't be stupid with it and follow the general courtesy that hams use.
CB is also an option but having just installed one in my Jeep I have found the majority of CB is just morons in the south running thousands of watts of power to babble overpowering anything else. The tech license is easy like others have said. But I wouldn't be stressing out about it. |
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Posted: 10/1/2014 5:50:59 PM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
You must not have looked very hard...
Search on ebay... tait (receiver, module, transmitter, speaker, panel, manual, repeater, radio, t300, t800, vhf, uhf, mobile) -cable -songs -battery -t20 Quote HistoryQuoted:
You must not have looked very hard...
Search on ebay... tait (receiver, module, transmitter, speaker, panel, manual, repeater, radio, t300, t800, vhf, uhf, mobile) -cable -songs -battery -t20 Actually I did, anything 'repeater' was pricy, there were some inexpensive components, but I'm not up on which of those cheap components to get and cobble together to make a GRMS repeater. I'm thinking you should start a thread on this topic and walk us through it. You're thinking a $100 or so is a stumbling block??? Chump change for the capability. I'm thinking that is dirt cheap for a commercial level repeater. I'd love to have one to set up - it would be better than the DIY field repeater from 2 HTs. As far as building height, you're purely speculating. I suggested the OP take a couple 5 watt handhelds and run some tests. Not really. He mentioned his LOS was surrounded by obstructions. Seeing as the location mentioned was in Dallas, there are enough tall buildings that just trying to bounce a signal off a building isn't likely to solve the issues. Then even with an unobstructed LOS that 4 story building better be darn close to the middle of the 20 miles circle to be able to deal with the Earth's curvature. A couple of those 5W Uniden GRMS radios are around $150 - that should be good for the initial testing. It's too bad you can't upgrade the antennas. |
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Posted: 10/1/2014 5:54:20 PM EDT
[#36]
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The FCC is not going to be standing outside your door waiting to bust in and throw cuffs on when you key up without a license. . Except he wants to do it in a major metropolitan area, and there are hams that get off on turning in unlicensed operators. Pretty easy to do when people aren't using legitimate call signs. If you're not going to buy a license then go with GRMS, 5W handhelds are available now, there is a chance the FCC may drop the licensing requirement, and if they don't finding "bubble pack pirates" (a new term I learned today) is real low on their priority list unless your signal is interfering with licensed operations. |
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Posted: 10/1/2014 6:26:35 PM EDT
[#37]
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Except he wants to do it in a major metropolitan area, and there are hams that get off on turning in unlicensed operators. Pretty easy to do when people aren't using legitimate call signs. If you're not going to buy a license then go with GRMS, 5W handhelds are available now, there is a chance the FCC may drop the licensing requirement, and if they don't finding "bubble pack pirates" (a new term I learned today) is real low on their priority list unless your signal is interfering with licensed operations. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
The FCC is not going to be standing outside your door waiting to bust in and throw cuffs on when you key up without a license. . Except he wants to do it in a major metropolitan area, and there are hams that get off on turning in unlicensed operators. Pretty easy to do when people aren't using legitimate call signs. If you're not going to buy a license then go with GRMS, 5W handhelds are available now, there is a chance the FCC may drop the licensing requirement, and if they don't finding "bubble pack pirates" (a new term I learned today) is real low on their priority list unless your signal is interfering with licensed operations. Forest, you're sorta being silly-negative with little real technical meat to contribute.
Here's pics of an older portable Tait repeater that uses their standard modules... 
They are usually found in racks with a transmitter and receiver modules, and often with an AC supply and speaker module. The modules run on 12 vdc and the standby current drain is plenty low to make them excellent candidates for solar power, as I do. I've found several of the above portable repeaters in VHF and UHF for less than $100 each. They are usually the 'previous' narrow band spec, band and easily converted to the new FCC requirements for 12.5 kHz spacing [or whatever] with about 12 components to change. The rack mounted modules are my preference for faster access when setting up. The older Series1 modules use an easily programmable eprom and the newer Series 2 modules have eeprom internally and are programmed from a PC. The Series 1 in performance are similar to the Series 2 and I prefer them and collect them. Repeater Builders has lots of Tait info and the Yahoo Group for Tait has tons, with the manuals, schematics, etc, and the SW. A quick Google will have most of the manuals and schematics in PDF. I have been collecting data as I can find it for years
Typical rack mount, receiver, speaker, transmitter, PS, modules 
New Tait repeater, portable Tait's website |
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Posted: 10/1/2014 7:02:23 PM EDT
[#38]
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I am not going to echo what everyone else already said, But if you want to get ham radio equipment you don't need a license to buy it. The FCC is not going to be standing outside your door waiting to bust in and throw cuffs on when you key up without a license. Just don't be stupid with it and follow the general courtesy that hams use. CB is also an option but having just installed one in my Jeep I have found the majority of CB is just morons in the south running thousands of watts of power to babble overpowering anything else. The tech license is easy like others have said. But I wouldn't be stressing out about it. 
no need to drop the $200 on a tax stamp for that suppressor either 
CB could work but isn't too reliable and is usually full of entirely too much BS |
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Posted: 10/1/2014 7:38:00 PM EDT
[#39]
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HAM radio really isn't an option. You say ham radio isn't an option, but you never say why. Frankly, if you want to do this without depending on infrastructure, ham radio isn't an option, it's a necessity. |
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Posted: 10/1/2014 8:14:52 PM EDT
[#40]
Expy, that setup in the 2 meter band would be kick ass!
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Posted: 10/1/2014 8:33:09 PM EDT
[#41]
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Expy, that setup in the 2 meter band would be kick ass! YES! Keep your eyes on the ebay auctions for manuals and equipment. The available parts change every day. The very early modules use $20 crystals and are arguably easier to set up if you don't want to fiddle w/ pgm'ing an eprom. If you decide to pursue this for 2M, MURS, GMRS, 440, or whatever, I'll be glad to give you some guidance that came dearly to me. My familiarity is primarily the Series 1. All you need really, is a rcvr and xmitter module for the appropriate band. Just 2 modules! The Tait radios are a dirty little secret that not many are familiar w/. I was attracted to them from working on Motorola because of the availability of easy frequency changing and the 'construction' is more straightforward, most of the options are built inside, selected with jumpers, etc. They are an easy quality and inexpensive solution to get a nice repeater.
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Posted: 10/1/2014 8:54:39 PM EDT
[#42]
Incidentally, I monitor a MURS freq and rarely hear any traffic from a high elevation. [Just heard something now that made me think of this]
So, that might be a suggestion where to start w/ your SHTF repeater, altho non emergency repeater ops are prohibited...
NO licenses are required or issued for MURS. |
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Posted: 10/1/2014 9:50:45 PM EDT
[#43]
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<snip> CB could work but isn't too reliable and is usually full of entirely too much BS I was going to mention this, specifically SSB CB. Pretty sure a decent 1/4W rooftop antenna and SSB rigs (which run 12W peak) would probably cover it base-to-base. I usually see 15 miles as the practical range for SSB base stations. Unfortunately squelch doesn't work too well with SSB so they'll have to deal with the BS, but at least it'd be something. Plus, with a good antenna even AM might work depending on terrain. 20 miles really isn't that far with decent antennas on any band, it all just comes down to terrain. |
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Posted: 10/1/2014 10:23:32 PM EDT
[#44]
Maybe I missed it, but did the OP specifically say he requires voice commo? If not, perhaps using those new DeLorme InReach satcom text message units would suffice. No reliance on local power at all. And, can send text messages between InReach units without having to go thru the cell network.
Linky |
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Posted: 10/1/2014 10:45:57 PM EDT
[#45]
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Maybe I missed it, but did the OP specifically say he requires voice commo? If not, perhaps using those new DeLorme InReach satcom text message units would suffice. No reliance on local power at all. And, can send text messages between InReach units without having to go thru the cell network. Linky I think he left the 'text' solution open. |
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Posted: 10/1/2014 11:05:29 PM EDT
[#46]
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Maybe I missed it, but did the OP specifically say he requires voice commo? If not, perhaps using those new DeLorme InReach satcom text message units would suffice. No reliance on local power at all. And, can send text messages between InReach units without having to go thru the cell network. Linky That's some out of the box thinking 
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Posted: 10/2/2014 2:34:20 PM EDT
[#47]
In case people are wondering if the FCC actually monitors for problems: Two HAMs were warned by FCC for talking to long w/o identifying their stations.
Just a reminder to keep it legal. |
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Posted: 10/4/2014 4:35:41 AM EDT
[#48]
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That's some out of the box thinking Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Maybe I missed it, but did the OP specifically say he requires voice commo? If not, perhaps using those new DeLorme InReach satcom text message units would suffice. No reliance on local power at all. And, can send text messages between InReach units without having to go thru the cell network. Linky That's some out of the box thinking FWIW, the InReach units are slicker than snot and work exactly as advertised. I love mine
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Posted: 10/4/2014 7:59:35 AM EDT
[#49]
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VMkULsNU2_A
you could use one of these controllers and add any type of radio you want to, even add a brick amplifier to the radio and boost the output to 50 watts. this is easily done with minimal outlay in cash, place this repeater in a location central to your group and you will be in business. alex |
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Posted: 10/4/2014 1:23:21 PM EDT
[#50]
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FWIW, the InReach units are slicker than snot and work exactly as advertised. I love mine
http://home.comcast.net/~cjan99999/delorme_inreach.jpg Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Maybe I missed it, but did the OP specifically say he requires voice commo? If not, perhaps using those new DeLorme InReach satcom text message units would suffice. No reliance on local power at all. And, can send text messages between InReach units without having to go thru the cell network. Linky That's some out of the box thinking FWIW, the InReach units are slicker than snot and work exactly as advertised. I love mine
http://home.comcast.net/~cjan99999/delorme_inreach.jpg Looks like "SPOT" also makes one (SPOT Connect.) Never heard of these sat text link devices before but they look pretty neat. http://www.findmespot.com/en/index.php?cid=116 |
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