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Posted: 8/15/2010 7:50:45 AM EDT
Can someone educate me on these?  My house was built in 1918.  We renovated it and have been heating it with a Fisher Papa Bear wood stove for 21 years.  My wifes' asthama has now got to the point where we will not be able to use the stove inside.  I have central heat and air in the house but would rather put in a boiler and still use wood to heat.  Can't stand the thought of giving the gas company that much money when I am sitting on 130 acres of woods.

Any info especially personal preferences on these would be helpful.  I have several neighbors that have these and they are telling me different things.  Not sure really how much they researched them before buying.   One says get the stainless firebox and another says not to.  My house is 2100 sq ft and I have a perfect place to put the bolier about 100' from the house under a carport cover.

I don't know what type/brand to look at.  I just have to get this in before winter so my wife can breathe.

Any help is greatly appreciated.
Link Posted: 8/15/2010 8:27:00 AM EDT
[#1]
Around here, most folks I know who have a wood boiler are using either a Hardy, or Central Boiler. I am sure there are many good brands. I currently use a indoor wood furnace, but wish I had put the cost of an outdoor boiler into the loan when I built.

Good luck!

ETA: My ex-inlaws use a Hardy to heat a large house using a heat-exchanger and existing ductwork. It really works amazingly well, and they only have to fill up the stove twice a day at the most. Iowa winters get pretty darn chilly too.
Link Posted: 8/15/2010 12:18:10 PM EDT
[#2]
IMHO, I'd try spending money on insulation, caulk, and weatherstripping first.  

If you are in the mountains, a water stove may be okay, but I'm concerned about the draft since the winters generally don't get too cold regularly.  

If you want to go that route, consider Hicks Water Stoves in Mount Airy.  A neighbor had one of their systems for over 20 years and loved it (Winston-Salem area).  (I bought the solar panels that went with the system from him and they appeared to be very good quality.)
http://www.hickswaterstoves.com/

As for location away from the house, consider predominant wind directions during the winter.

Good luck.
Link Posted: 8/15/2010 1:08:32 PM EDT
[#3]
After about a year of research we decided to purchase a central broiler outdoor stove.  Initial expense is high, and it will take a number of years to pay off the fuel savings at current prices.  We decided to purchase it due to several factors I will list below.

1) We had saved up the money to purchase it for cash, and the model we purchased qualifies for a tax rebate this year.

2) We have more firewood available on our own property than we can use.

3) We are concerned that we have no ability to control fuel oil prices, limited storage ability, and I believe that the price of fuel oil will increase.  A second benefit is that we can use the heating oil currently in our full heating oil tanks as tractor / PTO generator fuel if necessary.

4) While we have a high quality indoor stove, I have some fire concerns, and also 5 children with the oldest being 10.  A ER trip for a serious burn could easily cover the cost of the money invested in the outdoor stove.

5) Since we already have an indoor stove (as it sounds like you do also) We already have a source of back up heat if we loose power.

6) Due to a change in my job I will have more free time than before, but with a substantial reduction in take home pay.  I will have time to cut the wood.

Concerns:
Unlike an indoor stove, the outdoor stove requires electricity.  It will need it to both run the air blowers, and the pumps to circulate the hot water.  While the current draw is light, running a generator just to run the pumps and blower is not efficient.  We plan to (but do not yet) have an inverter with several batteries to cover this current draw and a few LED lights in the house.

The initial expense is high.  We have about $13,000 in the stove, spare pump parts and piping.  We picked a efficient model with a long firebox guarantee, the Central broiler E classic 2400.  We paid $11 a foot for the insulated piping just from the stove to the house, and while the closer you are from house to boiler, the less loss there is, there would be a little higher risk of smoke bothering you, or sparks setting something on fire (not a large risk either).

We have not yet actually used the stove as we are still installing the piping and wiring into the system ourselves (to save money) with our existing oil boiler, so I can not tell you how I like it yet.  We chose to install the outdoor stove into the existing oil burner, so that if the outdoor stove was not filled the existing boiler would keep the house pipes from freezing as long as we have electricity.  I believe we will like it.

As a note: We had a hard time choosing between the Central broiler and the Heatmor systems, I believe both manufacturers produce a high quality product.

Edited to add, Both of the manufacturers produce boilers at less cost than what we purchased.  It may be worth your while to talk to a dealer in your area and see if there are any concerns due to state or county requirments regarding required efficiency for the boiler.  This is becoming more of an issue in many states.
Link Posted: 8/30/2010 3:43:18 PM EDT
[#4]
Thanks for all the ideas.  I have been researching this for the last month.  

I think I am going with a Shaver wood furnace.  It seems to have the thickest fire box and best warranty.  I did find a few complaints with the BBB on them.  I talked with a sales person at the company tonight.  They are in Salem, Arkansas.  They explained the complaints were all in the same year 2008.  They were still doing orders on paper and received over 800 orders when fuel prices skyrocketed.  They lost track and messed up several orders.  I can understand that.

Does anyone here have one of these or any other info on them?  One thing I really like is the fact they use no proprietary parts on them.  The pumps and blowers can all be bought at Grainger.
Link Posted: 9/10/2010 12:33:38 PM EDT
[#5]
Ended up going with a Central Boiler.  Put the deposit down today with a dealer in town.  Just to leary of Shaver and some of their claims on the website after doing a little investigating.  Going to intall myself and include pictures.  Maybe I can help someone else.
Link Posted: 9/10/2010 4:07:20 PM EDT
[#6]
We installed our Central bioler two years ago.  the hardest part was drilling through the concrete foundation.  I burn about six cord here in New England from end of October til April.  My annual oil consumption on a 1800 sq ft ranch with full basement is around 170 gallons a year. Personally the best decision we ever made regarding alternate heating.  good luck with your project


 
Link Posted: 11/5/2010 7:48:35 AM EDT
[#7]
Got her put in and heating.  Working on getting the thermostat working and finishing insulating everything.  

Took close to 2 months doing the work myself.

Pics this weekend.
Link Posted: 12/10/2010 7:43:40 AM EDT
[#8]
Ok, finally had a few minutes to put the pictures together.  I bought a Central Boiler 5036.  The model number means the firebox is 36 inches wide and 50 inched deep.  It holds a little less than 200 gallons of water.  I started researching them a while back but had a hard time deciding which manufacturer to go with.  It is really not a boiler.  The water never reachs boiling and it is not a closed pressure vessel.  There is a vent at the top of the tank.

Benefits I believe made Central Boiler the best choice for me.
1.  Only 1 supply and 1 return line.
2.  Only 1 pump needed.
3.  No artificial draft fan.  (From comparing mine to a neighbors, I believe mine uses less wood).  This one has a natural draft.
4.  Smoke exhaust comes out of the back of the stove.  Not up through it.  If it needs replacing, just remove it from the rear of the firebox.
5.  Much larger firebox than other manufacturers.  Mine is twice the size of my neighbors Taylor.  I can put much larger pieces of wood in it.
6.  Thermal pex pipe.  Much less heat loss than other manufacturers pvc with insulation wrapped around the pipe.  Look at the pics for a description.
7.  Hot water heat exchanger is replaceable.  Other stoves have a coil in the actual water stove.  Much harder to replace. (neighbor told me about his)
8.  Dealer in town who was well stocked with parts.

I installed 112 feet of pex pipe.  The furnace has its own thermostat that keeps the water between 178 and 188 degrees.  It is adjustable.  As long as there is wood in it and power to it, the water stays at that temperature.  The taco pump runs all the time.  It pumps water to the house and in through the heat exchanger mounted on my water heater.  This heats the water for showers, ect.  It then comes out of that heat exchanger into the 140K BTU exchanger I installed into my plenum.  I had to get a sheet metal company to make a box that screwed onto the bottom of my current heating and air ducts.  That cost $134.  The exchanger slid into the box.  I then had to plumb the inside and insulate all the piping.  The line that comes out of the heat exchanger runs through the floor and back out to the furnace to be reheated.

Since my gas pack was not operational,  I was able to move one wire on my exhisting thermostat inside the house, and use the regular heat setting to control my heat.  When I set it in the heat position and the thermostat calls for heat, it turns on only the blower fan.  This blows air across the heat exchanger in the plenum and through the duct work.  In the summer, I switch back to air.  I can also still heat my hot water in the summer.  If you look at one of the pics below, you will see a yellow valve handle next to the hot water heater.  This valve diverts water from the hot water heat exchanger around the plenum one and sends it straight back to the furnace.

Edit:  Total cost on this was $10,500.  Installation would have been another 3-4k or so.  I did it myself with the help of a few family and FD members.


Here are the pics:







































Link Posted: 12/10/2010 8:17:40 AM EDT
[#9]
Also, just fyi, you can ignore the gas line you see in the trench.  My old line to my gas logs had developed a few pin holes in it.  I went ahead and replaced it while the trench was open.  I has nothing to do with the water stove.
Link Posted: 12/10/2010 9:44:03 AM EDT
[#10]
From the research I've done, there are many good brands out there.  If you want max efficiency make sure it is a wood gasification boiler.   They burn so cleanly, that they even qualify for a tax credit.  
http://www.woodgasificationfurnace.com/outdoor-furnaces.php
Link Posted: 12/10/2010 7:55:03 PM EDT
[#11]
Quoted:
From the research I've done, there are many good brands out there.  If you want max efficiency make sure it is a wood gasification boiler.   They burn so cleanly, that they even qualify for a tax credit.  
http://www.woodgasificationfurnace.com/outdoor-furnaces.php


You are correct on the gasification models.  "E" series by Central Boiler.  But my dealer also told me that you have to use well seasoned hardwood ONLY in these stoves.  Using anything else can cause it to clog the lower chamber and give problems.  Since I have 130 acres of all types of wood, I decided to go with a model that I can burn any type wood in.  Even though he sells the "E" models, he agreed the regular stove would be a better option.
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