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Posted: 10/27/2016 4:17:18 PM EDT
[Last Edit: InfidelCavalry]
So my wife surprised me with a puppy. She intended it to be a family dog and a hunting dog for me. I have next to no experience training dogs and wanted to know how best to go about it. He is a blue tick/beagle + German Shepard mix. I predominantly hunt birds and deer. Is it possible to train him to retrieve AND to point/track deer? At what age can I start training? Will young children make training him more difficult? At what age will he be ready to come to the field with me and be useful? I would prefer not to send him to some school as I would like to get that bond going strong between he and I. I'm sure I'm missing important things but this is new to me. Any advice you can give is greatly appreciated even if it goes beyond the questions I asked! TIA!
Link Posted: 10/27/2016 9:56:27 PM EDT
[#1]
Start house training him immediately. You didn't say how old he was but usually they are about 4-6 weeks when breeders let them go. Mine knew 'sit' within a couple of days. Just start working on basics, sit, come, stay, lay down, now. You get out of it what you put into it.
Link Posted: 10/28/2016 11:39:36 AM EDT
[#2]
It is very possible to train a dog to do both, if you have a dog that is bred to do both.
Link Posted: 10/28/2016 6:00:47 PM EDT
[#3]
I honestly think you you are going to have a really hard time getting the dog to do much of that, especially with no training experience.  Hounds run coons, mt. lions and bears, beagles run rabbits, shepards are protection dogs, there is not alot of retrieving/pointing in the bloodlines.  Sure with you can get the hound portion to trail shot deer with out a ton of training, but then you will probably have hard mouth issues when it comes to birds ect.

I am not trying to be a dick, but you are asking a bunch from breeds that don't do what you want them to do, there is a reason duck hunters run the retrievers, upland guys run pointers/setters, it is in the blood to begin with.  Even with the "right" breed they may still need to go to a pro, I know all my labs over the last 25 years have been force fetched/collar conditioned and obedience finished by a pro trainer, it lays all the positive ground work at the start to let me finish them at the end.

I would enjoy the hell out of my new pup and see what he is good at and go from there, then sometime in the future get a dedicated breed for what you want, there are a ton of breeds that can multi task for most of what you are looking for.
Link Posted: 11/2/2016 5:31:42 PM EDT
[#4]
Originally Posted By InfidelCavalry:
So my wife surprised me with a puppy. She intended it to be a family dog and a hunting dog for me. I have next to no experience training dogs and wanted to know how best to go about it. He is a blue tick/beagle + German Shepard mix. I predominantly hunt birds and deer. Is it possible to train him to retrieve AND to point/track deer? At what age can I start training? Will young children make training him more difficult? At what age will he be ready to come to the field with me and be useful? I would prefer not to send him to some school as I would like to get that bond going strong between he and I. I'm sure I'm missing important things but this is new to me. Any advice you can give is greatly appreciated even if it goes beyond the questions I asked! TIA!
View Quote


You start training a puppy day 1. Dogs thrive on leadership (you), structure, and consistency. Kids won't effect the training unless you let the pup solely bond with one of them and they are not consistent with what you are trying to train. It will not be easy to force fetch that dog to be a bird dog, given it's breeding, but it might can be done. It could be useful on birds in the field with you once force fetched, introduced to guns, steady to shots, etc. Don't hurry things and do damage. I would strongly suggest the book How To Raise A Puppy You Can Live With and Bill Hillmann's Training A Retriever Puppy DVD program. The book is basic upbringing and socialization of a puppy so you have a well adjusted companion. The Hillmann program is similar but hunting oriented.
Link Posted: 11/2/2016 5:33:41 PM EDT
[#5]
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Originally Posted By VTDuckGuy:
I honestly think you you are going to have a really hard time getting the dog to do much of that, especially with no training experience.  Hounds run coons, mt. lions and bears, beagles run rabbits, shepards are protection dogs, there is not alot of retrieving/pointing in the bloodlines.  Sure with you can get the hound portion to trail shot deer with out a ton of training, but then you will probably have hard mouth issues when it comes to birds ect.

I am not trying to be a dick, but you are asking a bunch from breeds that don't do what you want them to do, there is a reason duck hunters run the retrievers, upland guys run pointers/setters, it is in the blood to begin with.  Even with the "right" breed they may still need to go to a pro, I know all my labs over the last 25 years have been force fetched/collar conditioned and obedience finished by a pro trainer, it lays all the positive ground work at the start to let me finish them at the end.

I would enjoy the hell out of my new pup and see what he is good at and go from there, then sometime in the future get a dedicated breed for what you want, there are a ton of breeds that can multi task for most of what you are looking for.
View Quote


Agree with the above. It's not the dogs fault that it's not in it's genes to mark and retrieve to hand. The mix you have would make an excellent family companion and possibly blood dog to track deer, but I don't know much about that last part.
Link Posted: 12/27/2016 2:03:06 AM EDT
[#6]
You will get what you put into it, keep it in the house with you and take it outdoors with you whenever you go and you'll be surprised how smart it'll be. People have been cross breeeding dogs for years trying to build A perfect dog. Will it be a field champion or the top of its class more than like may no but can it help you find some neat when you want and help deter criminals by just having a presence yes
Link Posted: 12/27/2016 3:04:32 AM EDT
[#7]
OP, it sounds like you might be new to puppy training, so I'll post this again.  If I'm in error, please excuse my assumption.  

1. If the puppy just woke up, take it outside, don't take it back in until it "goes". Reward the dog for going outside with a "yes" and a treat IMMEDIATELY AFTER it finishes. Not 10 seconds later, IMMEDIATELY after.
2. If the puppy has had water, take it outside until it goes.
3. If the puppy has eaten, take it out within 10-40 minutes until it goes.
4. If the puppy has been playing for a little bit, take it outside until it goes.
5. If the puppy hasn't been out for 30 minutes or so for other reasons, take it out until it "goes".
6. If the puppy is sniffing at the ground, take it out.

You control the situation so that the dog never goes in the house, and she will do the rest. Dogs naturally don't want to go in their "dens", but their "dens" by nature are a few square feet, not a few thousand.

Plus, they can imprint the feel of certain textures under their feet (like carpet, grass, etc.) with "potty places". Control the situation, show kindness, and it will work out. *IMMEDIATELY* reward with praise and treats the instant the dog is done going outside.

Now, the dog IS and WILL show signs that it is going to go to the bathroom, you just have to watch for them. If the dog goes in the house... smack yourself and say "I should have watched my dog more closely".

Also, pick up a copy of "The Culture Clash" from Jean Donaldson, it will give you some games to teach your dog that (a) teach your puppy to obey you, (b) teach your pup some important skills, and (c) make your pup enjoy working with you.
Link Posted: 12/27/2016 10:29:31 PM EDT
[#8]
Second everything Gluteal said. Triple everything Gluteal said. You will be much happier in the long run.
On hunting, what the others said. There are some mixed dogs who end up as good hunters, but you won't know for a while.
Enjoy the pup. Take him out in the woods and see what happens.
Good dogs all.
Good luck  & enjoy
Link Posted: 12/29/2016 12:19:52 PM EDT
[#9]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By VTDuckGuy:
I honestly think you you are going to have a really hard time getting the dog to do much of that, especially with no training experience.  Hounds run coons, mt. lions and bears, beagles run rabbits, shepards are protection dogs, there is not alot of retrieving/pointing in the bloodlines.  Sure with you can get the hound portion to trail shot deer with out a ton of training, but then you will probably have hard mouth issues when it comes to birds ect.

I am not trying to be a dick, but you are asking a bunch from breeds that don't do what you want them to do, there is a reason duck hunters run the retrievers, upland guys run pointers/setters, it is in the blood to begin with.  Even with the "right" breed they may still need to go to a pro, I know all my labs over the last 25 years have been force fetched/collar conditioned and obedience finished by a pro trainer, it lays all the positive ground work at the start to let me finish them at the end.

I would enjoy the hell out of my new pup and see what he is good at and go from there, then sometime in the future get a dedicated breed for what you want, there are a ton of breeds that can multi task for most of what you are looking for.
View Quote


This.  I paid a lot of money for a "pointing lab" hoping to have it all.   He is a good dog and only 6 months old.  but the point isn't there like you would get from a spaniel or a setter.  Its gonna take a lot of work on my part.  Your dog isn't bred to do anything.  You have no idea what instincts the dog will have.  German Shepherds have no shepherding left in them.  

I have had to adjust my outlook on training from, "I will train the dog so I can enjoy hunting" to "dog training is my new hobby, I better start to enjoy the process and not be so concerned with the outcome"
Link Posted: 5/18/2017 10:53:53 PM EDT
[#10]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Sylvan:

This.  I paid a lot of money for a "pointing lab" hoping to have it all.   He is a good dog and only 6 months old.  but the point isn't there like you would get from a spaniel or a setter.  Its gonna take a lot of work on my part.  Your dog isn't bred to do anything.  You have no idea what instincts the dog will have.  German Shepherds have no shepherding left in them.  

I have had to adjust my outlook on training from, "I will train the dog so I can enjoy hunting" to "dog training is my new hobby, I better start to enjoy the process and not be so concerned with the outcome"
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View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Sylvan:
Originally Posted By VTDuckGuy:
I honestly think you you are going to have a really hard time getting the dog to do much of that, especially with no training experience.  Hounds run coons, mt. lions and bears, beagles run rabbits, shepards are protection dogs, there is not alot of retrieving/pointing in the bloodlines.  Sure with you can get the hound portion to trail shot deer with out a ton of training, but then you will probably have hard mouth issues when it comes to birds ect.

I am not trying to be a dick, but you are asking a bunch from breeds that don't do what you want them to do, there is a reason duck hunters run the retrievers, upland guys run pointers/setters, it is in the blood to begin with.  Even with the "right" breed they may still need to go to a pro, I know all my labs over the last 25 years have been force fetched/collar conditioned and obedience finished by a pro trainer, it lays all the positive ground work at the start to let me finish them at the end.

I would enjoy the hell out of my new pup and see what he is good at and go from there, then sometime in the future get a dedicated breed for what you want, there are a ton of breeds that can multi task for most of what you are looking for.

This.  I paid a lot of money for a "pointing lab" hoping to have it all.   He is a good dog and only 6 months old.  but the point isn't there like you would get from a spaniel or a setter.  Its gonna take a lot of work on my part.  Your dog isn't bred to do anything.  You have no idea what instincts the dog will have.  German Shepherds have no shepherding left in them.  

I have had to adjust my outlook on training from, "I will train the dog so I can enjoy hunting" to "dog training is my new hobby, I better start to enjoy the process and not be so concerned with the outcome"
GSDs (as a breed, not speaking to individual dogs that are in the minority) have more ball drive than a inner city middle school.
Link Posted: 5/19/2017 10:45:02 AM EDT
[#11]
Some excellent responses in here so far from the reality of breeding to house breaking.  I'm on my first paid for dog and with the breeding comes instinct that I really didn't understand until now.  Holy grammar batman!

have more ball drive than a inner city middle school.
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And I lost on this.
Link Posted: 5/19/2017 10:59:53 AM EDT
[Last Edit: GlutealCleft] [#12]
Go take a good puppy kindergarten class.

They do a few things.  They help the dog with socialization.  And they teach YOU how to teach your PUPPY.   Once you learn how to train the puppy, if you put in some time every day, it's amazing how fast they can learn things.  It also sets the relationship as "I am the teacher and leader, you learn what to do from me, and do what I say" right from the start.
Link Posted: 5/19/2017 12:09:49 PM EDT
[#13]
Training should start immediately, even if you just do a "puppy kindergarten" class. It will mostly teach you techniques on how to handle and train them, but it also teaches you how to lay the groundwork for future training. I don't do any training without being there, it's important for me to be the one to train my dog.

I start training our Doberman immediately on paying attention to me. If we clip the leash, he should look at us and ask "where are we going?". We don't take a step until he looks at us, and then if he breaks position we stop and wait again. Eventually he will be off leash trained and have free time if we tell him to "have fun", otherwise he's at our side.

Use lots of treats. We go through probably $60-70 a month right now. Combine a good treat with a marker word like "Good".

I was thinking of using our dog as hunting dog, but quickly realized his prey drive is far higher than can be useful for me. I'd have a good chance at him going towards it and then eating the animal instead of bringing it back. He will go into protection classes at some point, I hope.
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