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Posted: 12/6/2013 11:02:07 PM EDT
[Last Edit: garretts1776]
I have an 8 month old 50lb lab/cur mix. He just wrapped up his first dove with good success for a pup. I am feeding him purina pro plan but its getting expensive so i would like to feed him a homemade diet. I hunt and we process all of our own meat. venison and pork, and have an excess (as in I cannot fill anymore tags due to freezer space).
The type of food I want to feed is high protein, with all the vitamins and nutrients he needs. I am not a dog nutrition expert so I dont really know where to start. I will try some of the hunting dog specific forums (any tips on these?) but thought I would check the ol' faithful arfcom first for any folks with experience doing this. Thanks for any help!
Pic of Trooper

Also, if he is 50lb at 8months or so, any idea how much more growth I can expect?
Link Posted: 12/6/2013 11:45:06 PM EDT
[#1]
Unless you have access to a high fat source of meat like salmon that you can fish on a subsistence level  it is hard to beat even the most expensive dog food in terms of value.  In the winter I will supplement a whey, burger, oatmeal, extra virgin olive oil blend.  That however is very expensive and I only do it to give them more calories for the long cold days of hunting.  I know people with fish nets or fish wheels that can take enough Salmon to meet their dogs nutritional need.  They add a few other things like rice and vitamins to make a salmon slurry but unless you have access to something like that you probably are just better off feeding them dog food.
Link Posted: 12/6/2013 11:59:25 PM EDT
[#2]
You might look at a book called real food by dr Karen becker.
Link Posted: 12/7/2013 12:07:45 AM EDT
[Last Edit: MrBear10mm] [#3]
BARF diet, bones and raw food.  Google it.


We cook from scratch and was easy for us to transition to.

Link Posted: 12/7/2013 12:09:02 AM EDT
[#4]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By MrBear10mm:
BARF diet, bones and raw food.  Google it.


We cook from scratch and was easy for us to transition to.
View Quote

Can you honestly say it is cheaper than the best dog food you could buy?
Link Posted: 12/7/2013 12:24:04 AM EDT
[#5]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By beardog30:

Can you honestly say it is cheaper than the best dog food you could buy?
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By beardog30:
Originally Posted By MrBear10mm:
BARF diet, bones and raw food.  Google it.


We cook from scratch and was easy for us to transition to.

Can you honestly say it is cheaper than the best dog food you could buy?



I don't recall OP asking about cheap.

OP also hunts.

Yes, the BARF diet has worked great for my family and our lifestyle. Not only do I process my own game but I also help at the wifes best friends farm, they know if they need an extra hand I'm willing to lend one. We also buy half pigs and cows, we request our scraps and get them every time.

My 8 year old Rottie impresses the vet every time. He's got quite a few years left, according to them.

Processed dog food is a fairly new phenomena, dogs always ate scraps before the 60's (need cited, might be a decade off).  Processed dog food, especially the proteins do not digest the same way a naturally scavenged, as dogs do, protein does.  Also, the high grain content found in nearly every dog food is much higher than most dogs natural diet call more, therefore causing bloat and other digestive or nutrient deficent illnesses.

If it is out of a bag or box you are not doing you or your companion any good.
Link Posted: 12/7/2013 1:42:38 AM EDT
[#6]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By MrBear10mm:



I don't recall OP asking about cheap.

OP also hunts.

Yes, the BARF diet has worked great for my family and our lifestyle. Not only do I process my own game but I also help at the wifes best friends farm, they know if they need an extra hand I'm willing to lend one. We also buy half pigs and cows, we request our scraps and get them every time.

My 8 year old Rottie impresses the vet every time. He's got quite a few years left, according to them.

Processed dog food is a fairly new phenomena, dogs always ate scraps before the 60's (need cited, might be a decade off).  Processed dog food, especially the proteins do not digest the same way a naturally scavenged, as dogs do, protein does.  Also, the high grain content found in nearly every dog food is much higher than most dogs natural diet call more, therefore causing bloat and other digestive or nutrient deficent illnesses.

If it is out of a bag or box you are not doing you or your companion any good.
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By MrBear10mm:
Originally Posted By beardog30:
Originally Posted By MrBear10mm:
BARF diet, bones and raw food.  Google it.


We cook from scratch and was easy for us to transition to.

Can you honestly say it is cheaper than the best dog food you could buy?



I don't recall OP asking about cheap.

OP also hunts.

Yes, the BARF diet has worked great for my family and our lifestyle. Not only do I process my own game but I also help at the wifes best friends farm, they know if they need an extra hand I'm willing to lend one. We also buy half pigs and cows, we request our scraps and get them every time.

My 8 year old Rottie impresses the vet every time. He's got quite a few years left, according to them.

Processed dog food is a fairly new phenomena, dogs always ate scraps before the 60's (need cited, might be a decade off).  Processed dog food, especially the proteins do not digest the same way a naturally scavenged, as dogs do, protein does.  Also, the high grain content found in nearly every dog food is much higher than most dogs natural diet call more, therefore causing bloat and other digestive or nutrient deficent illnesses.

If it is out of a bag or box you are not doing you or your companion any good.

"I am feeding him purina pro plan but its getting expensive so i would like to feed him a homemade diet."

I took that as cost was an issue.
Link Posted: 12/7/2013 3:13:36 PM EDT
[#7]
Thanks for the replies. I actually read about the barf diet last night after posting. I already supplement with a lot of venison and deer bone. I dont know if i would be able to completely switch over to only raw though.
And to clarify, i do not want cheap food for the dog. Just cheaper than the price of high quality bagged food
Link Posted: 12/17/2013 8:15:04 PM EDT
[#8]
What we feed our dogs is certainly one of those areas where pet owners are really becoming very aware of what's best. You can also visit http://k9goodfood.com/.
Link Posted: 12/17/2013 8:30:10 PM EDT
[#9]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By beardog30:

"I am feeding him purina pro plan but its getting expensive so i would like to feed him a homemade diet."

I took that as cost was an issue.
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By beardog30:
Originally Posted By MrBear10mm:
Originally Posted By beardog30:
Originally Posted By MrBear10mm:
BARF diet, bones and raw food.  Google it.


We cook from scratch and was easy for us to transition to.

Can you honestly say it is cheaper than the best dog food you could buy?



I don't recall OP asking about cheap.

OP also hunts.

Yes, the BARF diet has worked great for my family and our lifestyle. Not only do I process my own game but I also help at the wifes best friends farm, they know if they need an extra hand I'm willing to lend one. We also buy half pigs and cows, we request our scraps and get them every time.

My 8 year old Rottie impresses the vet every time. He's got quite a few years left, according to them.

Processed dog food is a fairly new phenomena, dogs always ate scraps before the 60's (need cited, might be a decade off).  Processed dog food, especially the proteins do not digest the same way a naturally scavenged, as dogs do, protein does.  Also, the high grain content found in nearly every dog food is much higher than most dogs natural diet call more, therefore causing bloat and other digestive or nutrient deficent illnesses.

If it is out of a bag or box you are not doing you or your companion any good.

"I am feeding him purina pro plan but its getting expensive so i would like to feed him a homemade diet."

I took that as cost was an issue.

If he can harvest some of his own meat, get a freezer and buy some in bulk, then he can get it down pretty damn cheap. It's possible there's just a learning curve and a good bit of effort in the beginning. Although i dont know how cheap pro plan is.
Link Posted: 12/18/2013 4:13:08 AM EDT
[Last Edit: beardog30] [#10]
Like I said before it is pretty hard to kill get the amount of food needed for a dog unless you have the ability to harvest on a subsistence level.  Another difficulty getting the fat ratio correct, not many wild game have the fat ratio needed for dogs.  Salmon for sure, cod maybe?  

There is some debate on the fat ratio a dog should receive.  Some questions for the OP are you wanting to get rid of grains all together?  Or are grains going to be a part of your dogs diet?

If you are getting rid of all grains your dog will need a 70-75% fat diet.  Something almost impossible to do without a food source like salmon.  Lets look at deer meat.

Deer meat ground up with just deer fat will yield 160 calories with 63 of those calories being from fat per 3/oz, you can get slightly higher fat ratios with grinding up the guts.  I lost the figures but they didn't bring the ratio up more than 15%.  So lets assume best case scenario you can get a 160 calorie 3 oz serving from deer that only brings fat calories up to 72.5 calories coming from fat.  Not even a 50% ratio. In addition a hunting dog weighing 60 LBS needs about 2100 calories per day.  Ignoring the problem of the improper fat ratio, you need a total of 39.4 OZ's of deer meat per day.  That is 2.5 LBS of deer meat per day. So 70 lbs of deer meat per month.  With guts and meat weighed together that be between 1.5-2 deer per month.  Between 18-24 deer per year and we still haven't solved our fat ratio problem.  

This problem is helped a little if the OP wants to add grains.  Rice can be bought cheap, cooked, and ground into the meat.  Depending on what method you follow, just mix in the ratio you desire.  Still 18-24 deer is a lot of deer to kill.  Plus the equipment needed for rendering and keeping all those deer from spoiling.  

Link Posted: 3/1/2014 3:39:11 PM EDT
[#11]
We feed a raw prey model diet, and if you are an avid hunter it can be done dirt cheap.

You are looking for an 80%/10%/10% ratio. 80% meat, mostly red meat (deer, hog, goat, sheep, elk, caribou, beef) but fish, fowl, and rodents are acceptable additions too. They just shouldn't comprise the majority of the meat source. 10% bone, which should be well covered in meat. Bone-in fowl, rodents, and fish make great "bone" meals. Shoulders, ribs, and necks from your red meat sources are good too. Naked bone (no or little meat on it) is a no-no, as are leg bones from all large mammals and all beef bones. Beef bones and leg bones are too dense and will crack and break teeth. Even in the wild, wolves and dogs don't eat the leg bones of larger prey. The last 10% is comprised of organs. Liver, kidneys, brains, reproductive organs, pancreas, spleen, etc. Lungs and heart are fed as meat, so they would fall into the 80%.


The percentages are averages over time and can be adjusted as needed to meet your dog's needs. No need to meticulously measure out each meal to have exactly an 80/10/10 ratio.

A starting amount for a meal is 2% of your dog's ideal adult weight. Adjust as necessary. If your pup is getting fat, feed less. Too skinny, feed more (especially fattier meat).
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