I have been looking at a few internal frame packs lately. And was curious as to how to find the right size for me.
**Intended use**
Camping, hiking, possible multi-day trips and some travel.

I am around 5'7" and 150 lbs.
I am thinking I want a pack that has just a tad more room than I might need, because I have 2 kids and may need to throw something extra in from time to time or have room for cold weather clothes. I also didnt want a pack that is nearly the same size as me, I am pretty short and I want to try and keep things proportional.

I know torso measurements are important, how can I measure that? Also some packs have sizes like small/medium or medium/large, is this in reference to dimensions (taller and thinner and shorter and wider?)
**Items it will need to carry** Typical stuff, 2-3 pairs of clothes, jacket, cooking supplies all the normal stuff that goes with camping. I dont intend to use this as a bug out bag but it would probably need to fill that role if necessary.


I am nearly SOLD on the Kelty coyote 80. Link

It looks to have just enough storage space without being huge and some versatile pockets. I have seen a few videos where rifles were able to be mounted to the sides through the pocket. That would definitely be something I might use or at least have the option if needed. Love the night green color, looks perfect. I know it doesnt have bottom access panel but I am not too worried about that, i like the front and top load/access.

Kelty had some other models that seemed nice but I just wasnt sure how they were size wise, its hard to tell from pictures. The red cloud 90 seems like a bigger pack but in a smaller size.

the redwing 50 is a contender as well but i am curious if it is too small.

That Kelty shit is too goddamn heavy.

You don't need a backpack for camping.  

Camping as defined as driving to a campground and carrying your supplies about 10-15 feet from your car for set up.  

You need a backpack for backpacking.  Backpacking as defined as hitting a trail for one or more nights and setting up a campsite somewhere along the way.

You also don't specify your clothing types.  Is your jacket a thick parka or a highly compressible down jacket?  

You stated you have 2 kids.  How old are they?  Are they going to have a backpack with gear also?  It's a good idea to involve kids in carrying gear, but not too much so they are miserable.

Come back with more details on what your gear is and it's easier to recommend a pack for you.

REI.com has a guide on how to measure your torso.

Go to Louisville or Cincinnati and buy in person from...
Quest in Louisville
Cabelas in Louisville
Basspro in Southern Indiana

Backpacks are like shoes in all reality.  I bought in person and wound up with a women's backpack because I thought it was more comfortable.  You're my height and thinking of how my backpack is set you may be on the fence of the two sizes for the pack you like.

I would also recommend thinking of attaching your gear symmetrically whenever possible.  If I carried a rifle it would be challenging to balance the 7+ pounds placed to the far right or left.

There is a Dicks nearby and I tried several on, I nearly bought the Field and Stream 60L last night. It was comparable to the Kelty redstone they had but it had a divider for the inside where the kelty did not, nearly identical packs though. They both felt fantastic and were very adjustable.  I agree id like to try them on, the Dicks has the Kelty Coyote I need to check it out in person and see how it would fit. It was up on a display shelf and I didnt feel like messing with it at the time.What pack did you end up with?

The kelty stuff was not heavy at all.
I mentioned multiple uses/purpose for this gear, sorry if our definitions of things are different. I call camping what you call backpacking.
Clothing types are going to vary depending on season and gear loadout, for the sake of time lets just presume its is gear the average person would have and nothing fancy.
my oldest daughter is 7 and she would pack her own things or as much as she could herself. My other daughter is 4 months, she is packing her diaper.
I will check rei.com for the torso measurement, thanks!

Okay so I am a medium/regular torso according to rei.com.

REI's pack selection guide

Honestly, it's worth the time to shop at a store that will measure you and has a selection to try on... and ideally has the ability to load a pack up for you.

I bought a new pack last week from REI; found out I'm a 21" torso which Osprey says can be a medium or a large... I liked the Aether 60, tried the large and it was smacking me in the back of the head. Tried a medium and it fit beautifully. Then I loaded that up with about 35lb of weight (REI has sandbags in the store for the purpose), and adjusted/walked around... very nice. Compared it to the REI Flash 62, which felt GREAT until I loaded it up.

I ended up with the Osprey. Hoping to have it on the trail in the next month or so ... if work eases up.

The 80L pack you linked ... well, 80L strikes me as a HUGE pack. Even if you need to carry a few things for the kids, that's a ton of extra space. Yes, you can probably squish it down with straps, but... meh. 20L doesn't sound like a lot, but it's a 5-gallon bucket of extra space.

80l is ginormous. It's only going to encourage you to pack a bunch of crap you dont really need.

I used a 65l pack for Philmont and even with some crew equipment, the extras bsa required and super bulky phil-food I never filled it completely. This was with everything inside the pack. I hate having junk hanging off.

Ill second the advice about going to rei and getting fitted but first collect your gear and see how small you can pack it down.

Sadly I live in a small town and Dicks is the only place that carries these types of packs, the nearest REI stores are 2-3 hours away and I cant make it to one anytime soon. I did try on a 60L Kelty and a Field and stream. I asked if i could put a sleeping back in it just to see how it packs. With one moderately sized "stuff sacked" sleeping bag it felt like it was already filling up. I thought I could probably pack it on the outside but im not a big fan of that, because then things like rain fly's come into question, maybe the one it comes with wont fit anymore etc. The Field and Stream was hitting me in the back of the head too, I could not look up. The kelty didnt but I know you can adjust some of that so I tried on others they had that were the same model and i think it was just how someone else had adjusted it because the other didnt do that.
We might be going to another store that is local that should have some more packs and maybe they will have a bigger selection or something I can check out.

I don't know what sleeping bag you're using; does the Kelty have a divider for the sleeping bag compartment? I've got a North Face Wasatch 30F bag in it's sack stuffed in the bottom of my Aether; it's definitely tight in that space but not overwhelmingly so.

Camping gear is one of the places where "buy once, cry once" really comes into play. I was willing to cough up for the Osprey because (A) it fit and (B) they have a lifetime warranty. It was $80 more than the REI Flash, and worth every penny IMHO.

Good luck in your search!

Get a Gregory Baltoro...awesome pack.

I have a Rush 72 that I packed out and have taken on a few non-camping type trips. Its been on family vacations to the zoo I have packed it to the hospital when my daughter was born. (we were there 4 days.) I found it doesnt carry well for me, I think it would be doable if it had more adjustment especially in the hip belt etc. I am just getting into the idea of backpacking. I try and keep things basic and let the bulk of the weight I have to carry be in things like sleeping bag, tent and clothes vs gear. I actually have been heavily considering hammock instead of a tent, I think I could probably save some weight there as well. Anyhow, I agree, I dont want to encourage myself to over pack but I also want the ability to throw an extra jacket, blanket or something in there too.

Ill gather a few things up and see how things would pack in my rush and compare it space wise to one of the above packs.The Rush has 2,894 cubic inches vs the Coyote 80 @ 4900 thats 2006 cubic inch difference. Ill see if I can justify that.

No idea where Rush came up with that number, because 2900 inches is about 47L.

Not sure which one it was, I just grabbed one off the shelf that was a larger one in a stuff sack and the kelty did not have a divider the Field and stream did.
Just checked out the sleeping bag you listed, it has a listed stuff size of 12x16 I would say this one was similar, again, not sure what model it was, possibly a Koppen Viggo.

I think it is total Cubic inches, if you add up all the pockets and everything not just the large area.
I just checked their official website and they list the 72 as 3,342 cu or 55L really not sure about that.

ps, i appreciate your help and positive attitude.

My backpacking bud has the coyote and he loves it. An 80 is an awfully big pack though. I use a 65 and I overpack most of the time and it has more then enough room for me.

That's what I have. I agree it is awesome and overbuilt which I like!

One of my favorite features is the entire.. front? Unzips and flips down. I just hang it about chest high on a tree and open the flap to all my pack contents. And if you leave the straps connected the flap will stay horizontal acting as a little shelf to sit gear that you pull out or catch any thing that may tumble out

I Load it from the top, unload out the front without having to pull everything out and sitting it on the ground trying to find something underneath.

They have great reviews but certainly out of my price range.

1 under armor hoodie
2 "long john" type material long sleeve shirts
2 fleece lined pants
1 tiny cookset

The inside of my rush 72 is full.

No food, water, shelter or sleeping bag. Could possibly fit a few t shirts but I would have to stuff them in randomly.
Fire kit, water filter, boil water tin, etc are elsewhere in the pack.

Weight was 15 lbs.

Sounds like you're on the right track in that you're doing it in person.

The backpack I wound up with is linked below.  The reason I cautioned you about being in between sizes is I use one smaller than the largest setting (adjustable back piece) which is around 18-18.5 inches.  The size split on Kelty packs I believe...

http://www.rei.com/product/810844/deuter-act-lite-45-10-sl-pack-womens#specsTab

Thanks, trying to do it right. That pack seems nice enough.

I bought one of those for my dad last week and he used it on a 2 night trip this weekend. I would say for the money it's a decent pack and it has some good features. He had no complaints once we got it fitted to him and said it rode fine, he had about 35 lbs in it. Not sure how it will hold up, but he only goes once or twice a year, so I can't see any big issues arising.

Be wary of getting a huge pack, I did it myself, and I have friends that do it. With a huge pack as a beginner you will cram as much stuff as you can into it because you "need" that stuff. Very tempting and it makes life miserable.

I am shopping for a new pack right now and I am looking pretty hard at the Kelty PK 50, I really want to find a place that has them and get some hands on with it.

OP, this is what a 75 liter pack looks like when it's full, unless you are heading to Nepal or something get something smaller.

I put this in my other thread today, but it's just too good not to spread around a bit. That sucker was all of 70 lbs.

With a big pack "if there's room, you'll fill it" is no joke.  Granted, I can understand the situations where you're packing for a family of four:



I had close to 100 pounds of stupid on my back; actually enough kit for a trip to Nepal  I'm now pushing to get under 30 pounds for 8-9 days on the trail or roughly 100 miles...fortunately, I'm focused on just packing for one.

I would strongly recommend bagging up all your camping gear, heck, post it here for input or comments.  You don't need 2-3 changes of clothes as layered clothes will work and can cover a wider range of temperatures without adding duplicative weight.  An 80-liter pack is massive and I guarantee you will subconsciously fill it with unnecessary weight.  I can understand if this is more of a duffle vice a backpacking pack where you can just organize a ton of car camping kit, but for actual backpacking, it's some serious overkill unless you're considering a major expedition.

If you do have packing discipline, a large pack can be versatile, but it must be capable of decent compression so when you pack less than the capacity it will cinch down enough to still ride well.

ROCK6

From the Kelty Coyote 80 spec sheet:  weight = 5lb 5 oz.  That is heavy for just the pack itself.

For something about the same size and price, the Osprey Volt 75 is a pound and a half lighter.

Yes, every ounce does matter when backpacking.

My advice, buy your equipment first, then when you're confident you have the equipment you require, then buy your pack.

Ill definitely keep your advice in mind. I dont want a heavy pack, the whole idea of going with something internal framed is to help with weight and comfort. If I am looking for help carrying say 20 pounds then I dont want to load 40 lbs even if it ends up feeling like 20, know what i mean?
Im going to look at a few other packs that are smaller. I just dont have selection because of my area, and I cant drive 6 hours to REI to try out backpacks.

i was just looking at that pack (online) yesterday. it looks nice. I really would like to buy gear first but man i have to research and test more before i can settle on what is what. There are so many brands and the cost on some of it is outrageous. Im trying to get by on what I have and slowly improve. Id love to start out with just a good baselayer then a nice pair of pants or two (those convertible ones seem great) Ive got several jackets for just about any purpose, nothing high end. Gear is a whole other thread that I intend on making. I know we dont have a dedicated camping/hiking forum/section but I think the concepts are a great way to test things you may need to survive with later. Thats really the philosophy of use for this pack.

*best nutnfancy voice*
I want something multipurpose, overnight trip in the woods, exploring/hiking weekend getaway to a mild bug-out scenario.
/nutnfancy voice...


I completely think that your pack is equally as important as the gear it holds. I love the concept of finding limitations of your body and your kit. This whole idea is more about beginning a lifestyle change than anything. I appreciate your input.

I totally disagree.

A small pack will limit you by making you decide to leave an item on the gear list because you don't have enough room to bring it.

Check out a pack line where they have 40, 50, 60 and you will see only ounces of weight difference.

Do you drink the whole bottle of whiskey because it is there, or do you use a little self control?
So... why would bring 'a bunch of crap' just because you can??

The Gear List is the Gear List.....

In my AO, most trips are at minimum 5 days with a mandatory bear can. I see people carrying these little packs (40 - 60L ?) that look like a balloon ready to pop. How in the hell do you get your lunch or a rain jacket with out a big hassle of maximum Push N Shove? It is a lot lower key to have a big pack that fits everything easily.


OP -

I have seen that pack in person and really like a lot of the features. My only complaint is that it is a little heavier than my current 82L pack (4 lbs) and I can't get passed the psychological barrier of spending money on something that is only marginally better than what I have. Otherwise I would buy one!

I think you are on the right track with getting a larger pack. Most of a packs weight is in the suspension and adding some pack cloth on the back only adds a few ounces for sometimes double the volume. You can always pull the compression straps if you have less stuff but you can't make the pack bigger.

I like this part in red and that's kinda how my mind works as well. X weather = x loadout. My wife is the one who loves to overpack things.

Or, you could do a write up on what kind of trip(s) you want to have and many here on the forum might provide you with advice on brands and particular gear.

For example, I like to fastpack (hike fast, go light) and do trips no more than 4-5 nights long.  I also have a very good income, so I have put a good amount of money into high quality, UL gear.  I could provide info on needs like that.  There is likely someone else whom frequents this forum that could provide you with advice on alternate trip styles.

Naturally, you need to provide us with your overall budget for gear acquisition.

I have an REI Flash62 that is under 3 lbs....Osprey has the new exmos 58 that us also under 3 lbs..

My budget is LOW. I try to be a bit thrifty and if i can buy something off-brand that is the same as name brand I go that route.  An example, I was at Dicks the other day (sadly there just isnt much else around) and I was disheartened by the cost of things as simple as t-shirts. 45$+ for a shirt, is crazy, 75$ for some convertible pants... I dont have the kind of cash. I found some under armor shirts that were moisture wicking/quick drying one shirt was on sale 25$ I was gonna give it a shot. Then we passed a table that had some Reebok shirts that were half that price and the same material. I grabbed 2 of those. We checked out old navy because I knew they had an "active wear" line that was supposed to be pretty decent. We found basically the same shirts I had just bought for 7$ so i grabbed 2 more. They sure seem nice and are way better than the cotton shirts. No way in heck could i afford arcteryx stuff.

Currently this channel is getting me by:
The Outdoor Gear Review

The next few things im looking at are compression underwear, may grab these it got better reviews than underarmor and seem pretty affordable.
Ive got my eye on winter stuff too, but ill have to save some pennies up for some of it i think.

As far as trips I want to take or things I want to do: Anything from hiking in, setting up a camp staying overnight and heading out the next day to staying 2-3 days doing some exploring at some family property. I think going camping in a snow storm sounds awesome or even a thunderstorm. I know there are several nearby camp/hiking spots here locally that my daughter and I would love to explore. Its just about getting out of the house, turning off the electronics and enjoying things.

It's a 72 hour pack. They have the Rush 12, 12 hour pack, Rush 24, 24 hour pack, Rush 72, 72 hour pack.

Old school ALICE Pack (medium) with frame for 50 to 75 bucks.

SteepAndCheap and Sierra Trading Post are your friends. So are ebay and craigslist, there are always people who buy top-of-the-line and then end up selling it for pennies on the dollar when they buy the latest & greatest, or just decide it's not for them. Follow STP on Facebook and you'll get plenty of offers for up to 85% off on selected goods, percentages off all gear, free or 99 cent shipping, etc. I just picked up a $200 Marmot 800-fill down jacket for $76 on STP, and got a friend a pair of Keen Revell II boots for $84, regular STP retail is $160.

Also, join Active Junky, it  searches multiple retailers and give their prices. Plus, you get cash back on each purchase - REI is 6%, backcountry.com is 10%, Eastern Mountain Sports is 9%, etc. Buy from a place like REI, which offers members an annual 10% cash back dividend, or EMS, which has a similar program called EMS Rewards, and you can really save some cash. I have no shame at all about going into a store, trying on boots, clothes, or gear, then going home and finding the best price and highest cash back percentage on activejunky.com.

The absolute best thing about stores like REI or EMS is the service and ease of returns. You are going to buy something that just doesn't work out for you at some time, and these places will take it back, no questions asked, even if it's been used - mall-type places like Dick's don't do that. I bought a pair of Vasque St Elias GTX backpacking boots from EMS that just never really fit right after about 6 months, plus they had claw marks in the leather from one of my cats, and when I brought them back I was given store credit (the card I bought them on had expired) with absolutely no questions asked. That kind of service, to me, is worth a few extra bucks. Plus everyone who works there is an outdoors nut and uses the gear they sell.

Never used a real backpack have you?

o/p, look at a 50-60 liter pack and above all get fitted. I like Osprey fwiw

 












 

Thorgrim -

Hey if you like your pack -> go for it!

But..... I disagree with your comments about a modern backpack. The shape is not "in vogue" because it is some kind of fashion statement. It is a design that has evolved over many many years to be the most efficient for most people.

The military must have a reason for the using the Alice pack but I don't get it.

Alice Pack -

Look how far the pack CG is from the center-line of the body.

(empty on dummy - does not depict how much you need to lean forward)




With a modern mountain pack the CG can be very close to the spine. Which reduces the amount you need to lean forward to compensate. ie: You use less energy carrying it.

ALICE and MOLLE are inexpensive, rugged as hell (with the later gens of MOLLE frames), modular, and capable of carrying enormous loads. Obviously they're heavy as hell compared to good civilian packs, but that may be a blessing in disguise to the troops - we all know that any time 2 pounds is shaved off their load, they're given another piece of equipment to carry that weighs 5lb.

Shop around a bit and you can get a quality modern pack for the same cost.  I paid around $60 during a sale for my GoLite Pinnacle, which is an excellent pack.  No need to suffer with an ALICE pack.

Try going prone with a modern pack that sits high and close to your back with a helmet on. won't work very well at all.

So basically, unless you think you are going to see combat, there is no way you should chose something like an ALICE over a "civilian" pack.

MOLLE sits right at the level of the base of the skull.