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 Question about buying a gun a deferred felony
stangfan93  [Team Member]
8/14/2010 7:51:33 PM EST
A buddy of mine wants to buy a gun. But be knows that a felon cannot own a gun. But his felony has been deferred so it's not technically on a his record. And so therefore he should not be a convicted felon. Correct?

He doesn't want to go and fill out the 4473 and then have someone busting his door down.

Can he or can he not? Thanks.
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AJSully421  [Team Member]
8/14/2010 8:12:18 PM EST
Originally Posted By stangfan93:
A buddy of mine wants to buy a gun. But be knows that a felon cannot own a gun. But his felony has been deferred so it's not technically on a his record. And so therefore he should not be a convicted felon. Correct?

He doesn't want to go and fill out the 4473 and then have someone busting his door down.

Can he or can he not? Thanks.


What was the charge, when was the charge, is he done with the Deferred Adjudication or is he still on it?

In Texas (as far as I have been told in my CJ classes) if you are put on Deferred, and you successfully complete it and are discharged, then you are not considered to have been convicted for the purpose of buying a gun, and you are GTG to own firearms afterwords, you will pass a 4473 (likely will get delayed every time). It will still be on your "record" and anyone who googles you will be able to find it.

if he waits 10 years he can even get a CHL if it was not a sexual offense, gun crime, or burglary of a habitation.
r-2-k-b-a  [Member]
8/14/2010 9:22:36 PM EST
Originally Posted By stangfan93:
A buddy of mine wants to buy a gun. But be knows that a felon cannot own a gun. But his felony has been deferred so it's not technically on a his record. And so therefore he should not be a convicted felon. Correct?

He doesn't want to go and fill out the 4473 and then have someone busting his door down.

Can he or can he not? Thanks.


It depends on the charges. We cant comment until we know, at least with much certainty.

In Texas, you can POSSESS a firearm after a certain period of time after a felony. I think its 5 years. I don't remember, I'd have to look it up. Download a 4473, if he can fill it out and not disqualify himself, then most likely he can purchase one from an FFL.

Deferred is a conviction however in most criminal courts in Texas though.

stangfan93  [Team Member]
8/14/2010 10:05:19 PM EST
He is done with his deferred. So therefore he is no longer on "probation".

It was a state jail felony with delivery and distribution. Between 2lbs and 5lbs of marijuana.
rudinater  [Member]
8/15/2010 4:14:07 AM EST
Originally Posted By stangfan93:
He is done with his deferred. So therefore he is no longer on "probation".

It was a state jail felony with delivery and distribution. Between 2lbs and 5lbs of marijuana.


In a lot of cases a deferred charge would not be a problem, shoot after 5 years you can even get a TX CHL. However gun and drug charges tend to screw that up.

Best to have them call a lawyer to be sure.
r-2-k-b-a  [Member]
8/15/2010 8:01:57 AM EST
Originally Posted By stangfan93:
He is done with his deferred. So therefore he is no longer on "probation".

It was a state jail felony with delivery and distribution. Between 2lbs and 5lbs of marijuana.


As the last poster said, it's going to depend on a few factors. Time being one of them. He should contact his lawyer who handled the case.

Read the 4473 here:

FORM 4473


If the form instructions do not answer the question, then he should seek advice from the ATF or the court.
AJSully421  [Team Member]
8/15/2010 11:58:43 AM EST
Just to make sure, it was deferred adjudication, not straight probation?
Firebird69  [Team Member]
8/15/2010 12:01:44 PM EST
It might be good with the state of TX but what about the Federal Gov.
AJSully421  [Team Member]
8/15/2010 12:43:27 PM EST
Originally Posted By Firebird69:
It might be good with the state of TX but what about the Federal Gov.


that is what I am trying to check, I am 99% sure I have the right answer so long as I know he was not on real probation.. which means conviction, versus deferred adjudication which means no conviction.
RenegadeX  [Member]
8/15/2010 3:33:38 PM EST
If he was not convicted he is GTG. The only other thing to be aware of is if the Indictment is still active. If that is the case, it is no go.
TexasTycoon  [Member]
8/15/2010 4:57:13 PM EST
Originally Posted By stangfan93:
A buddy of mine wants to buy a gun. But be knows that a felon cannot own a gun. But his felony has been deferred so it's not technically on a his record. And so therefore he should not be a convicted felon. Correct?

He doesn't want to go and fill out the 4473 and then have someone busting his door down.

Can he or can he not? Thanks.


I got busted for theft and it was deferred pending completion of probation. I tried to buy a gun cause I thought since it wasn't technically a felony I can buy one....BIG mistake...I had to go before the judge and explain what I was doing. However the day I got a letter stating that I was done with probation and it was downgraded to a deferred misdameaner...I bought my AR. So the lesson here is not to do anything while still pending,could be on, maybe etc...until you are complete with all court stuff.
r-2-k-b-a  [Member]
8/15/2010 8:50:21 PM EST
Originally Posted By RenegadeX:
If he was not convicted he is GTG. The only other thing to be aware of is if the Indictment is still active. If that is the case, it is no go.


No, its not that simple. When you deferr things you in most cases, plea guilty. Do not just assume. One needs to ask the court system and the state what the options are. This should have been explained during the process.
AJSully421  [Team Member]
8/15/2010 9:23:40 PM EST
Here is the official word, and you can take it for however you like. If you read the above link to the 4473 form and on the 4th page, left side, it says "conviction" about a dozen times. It makes no mention of "plead guilty" or deferred adjudication. So, according to the 4473 form ,only if you have been CONVICTED can you not pass.

Also, this link is to the ATF website, again notice "convicted" no mention of plead guilty, deferred adjudication, or community supervision.

http://www.atf.gov/firearms/how-to/identify-prohibited-persons.html

So, we now know that only a CONVICTION will keep you from buying a gun from an FFL.

Lets look at Texas Law... Code of Criminal Procedure, Art. 42.12. COMMUNITY SUPERVISION. Link, go to Sec. 5 Subsection (c)

(c) On expiration of a community supervision period imposed under Subsection (a), if the judge has not proceeded to adjudication of guilt, the judge shall dismiss the proceedings against the defendant and discharge him. The judge may dismiss the proceedings and discharge a defendant, other than a defendant charged with an offense requiring the defendant to register as a sex offender under Chapter 62, prior to the expiration of the term of community supervision if in the judge's opinion the best interest of society and the defendant will be served. The judge may not dismiss the proceedings and discharge a defendant charged with an offense requiring the defendant to register under Chapter 62. Except as provided by Section 12.42(g), Penal Code, a dismissal and discharge under this section may not be deemed a conviction for the purposes of disqualifications or disabilities imposed by law for conviction of an offense.


Simple terms... If you successfully complete your terms of the DA, and the charges against you are "dismissed" and you are "discharged" ,then that charge may not be deemed a conviction... ie, you have not been convicted of jack squat.

The only thing that might hang him up is the thing about being "an unlawful user of, or addicted to a chemical substance" but so long as he is no longer using, he can answer "no" on that.

Based on what you have told us here, and barring any other circumstances, it appears that your friend is legal to buy a gun from an FFL.


semgin  [Member]
8/16/2010 5:04:16 AM EST
I have a DA for a state jail felony from 15 years ago. At the end of probation, I got the discharge letter in the mail from the judge. I can now buy, but I get a one day hold every time. It kind of sucks, but it is better then not being able to buy.
AJSully421  [Team Member]
8/16/2010 10:09:35 AM EST
Originally Posted By semgin:
I have a DA for a state jail felony from 15 years ago. At the end of probation, I got the discharge letter in the mail from the judge. I can now buy, but I get a one day hold every time. It kind of sucks, but it is better then not being able to buy.


Here's a solution for you. Call 1-877-FBI-NICS (324-6427) hit option 6, then listen to the prompt (you will want option 2) leave the info that they request on the message. That will get you a VAF application packet. OR some FFLs have VAF application packets that they can give you. Ask around at some gun shops. Some have them, a majority do not.

What happens is that every time you do a NICS check, that old DA shows up in their system. They then have to call down to Austin and check to make sure that it was completed and that you are discharged. They enter that into the system, and then their fancy computers process you as a "proceed" and then the law states that they have to delete that info from Austin within 24 hours or so. Thus, you have to go through that process EVERY TIME. All that the VAF will do in your case is store that information from Austin saying that your DA was successfully completed and that you are eligible to buy a firearm. They already have a TON of information stored about you... what is one more piece of info that shows that you are done with that crap from 15 years ago going to hurt? Once in a great while you may still get a 1-2 hour delay, but it is rare.

I have a UPIN because I have a very common name, and some guy stole my identity and when got arrested he gave my name but with a different middle name, some other address, but he gave my SSN, and that was all that it took for me to be permanently associated with this asshole in the FBI's computers. So suddenly I get denied on a firearm transaction and I have the ATF showing up at my door with a copy of this other guy's mug shot. They are the ones who told me to call the number (same one I gave you above) and go through the process. The hardest part is going to the local PD and being fingerprinted. Some PDs will do it for free for residents, some larger ones charge like $10 to do it. No big deal.

It will take them 4-6 months to get to you (they are showing a processing time of 150 days right now), but they will send you a nicely worded letter and give you a UPIN. All that you do with the UPIN is put it on the 4473 on line 9 (be sure to include your social on line 8... it helps.) and that is all that you have to do.
r-2-k-b-a  [Member]
8/16/2010 3:11:13 PM EST
Originally Posted By AJSully421:
Here is the official word, and you can take it for however you like. If you read the above link to the 4473 form and on the 4th page, left side, it says "conviction" about a dozen times. It makes no mention of "plead guilty" or deferred adjudication. So, according to the 4473 form ,only if you have been CONVICTED can you not pass.

Also, this link is to the ATF website, again notice "convicted" no mention of plead guilty, deferred adjudication, or community supervision.

http://www.atf.gov/firearms/how-to/identify-prohibited-persons.html

So, we now know that only a CONVICTION will keep you from buying a gun from an FFL.

Lets look at Texas Law... Code of Criminal Procedure, Art. 42.12. COMMUNITY SUPERVISION. Link, go to Sec. 5 Subsection (c)

(c) On expiration of a community supervision period imposed under Subsection (a), if the judge has not proceeded to adjudication of guilt, the judge shall dismiss the proceedings against the defendant and discharge him. The judge may dismiss the proceedings and discharge a defendant, other than a defendant charged with an offense requiring the defendant to register as a sex offender under Chapter 62, prior to the expiration of the term of community supervision if in the judge's opinion the best interest of society and the defendant will be served. The judge may not dismiss the proceedings and discharge a defendant charged with an offense requiring the defendant to register under Chapter 62. Except as provided by Section 12.42(g), Penal Code, a dismissal and discharge under this section may not be deemed a conviction for the purposes of disqualifications or disabilities imposed by law for conviction of an offense.


Simple terms... If you successfully complete your terms of the DA, and the charges against you are "dismissed" and you are "discharged" ,then that charge may not be deemed a conviction... ie, you have not been convicted of jack squat.

The only thing that might hang him up is the thing about being "an unlawful user of, or addicted to a chemical substance" but so long as he is no longer using, he can answer "no" on that.

Based on what you have told us here, and barring any other circumstances, it appears that your friend is legal to buy a gun from an FFL.





Good info but I would still not assume anything. I would contact ones handling attorney and seek advice in this matter.


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