AR15.Com Archives
 Explosives users license....Know anyone? (Dam pics added!)
soowah  [Team Member]
6/16/2006 4:49:13 AM EST
Just spent the past hour looking over the ATF.Gov site. Getting a users license looks to be a huge pain in the ass.

I need to blast a large beaver dam and a few smaller ones. The ground around the dam is way too soft to get in with a backhoe. Blasting seems to be the best alternative.

Does anyone know of someone that can do blasting in the Northeast Texas area?
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RenegadeX  [Team Member]
6/16/2006 5:28:34 AM EST

Originally Posted By soowah:
Just spent the past hour looking over the ATF.Gov site. Getting a users license looks to be a huge pain in the ass.

I need to blast a large beaver dam and a few smaller ones. The ground around the dam is way too soft to get in with a backhoe. Blasting seems to be the best alternative.

Does anyone know of someone that can do blasting in the Northeast Texas area?



TexasED? Just kidding.

Is the dam on a river/creek or a pond?

I had a beaver problem on my pond, they built their burrow in the berm. Blowing it up would destroy the berm, I wound up going out at night and just whacking them. Didn't matter when we had a huge rainfall the pressure buildup against the weakened berm destroyey it anyway.

I researched the explosives issue at the time and there were basically no regulations as an end user. The restrictions were on buying/selling across state lines. I was going to just buy locally some ANFO and solve the problem. This was pre-911 but post Murrah.

Please post what you find out as I may have another need.
soowah  [Team Member]
6/16/2006 5:57:10 AM EST
What I found was it's basically like NFA. $200 license fee and needs to be renew for $100 every three years. FD-258 cards, but no CLEO sign off.

The thing that got me was having to have a magazine. I was going to go the ANFO route myself. I just cant see having to have a magazine for fertilizer since it's not kept in a magazine at farm and ranch supply. I'll go back and re-read when I wake up.

If I can't find someone to do it for me....I'm left with no choice.


Of course the side benefit of this would be purchasing TNT! Tannerite Puhfffttttt

ETA: The dam is on a creek. With the back up now, it's like a small lake. I've got ~80acres that I don't have access to anymore.
338winmag  [Team Member]
6/16/2006 6:37:07 AM EST
Why don't you just buy some tannerite and make up some ANFO and just do the job yourself.
soowah  [Team Member]
6/16/2006 4:15:37 PM EST
Well, I would......But in light of recent events from 1995 on I would prefer to stay out of jail for blowing shit up without a license.

Plus, in order to purchase #8 or #9 blasting caps I understand you have to have a license. I could be wrong though.

I can remember back in the late 80's my uncle buying dynamite just by showing his TxDL. Times have changed.
savage1  [Member]
6/16/2006 4:32:23 PM EST
There should be a Quarry somewhere around that uses explosives. Visit and tell the manager your problem and see if you can hire or talk to his powderman. Most of these guys are down to earth joes and will work you a deal and you'll still be legal. If they can't help you, they will know someone who can, it's a fairly small community and most of them know each other. I once was one----savage1
eman36a  [Member]
6/16/2006 7:09:29 PM EST
If you're only needing to blow your beaver dam, you looking at the wrong line on the ATF form.
http://www.atf.treas.gov/forms/pdfs/f540013.pdf
You'll only need to apply for the Limited Permit, Type code 60 on the right hand side of the form. If memory serves me correct, it's good for something like 6 purchases over a 2 year period, and only costs $25. You get a coupon book that you take to your local HE Explosives dealer. He's the one that is re'q to have the magazine, pay $200, etc. . A few sticks of Kennepack and a few feet of det cord do wonders on a beaver dam or make putting in a ditch a fun thing!
Mongo63A  [Team Member]
6/16/2006 7:13:31 PM EST
I know some one with an explosive lic and a magazine and stocks det cord, caps and kenipac. I'll ask him if he would be interested, not sure though.
soowah  [Team Member]
6/16/2006 7:38:17 PM EST

Originally Posted By eman36a:
If you're only needing to blow your beaver dam, you looking at the wrong line on the ATF form.
http://www.atf.treas.gov/forms/pdfs/f540013.pdf
You'll only need to apply for the Limited Permit, Type code 60 on the right hand side of the form. If memory serves me correct, it's good for something like 6 purchases over a 2 year period, and only costs $25. You get a coupon book that you take to your local HE Explosives dealer. He's the one that is re'q to have the magazine, pay $200, etc. . A few sticks of Kennepack and a few feet of det cord do wonders on a beaver dam or make putting in a ditch a fun thing!






Thank you. That seems to be the best way to go.

I was looking at this same form this morning, however it did not occur to me that a limited use would be what I needed.
soowah  [Team Member]
6/16/2006 7:42:44 PM EST

Originally Posted By Mongo63A:
I know some one with an explosive lic and a magazine and stocks det cord, caps and kenipac. I'll ask him if he would be interested, not sure though.



Thanks Mongo, if you would ask that would be very kind. I would like to blow the thing while there is still a good chance to let the area dry up.

If he does, great, if not, I thank you for asking.

The area in question is in a town near Talco, Between Paris and Mt. Pleasant near Hwy 271. Roughly 2hrs from Dallas.
hkusp9  [Member]
6/16/2006 9:45:18 PM EST
how freaking huge did a few beavers build this dam? I mean is it so big that you couldnt just get a small canoe and an axe and hack it up in an afternoon?

I kinda want to see pic just to know the scale. If beavers can build water impedements big enough to require high explosives then maybe i was underestimating those little critters.
soowah  [Team Member]
6/16/2006 10:10:33 PM EST
Oh, man it is really huge. I've got some pics at home on my laptop. Originally when we first noticed it was just a small bunch of branches. However on our neighbors property was where it all began in early 1991. We estimate the colony to be around 80 beaver, and have been able to kill and trap off most of them.

The dam on my neighbors property was roughly 8-9ft tall (including below the water line) and around 20 -30 yds long. The timber was clear cut off and the loggers wrecked the dam out. The lake this dam caused covered just about 3 acres and was over 5ft deep in places.

The main dam on my property is at the deepest point about 10-11 ft deep and the entire length of the dam is around 80-100 yds, including natural barriers. 50yds is solely mud and large logs, but mostly mud. The lake made by this is enormous, after a good rain, I speculate it covers a good 8 acres, not real deep, but it looks like a swamp.

I have had 8 friends of mine out there and barely made a dent in it with pics, and other hand tools. when I was doing telecom I had access to a water pump and hooked a fire hose on the output and hydro mined the thing (mostly earthen). still it kicked my ass. This past fall/winter was the best chance I had to wreck it out, it had dried to a fairly small creek about 3' across. We rented a back hoe and cleared the roads and the old drilling pad. well, wound up getting the 4x4 back hoe stuck due to the soft ground. $300 rental wasted and $300 fee to have a 1ton wrecker pull it out.

I'm tired of messing with it.

I'll see if I can dig up some pics.

hkusp9  [Member]
6/16/2006 10:30:32 PM EST
shit! i figured it was just some piddly little thing and you need an excuse to play with explosives but that actually sounds pretty serious.

Since the beavers are the ones who build and maintain the dam, if you were to find a way to completely eradicate them all would the dam get run down and eventually collapse?

What about a rope and a big 4x4 truck with some sort of plow or pick at the end. You could get 60 feet of chain with a big anchor spike thing on the end and hook it to one end to the dam and then just hual ass in the truck and maybe the spike would dig into the dam while driving and tear out the bigger logs and stuff.

On second thought, im thinking about this too much, just get some dynamite and blow that damn dam up. It would be easier and faster and probably more cost effective. And it would send a powerful message to all the beavers that try this in the future.

Wow that was a waste of time typing. You decided a while ago to blow it up and i just spent an hour coming to the same conclusion that you did. sorry for mentally second guessin something that i dont know shit about.

Really though, you need to post some before and after pictures of you blowing the fuck out of that damn.

I'll come back this thread a little later when i can think of some good jokes to go with 80 hot wet beavers and some stiff wood.

Actually heres a thought. It sounds like you have a lesbian beaver compound thats heavily fortified and threatening the soverignty of your land.
May i recommend a bayonette charge with your penis? That should scare them off.
hkusp9  [Member]
6/16/2006 10:32:18 PM EST
nice avitar by the way, i find myself staring at if while reading and contemplating the meaning of it. Poor guy is running in circles and up the walls, that has to mean something.

Also care to explain soowah? Sounds like a calming statement like the one off of sienfeild.
soowah  [Team Member]
6/16/2006 10:39:38 PM EST
Here is a satelite view of it. Looks like it was a dry year. When it rains the flood plane to the SW fills up rapidly. Lots of forrest has been destroyed by these little bastards.

Teraserver

The horshoe thing toward the bottom (Black) is water. It's surrounding an old pad site for a drilling platform. The dam is on the E and goes North.

soowah  [Team Member]
6/16/2006 10:49:08 PM EST

Originally Posted By hkusp9:

<snip>
I'll come back this thread a little later when i can think of some good jokes to go with 80 hot wet beavers and some stiff wood.





That's some funny shit dude.

Some hand tools that have been used. Pics, shovels, garden hoes, rakes, come-a-longs, chain, SanAngelo Rock bars, chainsaws, waterpumps and hose, 4 wheelers, 3 wheelers, gas, kerosene, blackpowder. Oh and a Case 580 back hoe with front end loader.
soowah  [Team Member]
6/16/2006 10:51:59 PM EST

Originally Posted By hkusp9:
nice avitar by the way, i find myself staring at if while reading and contemplating the meaning of it. Poor guy is running in circles and up the walls, that has to mean something.

Also care to explain soowah? Sounds like a calming statement like the one off of sienfeild.



Check out my user info.

And if you worked where I worked you would fully understand my avatar as well as my forum title.
soowah  [Team Member]
6/17/2006 5:12:25 AM EST
Some of what I am dealing with. Pics were taken last Thanksgiving, after several months of drought conditions. All of this land would be underwater normally.

View to the southwest



View to the East



Some Damage.



One shot of the dam. Now I know how the Egyptians built the pyramids, they used beavers.



Over the dam



Top of the dam.

RenegadeX  [Team Member]
6/17/2006 5:12:45 AM EST
They are very destructive. Like I said they destroyed my pond and that provided water for widllife all around. Fish died, turtles, even the poor water moccasins...

Worse is the destruction to the trees. They eat them 8-16 inches above ground, and leave points on them. Like having hundreds of Punji sticks. Very dangerous to walk around; if you fall you would get impaled.
GETSUM  [Team Member]
6/17/2006 10:59:10 AM EST
Tannerite -- I bet that will do the trick.

Here is 3 bottles of TANNERITE taped together ---

media.putfile.com/Tannerite-Boom-1


John sells it cheap here on the board - in Dallas .....

Hell - I'll help you clear out the situation.

JohnnyP  [Team Member]
6/17/2006 1:39:39 PM EST
Get a contractor with a wide tracked Trackhoe, it will take it right out. Seen them go in mud up to the cab door and just keep on going.....
hkusp9  [Member]
6/17/2006 3:42:35 PM EST
i really though that those suckers would build a dam out of all wood, its surprising to see that the dam isnt very tall and its mostly made out of mud.

If theres 80 beavers in that dam (tee hee!) thing then i would imagine that you could get some friends together and organize some pretty good varmit hunting before you totally destroy those poor critters home and habitat.

Seriously though, they should have gotten a builders permit from you first before they started erecting a dam on your property. Fuck em, go buy some dynamite and rock their furry little worlds.


(if any of this post sounds completely incoherent i would like to apologize, the whole family just went to a mexican restaruant for fajitas and margiritas, and im a real lightweight. )
okguy91  [Team Member]
6/17/2006 4:47:02 PM EST
I have very hot exploding targets in 2lbs size that go bang with a 22 lr im me I can have them drop shipped to you. Im me for details .
soowah  [Team Member]
6/17/2006 5:11:09 PM EST
Using tannerite was thought about, we bought 50# of 34-0-0 and 2# of AL powder. Previous attempts used 2lb of FFG black powder and did not do too much.

The problem is: The water line is flowing OVER the dam now. It does not look like it does in the pics. That whole area is flooded again since the rain back in March.

To use ANAL you need line of site to hit it, hence the mixture won't be deep enough in the dam to blow out the sides.


ETA: the last statement was in no way intended to be gay.

HKUSP9, the beavers don't live in the dam! You can see the den in pic#3 straight ahead in the green clump of bushes.
RenegadeX  [Team Member]
6/17/2006 5:59:08 PM EST
Tannerite will barely dent that dam. You need something RDX based. Moving dirt takes a lot of energy, you may need to dig down a bit to get the best effect.
hkusp9  [Member]
6/17/2006 6:19:16 PM EST
yeah i figured that they dont live in the dam, but you still need to kill the little suckers...

or take them out to dinner and a movie and grudge fuck them all one by one. Either way they will never come back, this is not guaranteed but ive found from my own personal experiences that it works!
okguy91  [Team Member]
6/18/2006 5:50:57 AM EST
I work at a mine we blow the beaver dams up one a month . They just build them back. At my father in law pond the beaver are messing it up bad. I kill a few beavers each time I go fishing. You will never kill them all and if you do there will be more later. But you can thin them out and mess with there dams if you blow it up a few times they may leave. They make there home mostly in the banks of the pond the hut is not where the spend most of there time. Under water Live traps help a lot. Once they are there it a up hill battle to remove them.
Mongo63A  [Team Member]
6/18/2006 6:09:24 AM EST
Sounds like its time to put the buckskins on grow a grungy beard and do the Charlton Heston Mountain man thing and trap 'em Or just call in Chuck Norris, he'd karate kick them brown furry bastards across the state.
soowah  [Team Member]
6/18/2006 6:22:17 AM EST

Originally Posted By okguy91:
I work at a mine we blow the beaver dams up one a month . They just build them back. At my father in law pond the beaver are messing it up bad. I kill a few beavers each time I go fishing. You will never kill them all and if you do there will be more later. But you can thin them out and mess with there dams if you blow it up a few times they may leave. They make there home mostly in the banks of the pond the hut is not where the spend most of there time. Under water Live traps help a lot. Once they are there it a up hill battle to remove them.



You are absolutely correct.

I've ran connibear trap lines when I could and shot at the rest. Its really hard to shoot them unless there is just a little water. I was able to shoot 5 one night just because their movement was restricted to one small area the size of a swimming pool.

BTW, I'm still thinking about your IM
Tonster  [Team Member]
6/18/2006 10:17:53 AM EST
But they are so cute
jasondcrum  [Team Member]
6/18/2006 4:46:28 PM EST
Drop me an IM - There is a TX state agency that does this for you with only a phone call. My friends know the local guy and I think he actually works your area as well. I was invited to go with them. They whack all the beavers day and nighttime, go back and survey the site for remaining beavers, then finally blow the dam with explosives.

And this guy get a paycheck for doing it.

I will look up the guys name and department but you might try a web search on the TPW site. Or just have a machine gun shoot out at your place. That should do it.
soowah  [Team Member]
6/19/2006 3:01:10 AM EST

Originally Posted By jasondcrum:
Drop me an IM - There is a TX state agency that does this for you with only a phone call. My friends know the local guy and I think he actually works your area as well. I was invited to go with them. They whack all the beavers day and nighttime, go back and survey the site for remaining beavers, then finally blow the dam with explosives.

And this guy get a paycheck for doing it.

I will look up the guys name and department but you might try a web search on the TPW site. Or just have a machine gun shoot out at your place. That should do it.





No, problem.....Bring hip waders!

Yeah, that's great if you remember the guys name or agency, please IM me or post it up. I am on my last nerve with this situation.

I was planning on having a Texas ARFCOM shoot there if it ever dried up. I was so close earlier this year.
soowah  [Team Member]
7/13/2006 2:05:26 AM EST
Jason,

Is this the agency your friend works for? Texas wildlife Damage Management Service

I was refered to them by Parks and Wildlife, but so far no one has returned calls or e-mail. I'm going to send one more e-mail and give a call later this morning. Hopefully I can get some movement.

I also sent off my app for a Type 33 Federal users license.
treemydawg  [Member]
7/13/2006 5:42:15 AM EST
Is there a lodge in the backed up water anywhere? If there is blow the hell outta that they will still have some runs back up in the banks they can stay in but that would f@#k up their day. I used to trap with my brother up in Minnesota and we caught between 500 and a thousand beaver a year.
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