AR15.Com Archives
 Need help: Where can I get a bunch of empty milk jugs?
FALARAK  [Team Member]
2/20/2006 12:50:28 PM
I want to do some water fragmentation testing on multiple bullets. Where can I get a BUNCH of empty plastic milk jugs locally? Does anyone know a source, or a cheap alternative to this problem?


The only other thing I could think of... was to build a wooden box, and use trash bags filled with water, in a way that would contain the fragments?
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mikejohnson  [Member]
2/20/2006 12:52:43 PM
swimming pool...
mojo  [Moderator]
2/20/2006 12:59:21 PM

Originally Posted By mikejohnson:
swimming pool...



Great idea....Shooting into your swimming pool should be a great test.....Absolutely guarrantee no lost of fragmented projectile.
TheRedGoat  [Moderator]
2/20/2006 1:58:47 PM
Accoring to TexRdNec (a Yankee, btw) Trailer houses are not good for this.

I would recommend a large plastic tub, from Wal-Mart.

I seem to recall that a 9mm will penetrate the bottom of a 5 gallon bucket.

TRG
FALARAK  [Team Member]
2/20/2006 2:03:35 PM

Originally Posted By TheRedGoat:
I seem to recall that a 9mm will penetrate the bottom of a 5 gallon bucket.

TRG



I barely remember that little test. Wish we had pics.
TheRedGoat  [Moderator]
2/20/2006 2:20:43 PM

Originally Posted By FALARAK:

Originally Posted By TheRedGoat:
I seem to recall that a 9mm will penetrate the bottom of a 5 gallon bucket.

TRG



I barely remember that little test. Wish we had pics.



Tito was too drunk to hold the camera.

TRG

PS. But he did make a dead center shot, I think?
GMG  [Member]
2/20/2006 2:43:08 PM
Drink alot of milk




Sorry I could not resist
Texaspyro21  [Member]
2/20/2006 3:21:29 PM
Recycling center maybe? or if you live in an area that does street collection for recycling, then hit those up on the morning they get put out.
FALARAK  [Team Member]
2/20/2006 3:32:35 PM

Originally Posted By Texaspyro21:
Recycling center maybe? or if you live in an area that does street collection for recycling, then hit those up on the morning they get put out.



Did through my neighbors trash cans??? Yeah, that will go over well.
supersix4  [Team Member]
2/20/2006 4:15:25 PM

Originally Posted By FALARAK:

Originally Posted By Texaspyro21:
Recycling center maybe? or if you live in an area that does street collection for recycling, then hit those up on the morning they get put out.



Did through my neighbors trash cans??? Yeah, that will go over well.




when they ask, just tell them its for ammo testing
FAIL-SAFE  [Team Member]
2/20/2006 4:23:11 PM
Ziploc bags will be a better way of testing bullets. The plastic milk jugs can sometimes cause deformation on bullets, and wont give you the most accurate results.

Go buy a box of the bigger ziploc bags and use a water hose to fill them with water. Its easier, cheaper, and more accurate.

Remember, whatever the distance of penetration is, divide that by 1.6 and thats what you'll get if you used balgel.


Edited because the grammar nazi bit is still used by the lame.
photokirk  [Team Member]
2/20/2006 4:37:51 PM

Originally Posted By FAIL-SAFE:
Remember, whatever the distance of penetration is, dive that by 1.6 and thats what you'll get if you ued balgel.



Hitting the bottle a bit early today, hmmm?
FALARAK  [Team Member]
2/20/2006 4:42:36 PM

Originally Posted By FAIL-SAFE:
Ziploc bags will be a better way of testing bullets. The plastic milk jugs can sometimes cause deformation on bullets, and wont give you the most accurate results.

Go buy a box of the bigger ziploc bags and use a water hose to fill them with water. Its easier, cheaper, and more accurate.

Remember, whatever the distance of penetration is, dive that by 1.6 and thats what you'll get if you ued balgel.



1. I am not that concerned about accuracy.... I am concerned with getting some milk jugs.

2. I am not concerned about dividing by X for "ued balgel"

I just want to see what bullets will frag, and which wont, against the same control standard. This isnt meant to repeat/duplicate any real world stuff.
lordtrader  [Site Staff]
2/20/2006 5:12:15 PM
I have 2 of them in my trash can. If you want em, come before weds. Trash pick up is on weds.
frisco  [Team Member]
2/20/2006 5:20:09 PM

Originally Posted By FALARAK:

Originally Posted By FAIL-SAFE:
Ziploc bags will be a better way of testing bullets. The plastic milk jugs can sometimes cause deformation on bullets, and wont give you the most accurate results.

Go buy a box of the bigger ziploc bags and use a water hose to fill them with water. Its easier, cheaper, and more accurate.

Remember, whatever the distance of penetration is, dive that by 1.6 and thats what you'll get if you ued balgel.



1. I am not that concerned about accuracy.... I am concerned with getting some milk jugs.

2. I am not concerned about dividing by X for "ued balgel"

I just want to see what bullets will frag, and which wont, against the same control standard. This isnt meant to repeat/duplicate any real world stuff.



Might have one or 2.

hrt4me  [Team Member]
2/20/2006 5:33:17 PM

Originally Posted By FALARAK:
I want to do some water fragmentation testing on multiple bullets. Where can I get a BUNCH of empty plastic milk jugs locally? Does anyone know a source, or a cheap alternative to this problem?

The only other thing I could think of... was to build a wooden box, and use trash bags filled with water, in a way that would contain the fragments?



like this?

The Box O' Truth website
frisco  [Team Member]
2/20/2006 5:54:12 PM
Fal-

I've got the extra wood and tools to make a setup like that in then link hrt provided...Let me know if you want to build one real quick...


FALARAK  [Team Member]
2/20/2006 5:59:51 PM

Originally Posted By hrt4me:

Originally Posted By FALARAK:
I want to do some water fragmentation testing on multiple bullets. Where can I get a BUNCH of empty plastic milk jugs locally? Does anyone know a source, or a cheap alternative to this problem?

The only other thing I could think of... was to build a wooden box, and use trash bags filled with water, in a way that would contain the fragments?



like this?



Exactly. He uses milk jusgs, which makes porting in and out of the range easy. If I have to go the bag route, I will need access to a hose.
Texaspyro21  [Member]
2/20/2006 6:26:45 PM

Originally Posted By FALARAK:

Originally Posted By Texaspyro21:
Recycling center maybe? or if you live in an area that does street collection for recycling, then hit those up on the morning they get put out.



Did through my neighbors trash cans??? Yeah, that will go over well.



Around here they make it easy by requiring things to be recycled left in a plastic bin about 2' tall and uncovered and unwrapped. I always see about 10-15 driving to school. Bet you wouldnt have a problem with your neighbors if you did tell them it was for ammo tes.
Timanator  [Member]
2/20/2006 6:28:54 PM
If you findout where that fat airsofter kid lives, I bet he has a mountain of it by trash day.

mikejohnson  [Member]
2/20/2006 6:51:59 PM
I have three water jugs sitting on my counter now-- by the time you need them, they will probably be empty... there's 3...


ETA: what kind of ammo, caliber, make, model, etc.etc. you plan on testing? FMJ, JHP, subsonic 9mm vs. .45, etc...

can you also compare 124gr w/ 147gr subsonic Hydra-shocks?

-E.
FALARAK  [Team Member]
2/20/2006 7:10:27 PM

Originally Posted By mikejohnson:
I have three water jugs sitting on my counter now-- by the time you need them, they will probably be empty... there's 3...


ETA: what kind of ammo, caliber, make, model, etc.etc. you plan on testing? FMJ, JHP, subsonic 9mm vs. .45, etc...

can you also compare 124gr w/ 147gr subsonic Hydra-shocks?

-E.



Nope. Just different .223 and 5.56 loads. There are two new surplus rounds coming on the market we need chrony data for, another guy wants his 20 year olf SA chronied, and I figure I will do a few others just for a control group, like Q3131A, AE223, Black Hills, etc.

I dont give a damn about handgun ammo... it's all about shot placement in that stuff.
mikejohnson  [Member]
2/20/2006 7:13:33 PM
will different barrel lengths and twist rates affect your "study"?
TheRedGoat  [Moderator]
2/20/2006 7:13:42 PM

Originally Posted By FALARAK:

Originally Posted By mikejohnson:
I have three water jugs sitting on my counter now-- by the time you need them, they will probably be empty... there's 3...


ETA: what kind of ammo, caliber, make, model, etc.etc. you plan on testing? FMJ, JHP, subsonic 9mm vs. .45, etc...

can you also compare 124gr w/ 147gr subsonic Hydra-shocks?

-E.



Nope. Just different .223 and 5.56 loads. There are two new surplus rounds coming on the market we need chrony data for, another guy wants his 20 year olf SA chronied, and I figure I will do a few others just for a control group, like Q3131A, AE223, Black Hills, etc.

I dont give a damn about handgun ammo... it's all about shot placement in that stuff.



Tell that to the boar that I killed over the weekend.

TRG
MrsGloftoe  [Site Staff]
2/20/2006 10:35:14 PM

Originally Posted By FALARAK:
2. I am not concerned about dividing by X for "ued balgel"


YOU SHOULD BE, MAN!
TheInvisibleSoul  [Member]
2/21/2006 12:53:46 PM
How many will you need ?
There is always the option to buy them.
Wally world sells them for around 0.58-0.67 a gallon.
They also sell a box of 3 for around 2.00

If you cant find what you need you could always go that rout.

Invisiblesoul
FAIL-SAFE  [Team Member]
2/21/2006 1:48:49 PM
OP Using The Ziploc Bags

I didnt realize you werent trying to get terminal performance. If you were, the 1.6 inches of water penetration equals 1 inch of ballistic gelatin penetration, according to Dr. Roberts and others in that field.
Zhukov  [Team Member]
2/21/2006 11:16:37 PM
One other thing to keep in mind if you're thinking about using a trashcan or something similar is the tremendous amount of force transmitted through the water radially. It will most like split the container. Ask me how I know.

That being said, I would not recommend milk jugs. When you look closely, you'll notice that the square area they present as a target is not very big. There's also the issue of being able to stack them close enough to be a reliable indicator, and, as FAIL-SAFE has mentioned, there might be some unwanted side effects due to the stiffness of the plastic.

Cabelas has that new room-temp ballistic gealtin which looks pretty neat, but it's not cheap.

[Edited to add] I've tried the milk jugs, and they just don't work too well. Unless you're able to keep the bullet from veering at all, it might very well exit and be lost (speaking from experience)
dfwgunner13  [Member]
2/26/2006 2:11:58 AM
wife's pregnant goes trough a gallon every 2-3 days

kids gonna come out a Longhorn *hook em*
rogue007  [Member]
2/26/2006 6:23:05 AM
C&I recycling in Garland has tons of plastics.................I go there to recycle newsprint. Go there and just grab a few dozen.
soowah  [Team Member]
2/26/2006 9:32:50 AM
Why not use the 5 or 2gal water jugs ( the rectangle kind from albertsons / walmart, not the water cooler kind) and put them in long ways. IIRC it's thinner polyetheline and you would go through 1/2 as many walls.
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