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 Maximum Range to Target When Hunting Deer with 308 Subsonics??
WhatsThatSmell  [Member]
10/2/2011 9:38:46 PM
I want to hunt with my suppressed 308.

When I was shooting subs (EBR Thumpers) yesterday, they were SUPER quiet...but there was such a delay when hitting the target.

I was at 80yds, and was experiencing approx 2 FOOT drop

That doesnt instill much confidence in the round's capability to "knock da brown down"...

Any thoughts?

~WTS
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Him  [Member]
10/2/2011 9:43:16 PM
Originally Posted By WhatsThatSmell:


Any thoughts?



Yeah, don't do it.

hi-tech-rancher  [Team Member]
10/2/2011 10:20:16 PM
You already answered your own question, I think

There are so many things that can go wrong.

1) you must hit a vital structure and penetrate it. The brain is the only sure thing, to bring down a deer using an ice-pick, so accuracy must be within minute of ping-pong ball (MOPPB).

2) you get NO expansion, so you have to depend upon #1

3) trajectory is so bad that it makes MOPPB accuracy quite unlikely.

4) even if you hit the head, there is a reasonable chance for deflection off the skull, so you could horribly cripple the deer.

5) shooting the deer in the body cavity is not at all likely to kill it quickly... there will likely be little or no blood trail.

Hogs....that's a different story. Try it on them first, to see if you can do it, and that will likely dissuade you.

YMMV
WhatsThatSmell  [Member]
10/2/2011 10:24:53 PM
Originally Posted By Him:
Originally Posted By WhatsThatSmell:


Any thoughts?



Yeah, don't do it.



BRILLIANT

Can I get some data or relevent personal experience please.

(ETA: Thanks Rancher..replied at the same time I was typing)

~WTS
WhatsThatSmell  [Member]
10/2/2011 10:35:49 PM
Ok, so what's the point of subsonic ammo if you can't hunt with it???

I mean, at $45 a box, I'd rather go see the mexican girl up the street who will..........nevermind

~WTS
WI57  [Team Member]
10/2/2011 11:41:40 PM
Originally Posted By WhatsThatSmell:
Ok, so what's the point of subsonic ammo if you can't hunt with it???

I mean, at $45 a box, I'd rather go see the mexican girl up the street who will..........nevermind

~WTS


Tried the subsonic hunting thing a couple years ago for a bit, will never do it again.

Very very displeased with the results, shot a small doe in the chest at maybe 50 yards and she ran forever.
Found her frozen dead in a bed the next day.

A bow and arrow would be better than a suppressed 308.

Subsonic rounds are fun for ringing steel, but I will never use them for hunting.
WhatsThatSmell  [Member]
10/3/2011 12:48:29 AM
Wow. Had no idea...

Thanks so much.

Case closed...I'd never want to make an animal suffer.

OTOH, full power loads sound like a .22....GAME ON!!

~WTS
nmmi9100  [Team Member]
10/3/2011 1:07:14 AM
I don't think i'd be shooting game animals with subsonics, but I have absolutely no qualms about shooting Feral Hogs and varmints with them. Worse case, the feral hog gets an infection, dies in a week, and doesn't further reproduce. Good deal.

But for deer, subsonics are not for me. No condemnation of anyone that wants to try...but it's about as effective as killing deer with a 22 LR. You've gotta be close and brain them.

-David
Edgewood, NM
Him  [Member]
10/3/2011 10:10:18 PM
Originally Posted By WhatsThatSmell:
Originally Posted By Him:
Originally Posted By WhatsThatSmell:


Any thoughts?



Yeah, don't do it.



BRILLIANT

Can I get some data or relevent personal experience please.

(ETA: Thanks Rancher..replied at the same time I was typing)

~WTS


Got enough reasons yet why it is an exceptionally stupid idea?

You should have been able to figure it out without all the help.


WI57  [Team Member]
10/4/2011 4:57:14 PM
Originally Posted By WhatsThatSmell:
Wow. Had no idea...

Thanks so much.

Case closed...I'd never want to make an animal suffer.

OTOH, full power loads sound like a .22....GAME ON!!

~WTS


Full power loads are a whole different ball game, the sound of someone hitting a plastic 55gal drum with a bat lets everyone know you connected.
Plus the other ones just stand there trying to figure out what the heck is going on and why bambi just did a backflip and died.
1928A1  [Member]
10/4/2011 5:16:37 PM
It's all about shot placement. If you can hit a deer in a vital organ such as the lungs or even the heart, the deer will be as dead as a doornail in very short order. Makes me laugh when people claim how its inhumane to shoot a deer with a subsonic round, but they hunt with a bow and arrow....

I have killed plenty of deer with subsonic ammo and supersonic ammo, and you can rest assured that its all about shot placement.
WI57  [Team Member]
10/4/2011 5:33:47 PM
Originally Posted By 1928A1:
It's all about shot placement. If you can hit a deer in a vital organ such as the lungs or even the heart, the deer will be as dead as a doornail in very short order. Makes me laugh when people claim how its inhumane to shoot a deer with a subsonic round, but they hunt with a bow and arrow....

I have killed plenty of deer with subsonic ammo and supersonic ammo, and you can rest assured that its all about shot placement.


You are totally right, a 1.5" broadhead hole is exactly like poking a .308" hole in a deer.
I agree shot placement is key, shoot them in the head and its over.
Hit a rib and you awesome heart shot may no longer be so awesome.

To each their own and YMMV, but I learned my lesson.
rv10flyer  [Team Member]
10/4/2011 10:09:42 PM
Has anyone tried bullets that are designed to expand at subsonic velocities such as Outlaw State Bullets? I’m guess that more .30 cal subsonic projectiles will be hitting the market soon since the 300 BLK has made the 300 Whisper more mainstream.
silentbushmaster  [Member]
10/4/2011 11:41:46 PM
I have hunted with the 300 Whisper and sub sonic 308 for a few years now. I have hunted varmints, deer, mostly. I have yet had a deer get away from me. Shot placement is key. The hardest thing to kill is a groundhog, they are tuff little varmints, a head shot is the best. A deer on the other hand is not that hard. The bullet will do some funny things once they go into the body. Sometimes it's in and out, other times if the bullet hits bone, a lot of damage can be caused. The penetration is very great and knowing what is on the other side is very important. The heart/lung shots on deer remind me of a bow kill, they just slowly run out of life. Most goes less than 50 yards if not spooked. Your mileage may vary...
300 Whisper


300 Whisper Integrated
Slug-O  [Team Member]
10/5/2011 12:13:46 AM
Originally Posted By nmmi9100:
I don't think i'd be shooting game animals with subsonics, but I have absolutely no qualms about shooting Feral Hogs and varmints with them. Worse case, the feral hog gets an infection, dies in a week, and doesn't further reproduce. Good deal.

But for deer, subsonics are not for me. No condemnation of anyone that wants to try...but it's about as effective as killing deer with a 22 LR. You've gotta be close and brain them.

-David
Edgewood, NM


Listen to David.... He is a fart smeller.......er........smart feller...... Yeah........that's it.......
PA452  [Team Member]
10/5/2011 7:33:17 PM
Originally Posted By rv10flyer:
Has anyone tried bullets that are designed to expand at subsonic velocities such as Outlaw State Bullets? I’m guess that more .30 cal subsonic projectiles will be hitting the market soon since the 300 BLK has made the 300 Whisper more mainstream.


No experience with them yet, but I emailed Outlaw State Bullets just a few days ago about the range they expect their bullets to expand if used at subsonic velocities. This was the response:

The slowest we have tested the expansion on our bullets is 850fps. They do expand at that speed. I have not expansion tested them at long range(over 250 yds). Using the Infinity ballistic program and a 1050fps muzzle velocity this would get you 400+ yds. Thank you for your interest in our products.
Oliver  [Member]
10/5/2011 8:22:48 PM
Originally Posted By PA452:
Originally Posted By rv10flyer:
Has anyone tried bullets that are designed to expand at subsonic velocities such as Outlaw State Bullets? I’m guess that more .30 cal subsonic projectiles will be hitting the market soon since the 300 BLK has made the 300 Whisper more mainstream.


No experience with them yet, but I emailed Outlaw State Bullets just a few days ago about the range they expect their bullets to expand if used at subsonic velocities. This was the response:

The slowest we have tested the expansion on our bullets is 850fps. They do expand at that speed. I have not expansion tested them at long range(over 250 yds). Using the Infinity ballistic program and a 1050fps muzzle velocity this would get you 400+ yds. Thank you for your interest in our products.


those are some pricey bullets
garandman  [Member]
10/6/2011 7:42:55 AM
Max range - 7 yards.

Really, man. Just don't do it.

frog5215  [Member]
10/7/2011 6:56:31 AM
The 2 feet drop is nuts.
My .177 air gun will do about that.
A sub/standard .22LR with 40M setting only 8-10" to 100y.
So a any .308 bullet ain't slowing those little bullets.
Something is vewwy vewwy wrong with there , or the bullets are about 560fpr.
Check your setting.

A heavy .308 that opens ought to work. Maybe gas check soft 200 bullet will a HP or flat point.

Like else said, a spitzer is a ice pick.
silentbushmaster  [Member]
10/7/2011 8:04:48 AM
It's no suprises to me to read the amount of incorrect information that is posted on the performance of the 300 Whisper, 300-221, 300 Blackout.
300 Blackout SBR
Ranb  [Member]
10/7/2011 10:54:06 AM
How fast are your subsonic 308 going? "Subsonic" is a very broad term. If you are not getting greater than 900 fps, you are better off handloading your own (it is very easy) or using standard ammo and living with the noise.

Ranb
Oliver  [Member]
10/7/2011 11:39:00 AM
Originally Posted By silentbushmaster:
It's no suprises to me to read the amount of incorrect information that is posted on the performance of the 300 Whisper, 300-221, 300 Blackout.
300 Blackout SBR
http://i54.photobucket.com/albums/g108/silentbushmaster/Picture127.jpg


he asked about 308 ((EBR Thumpers) not 300blackout or whisper, correct? not all 30 cal rounds are the same.
WhatsThatSmell  [Member]
10/7/2011 3:10:15 PM
EBR's Website states that inside 125 yds is what they recommend for deer sized game

They predict approx 15" drop at 150yds if zero'd at 100yds......42" drop at 200yds

On another site (silencer talk) there was a guy on there that said:

"My EBR's shoot 16" low from a 100 yard zero. I chrono'd them for the first time this week. The speeds were 578, 762,869, 876, 910 from a 24" cold barrel. I'm going to handload and get them a little hotter. 1000-1040FPS would be ideal for me."

At least I'm not alone....According to the preliminary data, it looks as if hunting with 308 Subs is like hunting with a 308 pellet gun.

STILL amazes me.

~WTS


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