AR15.Com Archives
 OPMOD ITT Pinnacle PVS-14 vs TNVC Commercial Spec
glug  [Member]
10/22/2012 10:28:51 PM
I'm getting really excited about acquiring my first piece of night vision equipment and am looking at two options right now.

With the current 10% deal right now I can get an OPMOD PVS-14 from opticsplanet for about $2605 out the door. On the other hand the new line of in-house built units from TNVC are attractively priced as well starting at $2550.

Here is the rough comparison I put together, let me know if I missed anything:

OPMOD
$2600 w/ 10% coupon
ITT Pinnacle (seems to be the gold standard of tubes)
5 year tube warranty backed by ITT, 3 year system warranty backed by opticsplanet
Limited info on the website. I inquired about the warranty and return policy and they were responsive and had satisfactory answers.
Not much info out there on the internets, but the little I have read was good and reported specs were excellent.
No choice of color
No choice of kit, but comes standard with skullcrusher (which I understand people hate, but still seems versatile and maybe good to have for starters)

TNVC
L3 Commercial tube is $2550 (could get a pinnacle for $300 more, but don't think it's worth that much more to me)
5 tube and system year warranty, backed by TNVC
Lots of detailed info on the TNVC website and forums
The TNV/PVS-14 units are brand new so there is not much out there in the way of reviews, but TNVC seems to be very well regarded on this forum for a long time now
Tubes are hand-selected for quality / minimal blemishes. Promise of no "B" tubes
Color options (for added cost, probably would just get black, but Multicam is tempting :)
Kit options (for added cost, probably would get full kit to get the TM14 weapon mount and USGI Rhino mount and order an Ops-Core helmet with it)

I guess I pretty much answered my own question in writing this up in that I'm leaning TNVC, but with the 10% coupon the OPMOD is competitive. The only thing I may regret is not having a real ITT Pinnacle. Presumably these L3 Commercial tubes are GTG but there is something to be said about a factory built tube with the Pinnacle reputation.

Sounds like these L3 commercials are selling like hotcakes though. Anyone have feedback on them?
Kilo33  [Member]
10/23/2012 12:49:05 AM
I see you're located in CA. One more thing to consider is, if you purchase through TNVC you will be paying sales tax, which adds up to quite a bit on a $2500+ item. I personally would go for the ITT Pinnacle tube over the L3.
glug  [Member]
10/23/2012 11:34:15 AM
Originally Posted By Kilo33:
I see you're located in CA. One more thing to consider is, if you purchase through TNVC you will be paying sales tax, which adds up to quite a bit on a $2500+ item. I personally would go for the ITT Pinnacle tube over the L3.


That's a good point, although with the extra accessories I'd ultimately like to buy from TNVC (TM14, Wilcox G11, and Ops-Core Base Jump), the out the door cost for everything ends up surprisingly close.

I will take that as one vote for the ITT OPMOD though, thanks for the feedback.



slicktop  [Member]
10/23/2012 6:27:05 PM
I would absolutely upgrade to the itt tube for $300.
opticsplanet  [Industry Partner]
10/23/2012 7:08:42 PM
If you're willing to promise me you'll write a thorough, honest review for the OPMOD PVS-14 on both AR15.com and our website (shorter one for our website is fine) I can do better than 10% off.

But I can only do that if you'll give me your word you'll write reviews - we think it's a totally kick ass unit and all we need is for it to get into the hands of people who will take the time to share their impressions. And if there is something people don't like, it'll really help us make our OPMODs better in the future.

Let me know if you'd be willing!

Alessandro M.
AGreyMan  [Team Member]
10/23/2012 9:35:10 PM
I already bought one, but that seems like a pretty sweet deal.

I have no reference for night vision (other than a crappy Gen I monocular) but I am really impressed with the Commercial L3. That said, I'd have loved the opportunity to compare head-to-head with your Pinacle model.

Alessandro, hat's off for to you and OpticsPlanet for being a stand-up guy about this guy's question.

Stay Safe,
AGreyMan
glug  [Member]
10/23/2012 10:16:35 PM
Alessandro, thank you for the reply. Yes, I am interested, PM on the way.
TNVC  [Industry Partner]
10/23/2012 10:20:33 PM
Originally Posted By slicktop:
I would absolutely upgrade to the itt tube for $300.


Our ITT tubes selected and used for our TNV-14 are indeed hand-select tubes from ITT and we pay extra to have the cleanest tubes available with the minimum specs we outlined. There is no hit or miss with cosmetics with our ITT tubed TNV-14 units so folks know. We could have went a bit cheaper on the ITT side of the house, but decided not too for obvious reasons with cosmetics issues.

This also is the case for our L3 COMPEC units which we feel the best value for your hard earned dollar AND also keep in mind you can place this tube on 6.8's, 300 Blackout as well as 7.62 x 39's. But if folks want the ITT factory tube, (5.56 rated and below), please understand what our tube is inside of our ITT tube TNV-14 and choose wisely with that information.

Here at TNVC this IS what we do, NV is our core. We're a non-commissioned company that trains, uses, sells and builds NV along with an OEM on critical kit for the Warfighters and LE. Hope this helps.

Vic
RidgeDog  [Team Member]
10/24/2012 10:24:34 AM
Glug,

I get where you are coming from on wanting to get a good deal on your first NVG but I submit that Price not be the primary driver of your decision. Given the vast differences in the quality of what appears on the surface to be the same devices, I suggest you make certain you are fully informed before throwing down your money.

I am speaking from experience here. About 4 or 5 years ago I was in the same boat. Fortunately for me some BTDT face-shooter types told me to talk to Vic DiCososla at TNVC. The depth and breadth of my ignorance was astounding but Vic took the time to educate me - first, on what I didn't even know I needed to know - then what the differences actually meant for my intended purpose. THAT was invaluable to me! I was able to secure a PVS-14 Pinnacle (and many subsequent purchases) with total confidence and have never second-guessed myself or any of the purchases.

ETA: Speaking of boats ... I just remembered that once I called Vic for an answer to some silly question and I heard a strange background noise. I asked him what it was and he said,
"It's a boat. I finally took a day off and I'm fishing." Fishing!??! Who the hell answers a work call from a boat, in the middle of a lake, while FISHING on the first day off in MONTHS?!? I challenge you to get THAT from any other NVG dealer!!

Another thing to consider is the Service. Given the cost and intricate nature of these devices I wanted to make certain I'd be covered if there was a problem. Over the years I have had only one issue (non-functioning tailcap) and it was "No problem. I'll get a replacement in the mail today. Please send the original back so I see what the issue is." If you visit the TNVC forum you will see MANY instances of the same level service. That is why I have recommended TNVC many, many times over the years with absolutely NO reservation that it would come back on me. Well, I guess that is has come back on me ... folks always tell me "Thanks for the guiding me to TNVC. Those guys have their shit together!"

With all that said, I strongly suggest you communicate your specific needs and questions to TNVC. Once you have the real information at hand you can make an informed decision as whether or not a few hundred dollars is really the true determing factor. I will warn you in advance that TNVC will not try to coherse you with additional discounts or free kit to get the sale. They offer true value for the gear they sell so they don't need to bribe people to do business with them. However, as PROFESSIONAlS they will offer you guidance and great service along with the outstanding value. Intelligent people understand the difference between "Price" and "Value" and will act accodingly. Think about it. Really... TNVC is the company Manufactures go to for testing and evaluations! TNVC is the company Military & LEO go to for the gear and advice ... and thier Lives depend on the results! Frankly I find it amazing that TNVC takes the time (and patience) to deal with hobbyists like us. IMHO that is much better than mass-merchandiser offering me nothing more than a (supposed) "deal".

Whatever you decide, enjoy the new experience that will be opened to you as you learn to "own the night". I know the coyotes in my AO are less than happy with the results!

RidgeDog

opticsplanet  [Industry Partner]
10/24/2012 12:54:53 PM

Originally Posted By RidgeDog:

Glug,

I get where you are coming from on wanting to get a good deal on your first NVG but I submit that Price not be the primary driver of your decision. Given the vast differences in the quality of what appears on the surface to be the same devices, I suggest you make certain you are fully informed before throwing down your money.

I am speaking from experience here. About 4 or 5 years ago I was in the same boat. Fortunately for me some BTDT face-shooter types told me to talk to Vic DiCososla at TNVC. The depth and breadth of my ignorance was astounding but Vic took the time to educate me - first, on what I didn't even know I needed to know - then what the differences actually meant for my intended purpose. THAT was invaluable to me! I was able to secure a PVS-14 Pinnacle (and many subsequent purchases) with total confidence and have never second-guessed myself or any of the purchases.

ETA: Speaking of boats ... I just remembered that once I called Vic for an answer to some silly question and I heard a strange background noise. I asked him what it was and he said,
"It's a boat. I finally took a day off and I'm fishing." Fishing!??! Who the hell answers a work call from a boat, in the middle of a lake, while FISHING on the first day off in MONTHS?!? I challenge you to get THAT from any other NVG dealer!!

Another thing to consider is the Service. Given the cost and intricate nature of these devices I wanted to make certain I'd be covered if there was a problem. Over the years I have had only one issue (non-functioning tailcap) and it was "No problem. I'll get a replacement in the mail today. Please send the original back so I see what the issue is." If you visit the TNVC forum you will see MANY instances of the same level service. That is why I have recommended TNVC many, many times over the years with absolutely NO reservation that it would come back on me. Well, I guess that is has come back on me ... folks always tell me "Thanks for the guiding me to TNVC. Those guys have their shit together!"

With all that said, I strongly suggest you communicate your specific needs and questions to TNVC. Once you have the real information at hand you can make an informed decision as whether or not a few hundred dollars is really the true determing factor. I will warn you in advance that TNVC will not try to coherse you with additional discounts or free kit to get the sale. They offer true value for the gear they sell so they don't need to bribe people to do business with them. However, as PROFESSIONAlS they will offer you guidance and great service along with the outstanding value. Intelligent people understand the difference between "Price" and "Value" and will act accodingly. Think about it. Really... TNVC is the company Manufactures go to for testing and evaluations! TNVC is the company Military & LEO go to for the gear and advice ... and thier Lives depend on the results! Frankly I find it amazing that TNVC takes the time (and patience) to deal with hobbyists like us. IMHO that is much better than mass-merchandiser offering me nothing more than a (supposed) "deal".

Whatever you decide, enjoy the new experience that will be opened to you as you learn to "own the night". I know the coyotes in my AO are less than happy with the results!

RidgeDog


I think it's admirable that you feel that way about TNVC and are willing to share it with the community. Too often consumers are eager to share complaints, but hesitant to share praise publicly.

I do take issue with your characterizing us as just some mass merchant who can do nothing but bribe people to buy our products. What you are suggesting is that our products are inferior - and I assure you they are not. I do understand that in fields like NVDs, there are tried and true players in the market who have a good reputation, and some that don't. OPMOD right now has a growing, but small reputation. We believe in our products and we want that positive reputation to keep growing.

So yeah, we'll take a little bit of a loss to help get the word out about our products. Is it because we think they aren't as good and we need to sweeten the offer? No - it's the exact opposite.

I hope eventually Glug and people like him are writing as nice things about OPMOD Night Vision as you did about TNVC. Cheers.

Alessandro M.
Spikes08  [Team Member]
10/24/2012 3:04:38 PM
If I have a NV dollar that gets spent, TNVC gets it. They have gone above and beyond more than I can count. My BNVDs are some of the cleanest tubes I have seen. A friend just got the TNVC commercial unit and claims it blows his Mil-spec ITT unit out of the water for clarity.

When you can't afford to risk it, go TNVC.



Aeschylus  [Member]
10/24/2012 4:49:25 PM
My opmod had amazing specs and customer service was pretty good. 2400+ lux 30+ sn 2200+ fom. Tnvc really knows their stuff and writes amazing reviews buy id go with opmod just compairing the specs of their units vs optics planet.
Dino1130  [Team Member]
10/24/2012 5:17:57 PM
Originally Posted By Aeschylus:
My opmod had amazing specs and customer service was pretty good. 2400+ lux 30+ sn 2200+ fom. Tnvc really knows their stuff and writes amazing reviews buy id go with opmod just compairing the specs of their units vs optics planet.



Is not OPMOD and Optics Planet/DVOR the same company ? Or am I confused.
SkyPup  [Team Member]
10/24/2012 6:27:53 PM
Originally Posted By Dino1130:
Originally Posted By Aeschylus:
My opmod had amazing specs and customer service was pretty good. 2400+ lux 30+ sn 2200+ fom. Tnvc really knows their stuff and writes amazing reviews buy id go with opmod just compairing the specs of their units vs optics planet.



Is not OPMOD and Optics Planet/DVOR the same company ? Or am I confused.


Yes, same company under Optics Planet.
Firegardn77  [Member]
11/6/2012 6:45:31 AM
Any updates on this...I'm coming into the same dilemma
JohnnyC  [Member]
11/6/2012 9:12:18 AM
I gotta be honest, the only dealings I've had with Optics Planet have all left a bad taste in my mouth. Stock issues, CS issues, ordering issues. I'm sure the OPMOD PVS-14's are a fine piece of gear, but with TNVC you know exactly what you're getting and they'll go out of their way to help you out. Just read some of the horror stories around the web about Optics Planet before you decide to give them your business.
TDunn  [Team Member]
11/6/2012 2:40:54 PM
Originally Posted By Aeschylus:
My opmod had amazing specs and customer service was pretty good. 2400+ lux 30+ sn 2200+ fom. Tnvc really knows their stuff and writes amazing reviews buy id go with opmod just compairing the specs of their units vs optics planet.


I would submit that chasing specs may not be the most important thing about this kind of purchase. I definitely put value in being able to talk to a NV professional (someone who uses this stuff regularly - not just sells it and reads about it) and get good and honest advice about what I need vs what is out there. Vic, Chip, and Kyle have always given me that even though up selling might have benefited them short term in several occasions. For me, the relationship has big value.
dmjerrywest44  [Member]
11/7/2012 6:13:40 PM
I just received my OPMOD PVS-14 from Opticsplanet. I was very excited but then was immediately deflated when I took it out to the garage to test it. What do you guys think?




Kilo33  [Member]
11/7/2012 8:09:50 PM
Originally Posted By dmjerrywest44:
I just received my OPMOD PVS-14 from Opticsplanet. I was very excited but then was immediately deflated when I took it out to the garage to test it. What do you guys think?
http://i1001.photobucket.com/albums/af139/dmjerrywest44/IMG_2433.jpg
http://i1001.photobucket.com/albums/af139/dmjerrywest44/IMG_2434.jpg
http://i1001.photobucket.com/albums/af139/dmjerrywest44/IMG_2429.jpg
http://i1001.photobucket.com/albums/af139/dmjerrywest44/IMG_2432.jpg



Specs on the data sheet are some solid numbers. Halo is a bit small so you might not want to weapons mount that 14. The spots on the tube might or might not bother you. I doubt you would really notice them under real world use. Overall your tube looks to be decent.
dmjerrywest44  [Member]
11/7/2012 8:47:59 PM
Originally Posted By Kilo33:
Originally Posted By dmjerrywest44:
I just received my OPMOD PVS-14 from Opticsplanet. I was very excited but then was immediately deflated when I took it out to the garage to test it. What do you guys think?
http://i1001.photobucket.com/albums/af139/dmjerrywest44/IMG_2433.jpg
http://i1001.photobucket.com/albums/af139/dmjerrywest44/IMG_2434.jpg
http://i1001.photobucket.com/albums/af139/dmjerrywest44/IMG_2429.jpg
http://i1001.photobucket.com/albums/af139/dmjerrywest44/IMG_2432.jpg



Specs on the data sheet are some solid numbers. Halo is a bit small so you might not want to weapons mount that 14. The spots on the tube might or might not bother you. I doubt you would really notice them under real world use. Overall your tube looks to be decent.


That doesn't seem bad to you Kilo33 for a brand new unit? Thanks for the input. I appreciate it.

SkyPup  [Team Member]
11/7/2012 9:42:01 PM
It is possible the black dots are pieces of plastic that came loose during assembly or shipping, you might try removing the ocular and blowing out any debris and refilling with inert gas.

I had that happen with one of mine after I fired it mounted on the rail behind my Eotech 552NV and it cleaned up perfectly.

S/N of 72 and FOM >2,000 is pretty darn good.
Dino1130  [Team Member]
11/7/2012 11:33:09 PM
Decent size spots in zone 2 and 3. Not a hand select tube but what I would expect for a bargain priced unit. Seen much worse and I am not an OPMOD fan ( I have ATN issues and LOTS of them). But, I will tell you the truth regardless of personal feelings. Almost a grade B tube but not horrible. Those spots bother me little if the tube has good performance.
M4coyotehunter  [Member]
11/8/2012 6:31:28 PM
I have to agree about the spots. Dino sold me a unit at a very reasonable price that has a large number of spots due to recoil on a rifle. It is the best PVS14 I own! It outperforms my other brand new Gen III AN/PVS14 by leaps and bounds. I don't really notice or care about the spots at all.
Firegardn77  [Member]
11/9/2012 12:49:24 AM
OPMOD PVS-14 GEN3 PINNACLE just went on holiday sale for $2599...that's only $2339 with the 10% coupon. Just put my order in. They advised they would make it right if I'm not satisfied...not sure if that means they'll exchange it or refund or what but I DEMAND SATISFACTION!

ETA: And for anyone interested, the rep at Optics Planet told me the OPMOD PVS-14s are assembled by Morovision. What I'm wondering is, since Morovision's version of the PVS-14 with the GEN3 PINNACLE tube is $3995, I wonder if the OPMODs they make are just an easy way to utilize the less than desireable tubes. Why else could they afford to assemble almost the exact same thing for a thousand dollars less?
terry1  [Team Member]
11/9/2012 9:58:41 AM
For me thats on the edge for a blem grade tube not horriable but those spots are larger and in the center zones. That doesn't make it a bad tube I sure performance is strong and as long as I didn't pay like $3000 I wouldn't think it was a bad deal price wise. Tubes are truley like diamonds the less blems/higher specs the more money the tubes worth. If you buy a low blem––-high spec hand picked system I wouldn't expect to pay less than $2800 from most retailers. That said I'm not saying you can't buy a OMPOD 14 that isn't grade A screen and specs infact it appears lots of folks have bought great OMPODs low blems and high spec numbers. If you arent happy with your unit I would call them see if they would send another 14 to replace yours phone calls are cheap. At the current sale price listed above I can't see where you could go wrong for a brand new ITT pinnacle 14 I have to say way to go Optics Planet that is bringing the price down to a whole new level!
TNVC_Clasky  [Industry Partner]
11/9/2012 4:48:51 PM
There seems to be a lot of speculation and "settling" going on here. The tube pics pictured above are from a "Grade B" tube. Grade B tubes are junk tubes that did not pass spec at the ITT factory. Rather than destroy them and eat the cost, ITT sells these failed tubes at blowout prices to the distributor to make some money off them. The giant blemishes seen in these tubes indicate something that should be sent back. Specs are not just about the spec sheet. Half of the grading process is based on cosmetic specs. For instance, in order for a tube to pass spec at the factory for use in a MILSPEC or Commercial goggle, it has to have the minimum specs on paper (SNR, lp/mm, etc), but also needs to have clean cosmetics. This means that there can be no blems in zone 1. One of the blems in the pictures above is certainly bordering zone1. Zone2 is allowed no more than two blems, but they cannot be larger than 0.003. Both of these blems are clearly larger than that... by a lot. So, this tube, which seems to be a good representative sample of a competitor's system performance based on others' photos, is a Grade B tube that didn't meet spec at the factory.

The point is this: the TNV/PVS-14 and the competition are not comparable. They are in two different classes. It is like comparing a Kia Rio to a BMW 7-Series. Are they both cars? Yes. Will they both get you to a destination? Yes. Are they the same quality? No. Like the BMW, our TNV/PVS-14 is precision-built machine. We go the extra mile to build the finest night vision devices for discriminating buyers. We choose only the finest tubes that are hand-selected to be of the utmost quality, highest specs (all TNV/PVS-14 tubes meet at least current contract OMNI VIII spec, but are usually higher) and cleanest cosmetics. Sure, there is no such thing as a blem-free tube. But, our TNV/PVS-14 line is built with tubes that are as close as you are gonna get to it. We don't charge extra for the hand select on our units since we control the final build and final price. That's because we actually build these devices ourselves. We didn't wake up one morning and say "I know, let's expand into the night vision market by hiring someone to build optics from the cheapest components so we can sell in bulk for high profits." At TNVC, we are passionate about night vision. It is what we do. Our kit is by professionals, for professionals. We are intimately familiar with night vision on every level. We don't just sell in bulk to move inventory. Our staff can help you with your night vision purchase before, during and after to make sure you are getting the most out of your system. We can also articulately discuss night vision further than reading to you from a manual.

On that note, you will not find any slippery used car salesman tactics here. We don't need to offer coupon codes and special discounts, or go talk to a manager to "see if we can give you a special deal." The price is the lowest you will find for this quality and performance. We don't need to tell you that you can send it back if you are not happy with it since this is a given in any reputable business. But, we are not going to apologize for or make excuses for our product ahead of time. What does that say about the products from companies that do that? We don't need to do that because we are confident in our systems. We don't farm out the builds to others since we actually know what we are doing here. We have the skills, knowledge (practical and tactical), and experience to do this right. We know that each system that we ship is something that we would be proud to have ourselves. Our customers reap that advantage because you don't see them coming on forums, posting pics through the tubes and asking "should I be happy with this?" I'm not trying to offend the poster above who showed pics of his flawed system, but if you have to ask, then you already know the answer. You were taken for a ride in an effort to save a couple hundred bucks. We also don't need to come on forums and offer up bullshit discounts to anyone willing to buy a system from us and promise to post a favorable review. What kind of amateur hour hijinks is that? Our reputation speaks for itself.

We are not the Walmart of the optics world. Our staff is highly knowledgeable, trained, and has years of real-world 2-way-range experience using this gear. We don't play salesman games and our customers appreciate that. If you want to buy a top-shelf "right the first time/ every time" system, come talk to us. For a few hundred bucks more, you will have a device that is built right and won't keep you up at night wondering if you blew over $2K. But, if you aren't serious about this stuff and have $2K to gamble away, go somewhere else and take your chances. I understand that people's budgets are tight right now. But, if a few hundred bucks (when you are already spending over $2K) is worth that much in savings to you that you would rather buy something that didn't pass spec at the factory where the manufacturer wouldn't even put it in their own systems... maybe you shouldn't be buying night vision.
TheMirage  [Team Member]
11/9/2012 5:05:04 PM
Originally Posted By TNVC_Clasky:
There seems to be a lot of speculation and "settling" going on here. The tube pics pictured above are from a "Grade B" tube. Grade B tubes are junk tubes that did not pass spec at the ITT factory. Rather than destroy them and eat the cost, ITT sells these failed tubes at blowout prices to the distributor to make some money off them. The giant blemishes seen in these tubes indicate something that should be sent back. Specs are not just about the spec sheet. Half of the grading process is based on cosmetic specs. For instance, in order for a tube to pass spec at the factory for use in a MILSPEC or Commercial goggle, it has to have the minimum specs on paper (SNR, lp/mm, etc), but also needs to have clean cosmetics. This means that there can be no blems in zone 1. One of the blems in the pictures above is certainly bordering zone1. Zone2 is allowed no more than two blems, but they cannot be larger than 0.003. Both of these blems are clearly larger than that... by a lot. So, this tube, which seems to be a good representative sample of a competitor's system performance based on others' photos, is a Grade B tube that didn't meet spec at the factory.

The point is this: the TNV/PVS-14 and the competition are not comparable. They are in two different classes. It is like comparing a Kia Rio to a BMW 7-Series. Are they both cars? Yes. Will they both get you to a destination? Yes. Are they the same quality? No. Like the BMW, our TNV/PVS-14 is precision-built machine. We go the extra mile to build the finest night vision devices for discriminating buyers. We choose only the finest tubes that are hand-selected to be of the utmost quality, highest specs (all TNV/PVS-14 tubes meet at least current contract OMNI VIII spec, but are usually higher) and cleanest cosmetics. Sure, there is no such thing as a blem-free tube. But, our TNV/PVS-14 line is built with tubes that are as close as you are gonna get to it. We don't charge extra for the hand select on our units since we control the final build and final price. That's because we actually build these devices ourselves. We didn't wake up one morning and say "I know, let's expand into the night vision market by hiring someone to build optics from the cheapest components so we can sell in bulk for high profits." At TNVC, we are passionate about night vision. It is what we do. Our kit is by professionals, for professionals. We are intimately familiar with night vision on every level. We don't just sell in bulk to move inventory. Our staff can help you with your night vision purchase before, during and after to make sure you are getting the most out of your system. We can also articulately discuss night vision further than reading to you from a manual.

On that note, you will not find any slippery used car salesman tactics here. We don't need to offer coupon codes and special discounts, or go talk to a manager to "see if we can give you a special deal." The price is the lowest you will find for this quality and performance. We don't need to tell you that you can send it back if you are not happy with it since this is a given in any reputable business. But, we are not going to apologize for or make excuses for our product ahead of time. What does that say about the products from companies that do that? We don't need to do that because we are confident in our systems. We don't farm out the builds to others since we actually know what we are doing here. We have the skills, knowledge (practical and tactical), and experience to do this right. We know that each system that we ship is something that we would be proud to have ourselves. Our customers reap that advantage because you don't see them coming on forums, posting pics through the tubes and asking "should I be happy with this?" I'm not trying to offend the poster above who showed pics of his flawed system, but if you have to ask, then you already know the answer. You were taken for a ride in an effort to save a couple hundred bucks. We also don't need to come on forums and offer up bullshit discounts to anyone willing to buy a system from us and promise to post a favorable review. What kind of amateur hour hijinks is that? Our reputation speaks for itself.

We are not the Walmart of the optics world. Our staff is highly knowledgeable, trained, and has years of real-world 2-way-range experience using this gear. We don't play salesman games and our customers appreciate that. If you want to buy a top-shelf "right the first time/ every time" system, come talk to us. For a few hundred bucks more, you will have a device that is built right and won't keep you up at night wondering if you blew over $2K. But, if you aren't serious about this stuff and have $2K to gamble away, go somewhere else and take your chances. I understand that people's budgets are tight right now. But, if a few hundred bucks (when you are already spending over $2K) is worth that much in savings to you that you would rather buy something that didn't pass spec at the factory where the manufacturer wouldn't even put it in their own systems... maybe you shouldn't be buying night vision.


That's why you got $7K of my hard to come by money.
TDunn  [Team Member]
11/9/2012 5:46:18 PM
Chip-a-rino is bringin da wood.

For me, the reasoning is right on the mark.
Duffy  [Dealer]
11/16/2012 5:18:50 PM
TNVC has always got my NV business, and always will, I have bought thousands of dollars worth of NV equipment from Vic.

Vic started TNVC long before we started Battle Arms Dev., we have taken lots of what TNVC does right and used them to create our own moderate success
weaponoutfitters  [Dealer]
11/18/2012 5:41:24 AM
I was shocked at the quality of the my commercial spec PVS-14 from TNVC, as the quality of tube definitely impressed.

I cannot see the blemish/manufacturing byproduct in my tube unless i'm reeaaaaaaaaaally looking for it, so it was quite clear that TNVC went out of their way to pick the best tube. This combined with the autogated power supply in a ~$2,500 kit is why I decided to become a reseller for TNVC



Still working on mastering the photography aspect of it, but this is a zoomed in shot on a normally circular display, so the picture doesn't do the unit justice. Still getting a hang of NV photography!
TNVC_Clasky  [Industry Partner]
11/18/2012 8:56:53 AM
Originally Posted By weaponoutfitters:
I was shocked at the quality of the my commercial spec PVS-12 from TNVC, as the quality of tube definitely impressed.

I cannot see the blemish/manufacturing byproduct in my tube unless i'm reeaaaaaaaaaally looking for it, so it was quite clear that TNVC went out of their way to pick the best tube. This combined with the autogated power supply in a ~$2,500 kit is why I decided to become a reseller for TNVC

https://dl.dropbox.com/u/24650948/Guns%20and%20Advertisement/Em%20NV.jpg

Still working on mastering the photography aspect of it, but this is a zoomed in shot on a normally circular display, so the picture doesn't do the unit justice. Still getting a hang of NV photography!


Photographing through NV is really tricky and requires all sorts of tiny adjustments up and down on focus in order to get the right image. The clear image you see in the viewfinder or on the screen might actually be a bit blurry when you view the image on the computer. But, the image you showed looks like you are retaining pretty good focus. And subject matter is quite pleasing as well
TCBA_Joe  [Team Member]
11/18/2012 9:39:09 AM
Originally Posted By weaponoutfitters:
I was shocked at the quality of the my commercial spec PVS-12 from TNVC, as the quality of tube definitely impressed.

I cannot see the blemish/manufacturing byproduct in my tube unless i'm reeaaaaaaaaaally looking for it, so it was quite clear that TNVC went out of their way to pick the best tube. This combined with the autogated power supply in a ~$2,500 kit is why I decided to become a reseller for TNVC

https://dl.dropbox.com/u/24650948/Guns%20and%20Advertisement/Em%20NV.jpg

Still working on mastering the photography aspect of it, but this is a zoomed in shot on a normally circular display, so the picture doesn't do the unit justice. Still getting a hang of NV photography!


I was under the impression the comspec tubes weren't blemished, just had less factory overhead. Is that wrong?
TDunn  [Team Member]
11/18/2012 11:36:58 AM
I fail to see the blemish. Wow. Nice subject.
TNVC  [Industry Partner]
11/18/2012 2:33:33 PM
Originally Posted By TCBA_Joe:
Originally Posted By weaponoutfitters:
I was shocked at the quality of the my commercial spec PVS-12 from TNVC, as the quality of tube definitely impressed.

I cannot see the blemish/manufacturing byproduct in my tube unless i'm reeaaaaaaaaaally looking for it, so it was quite clear that TNVC went out of their way to pick the best tube. This combined with the autogated power supply in a ~$2,500 kit is why I decided to become a reseller for TNVC

https://dl.dropbox.com/u/24650948/Guns%20and%20Advertisement/Em%20NV.jpg

Still working on mastering the photography aspect of it, but this is a zoomed in shot on a normally circular display, so the picture doesn't do the unit justice. Still getting a hang of NV photography!


I was under the impression the comspec tubes weren't blemished, just had less factory overhead. Is that wrong?


As little as we can see...Never seen a perfect tube, but we do our best as the pic above depicts. NONE of our tubes in the TNV program are Grade B that include large blems, heavy or spotty shading, etc.

These COMSPEC units as the description talks about, (you're correct), the tube is assembled from L3 components, thus less the factory overhead.

Vic
TCBA_Joe  [Team Member]
11/18/2012 8:36:34 PM
Originally Posted By TNVC:
Originally Posted By TCBA_Joe:
Originally Posted By weaponoutfitters:
I was shocked at the quality of the my commercial spec PVS-12 from TNVC, as the quality of tube definitely impressed.

I cannot see the blemish/manufacturing byproduct in my tube unless i'm reeaaaaaaaaaally looking for it, so it was quite clear that TNVC went out of their way to pick the best tube. This combined with the autogated power supply in a ~$2,500 kit is why I decided to become a reseller for TNVC

https://dl.dropbox.com/u/24650948/Guns%20and%20Advertisement/Em%20NV.jpg

Still working on mastering the photography aspect of it, but this is a zoomed in shot on a normally circular display, so the picture doesn't do the unit justice. Still getting a hang of NV photography!


I was under the impression the comspec tubes weren't blemished, just had less factory overhead. Is that wrong?


As little as we can see...Never seen a perfect tube, but we do our best as the pic above depicts. NONE of our tubes in the TNV program are Grade B that include large blems, heavy or spotty shading, etc.

These COMSPEC units as the description talks about, (you're correct), the tube is assembled from L3 components, thus less the factory overhead.

Vic

Gotcha. I read it as a "blem unit", sort of like when PSA or Noveske release blem lowers no one can find "the blemish" on.

Completely understand that no tube is perfect. I've always explained to people that tubes are like diamonds, but actually worth the cash. (Don't tell my wife)
Dino1130  [Team Member]
11/20/2012 10:12:56 PM
In regard to blemishes. ALL tubes have them. They are an inherent part of night vision tubes. Never seen one where I can't find small pepper specks. Just the nature of the beast. Give me ANY tube and I will find blemishes. Most Comspec tubes fail mislpec because of blemishes. Many are pure spec related but spots knock out most. I have said many times before spots are the least of my issues. I will take a high performer with spots any day over a prom queen that has little performance.

Best tube I have EVER had has spots, and they were large. Most would not want this tube but I knew how special it was. My eye tells me what is a great tube. Machines and specs are great but it must pass the human eye test. Spots are cosmetic, performance is not. Just my .02
weaponoutfitters  [Dealer]
12/4/2012 7:01:38 PM
It is really difficult to capture the magic and allure of night vision with a camera!

But with this basic still life of a pistol and magazine in a darkened class room, you can see the quality of a TNVC "commercial spec" PVS-14.

Very happy with mine!

M4coyotehunter  [Member]
12/5/2012 8:38:31 AM
Dino is right about the spots. I bought a tube from him with recoil damage - spots everywhere. However, it is head and shoulders better in clarity and sensitivity than my AN/PVS14 that cost twice as much. I would trade performance for spots any day.
glug  [Member]
12/22/2012 12:16:31 PM
Originally Posted By glug:
I'm getting really excited about acquiring my first piece of night vision equipment and am looking at two options right now.

With the current 10% deal right now I can get an OPMOD PVS-14 from opticsplanet for about $2605 out the door. On the other hand the new line of in-house built units from TNVC are attractively priced as well starting at $2550.

Here is the rough comparison I put together, let me know if I missed anything:

OPMOD
$2600 w/ 10% coupon
ITT Pinnacle (seems to be the gold standard of tubes)
5 year tube warranty backed by ITT, 3 year system warranty backed by opticsplanet
Limited info on the website. I inquired about the warranty and return policy and they were responsive and had satisfactory answers.
Not much info out there on the internets, but the little I have read was good and reported specs were excellent.
No choice of color
No choice of kit, but comes standard with skullcrusher (which I understand people hate, but still seems versatile and maybe good to have for starters)

TNVC
L3 Commercial tube is $2550 (could get a pinnacle for $300 more, but don't think it's worth that much more to me)
5 tube and system year warranty, backed by TNVC
Lots of detailed info on the TNVC website and forums
The TNV/PVS-14 units are brand new so there is not much out there in the way of reviews, but TNVC seems to be very well regarded on this forum for a long time now
Tubes are hand-selected for quality / minimal blemishes. Promise of no "B" tubes
Color options (for added cost, probably would just get black, but Multicam is tempting :)
Kit options (for added cost, probably would get full kit to get the TM14 weapon mount and USGI Rhino mount and order an Ops-Core helmet with it)

I guess I pretty much answered my own question in writing this up in that I'm leaning TNVC, but with the 10% coupon the OPMOD is competitive. The only thing I may regret is not having a real ITT Pinnacle. Presumably these L3 Commercial tubes are GTG but there is something to be said about a factory built tube with the Pinnacle reputation.

Sounds like these L3 commercials are selling like hotcakes though. Anyone have feedback on them?


After much delay and soul searching, I finally sprung for a little xmas gift for myself and ended up going all out with the Milspec L3 Multicam Full Kit from TNVC. A little more than I planned on spending at first, but I don't think I'll have any regrets-- buy once, cry once as they say Can't wait to see it in action!
NVGdude  [Member]
12/22/2012 7:52:42 PM
Originally Posted By TNVC_Clasky:
There seems to be a lot of speculation and "settling" going on here. The tube pics pictured above are from a "Grade B" tube. Grade B tubes are junk tubes that did not pass spec at the ITT factory. Rather than destroy them and eat the cost, ITT sells these failed tubes at blowout prices to the distributor to make some money off them. The giant blemishes seen in these tubes indicate something that should be sent back. Specs are not just about the spec sheet. Half of the grading process is based on cosmetic specs. For instance, in order for a tube to pass spec at the factory for use in a MILSPEC or Commercial goggle, it has to have the minimum specs on paper (SNR, lp/mm, etc), but also needs to have clean cosmetics. This means that there can be no blems in zone 1. One of the blems in the pictures above is certainly bordering zone1. Zone2 is allowed no more than two blems, but they cannot be larger than 0.003. Both of these blems are clearly larger than that... by a lot. So, this tube, which seems to be a good representative sample of a competitor's system performance based on others' photos, is a Grade B tube that didn't meet spec at the factory.


See above. A tube like that never would have made it through our initial test to get to potting. Our absolute worst grade commercial spec tube is 2 blems in zone 2, max size 6 on one.
(I'm assuming that's an ITT tube. ) If it got out of A-test I'd expect to get it back as a customer return.
TNVC  [Industry Partner]
12/22/2012 7:56:30 PM
weaponoutfitters and glug and to all the rest there. Thank you for all the orders. As you can tell, we take great care in selecting these units.

Vic