Jack Garner Leman flintlock?

I have a flintlock made by Jack Garner. It is a Leman style as best as I can tell. It's a .40 caliber with a 36" barrel. It has a beautiful maple stock and iron furniture.
I bought it last year because my dad mentioned that he liked the smoke and noise. We both shot pistol competitions but muzzleloaders are fun.
I lost dad last december and never got around to shooting this rifle. There is a lot going on and I have had to miss some matches lately due to my wife going back to college and our kids.
I had thought about selling it since I don't see much time for it anytime soon. I looked on a few auction sites for a similar rifle and saw prices up to $1600.00, although that one didn't sell.
If this rifle is worth that much, or is otherwise special, I might keep it. I need a scope for a .308 and had thought of financing it with selling this flintlock.

Are these worth that much? If so I may not sell it unless I find someone with a really exceptional scope for trade.

I just can't seem to really get into the muzzleloading scene right now, but if this is a valuable rifle I might keep it in case I do later on.


Jim

back in the day Jack made some exceptional rifles of quality, it should be signed by him on the top flat J Garner and possibly a year he didnt always do that though, the last time i saw Jack he was at one of my shoots and was in the process of selling off the business to the current makers of TVM....he did take some liberties however stylistically and made a lot of guns with interpretive architecture, but he used quality parts , Sharon barrels, L&R locks etc......I know David at Track of the Wolf always has buyers for them

He did sign the top barrel flat.
I bought the rifle used. We were thinking it was a carolina rifle but others seem to think it is a leman. It's a .40 caliber with a 36" straight barrel. BTW for a used barrel it is really clean- the bore and breech face are shiny bright.

I am really divided about selling it- especially since some people on another board told me it was worth around $1100.00- $1200.00. I know I will probably never buy a rifle like this again if I decide to get into muzzleloading again, but I need a good scope.
I gotta think about this.

Jim

...you MIGHT get that much for it ..but...that price point opens up a lot of possibilities for a potential buyer,Garner rifles do have a following however if you are serious about it call David at Track...personally though I would keep it a lot of people can take 7-800 worth of parts and end up with a 7-800$ gun, Jack was NOT one of them, he was a friend and a great builder I learned a lot from him in my early gun making ,to the point he said he should own one of my guns..yeah I laughed too...tough call but if it helps scopes will be around...J Garner rifles are semi heirloom and usually exceptionally accurate, like I said he used a lot of Sharon's in his earlier guns and those are some bbl's...I found a Sharon in a gun dealers junk pile once...it's a 62 cal 34" I can hit a 15" square at 145yds with it, pisses a lot of the rifle guys off at this one shoot i go to...lol

I have no idea what make the barel is. What could I look for to find out? The only markings I can find is his signature.
It does sound like it's a much better rifle than I thought, and like you said I can always get a scope.

Jim

If it is a Sharon it will usually be marked just forward of the breech on either # 4 or #6 bbl flat, this means you would have to completely dismount the barrel from the stock, not a big deal just make sure you use the right tools or you can damage the tennon pin holes, typically you drive them left to right, orientation is: from the top, muzzle facing away from you

ETA...IMHO...if you turned loose of it now, you would be hard pressed to replace it for either what you have in it or would sell it for,I have a close friend who has one of Jacks smoothbores, at the time he wanted me to build him one i said sure but its gonna be a year till you can have it,Jack had one at one of our shoots for sale and we all three concurred, buy it,that was about 10 years ago he still shoots it and takes top scores with it, its a keeper, like I said before though there are what some of us would consider liberties with the architecture but to the untrained eye they are non existent, Jack was a big believer in using high grade wood usually grade 4 Maple and grade 3/4 walnut, so you will get a lot of compliments on how striking it looks,that gun has had a lot of ball down the pipe, I have rebuilt the lock once on it for him, and replaced the front sight and thats it..so think it through,

TVLL62CAL I will probably keep it. I would never be able to buy another muzzleloader of this apparent quality.
As for what I have in it, this will make you cry. I traded for it. I traded a Garand that I had $550.00 in- straight trade.
I will post pics later. It has iron furniture, set trigger, a beautiful maple stock, and a 36" barrel. The barrel is not swamped.
When I started looking into trading it I thought it was just another $700.00 - $800.00 rifle- just a run of the mill shooter. It sounds now like it is much better than I thought. I will hang onto it and see if I can find time for it.

Jim

you did well...you couldnt even get the parts for a build at that price

Jim

Wow! Definitley a keeper.

Keep it Pepper, thats one of his earlier guns, as evidenced by the Lock and nose cap, typical grade 4 maple wood to metal is as good as it gets, btw..its in the Tennessee style architecturally and if you were to say a date of style somewhere around 1820 ish...that was Jacks forte, and that build shows why his signature work was sought after in the earlier days of semi custom production...I would own that...and I build them.......

ETA...forgot to say, the lock is as i suspected..L&R in the Manton& Ashmore style, the older L&R's are marked with an L in a circle on the inside, after RE Davis bought them out they are now simply line stamped, some...not all are unmarked as well..original Hawkens used this lock

The guy I originally got it from called it a Carolina style. Noone knew what that was. When I got pics they called it a Leman.
If this is really a Tennessee style I will love it more- my family on both sides came to Texas from the Smoky Mountains.

I appreciate any help identifying whatever you can help with- like the lock and that this is an early rifle from him. If more pics will help I can do that.

I guess I had better find some time to go shoot it and see how it does.

Jim

originally southern Ohio and Tennessee style guns were identical, Leman styles were a more along the lines of the Moravian schools around Christian Springs Pa, the Ohio and North Tenn guns had a bit more drop and curveature in the buttplates..the only "Carolina" style was what was known as a 2 Shilling gun, these were painted blue and brought over for trade with the Naytives ca1750-80.....in essence there is no such true style...Lehman is a township in Pa

So this is a Tennessee style? When I was asking last year just after getting it I didn't have really good pics. The mistakes were probably due to my crappy camers.

Jim

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