How come there is so much original 7.7x58 MG ammo available but virtually no 7.7 rifle ammo?

I have always noticed that you can find lots of original 7.7x58mm semi rimmed MG ammo usually on feed strips but 7.7x58 rimless ammo for the rifles is virtually non-existent. Why is that? Also why can you not find any original 8mm nambu ammo?

I don't know about the rifle ammo, but the 8mm Nambu is because only one country used that round. Unlike 9mm which many used. Lots of it was shot up by the GI's after the war and I imagine lots of it was left in the jungle to rot, or was destroyed on purpose.

I have a feeling there is more somewhere, but the quality would be suspect.


I remember seeing films of GI's dumping barges of ammo and arms into the ocean during the occupation.

Is the 7.7 MG ammo just hotter? If it was only an issue of pressure wouldnt it be possible to pull the bullets and re-powder with a lighter load?

I believe the MG rounds are in different cases.
The only explination I can offer is that they were in chargers, which looked cool and were handier to
tote off as opposed to a bunch of stripper clips

More people brought back rifles than they did machine guns.

Is the 7.7 rifle ammo not rimmed at all? Can someone explain the myth about the Japs making 7.7 ammo that was just like the British .303? I have an Arisaka that I'd like to shoot but I want to make sure that I'm buying the right ammo.

The 7.7x58mm for the Hotchkiss style MG's had a semi rim other than that the case is identical as far as I have seen to the 7.7x58mm Arisaka round which is rimless and chambers in the Type 99 Arisaka and other light machineguns like the Type 99 light machinegun. I have read the purpose of the rim on the mg ammo was to prevent the hotter ammunition from chambering in the rifle. The Japanese did load 303 British but it was for their copy of the British Lewis gun, which saw navel use. Assuming your rifle has not been modified or rebarreled it will be in the rifle caliber rimless 7.7x58mm. Some guys did have them rechambered to things like 30-06 and 300 savage like I have seen.

Japanese Aircraft fixed Type 89 ? 7.7 cal MG that was a copy of the Vickers AC MG also used 7.7 rimmed ( 303 Brit ).

Alot of the Semi rimmed 7.7 had been imported in the 1950's-60's and Hotchkis feed strips were a popular bring back souvenir. The rifle ammo isn't scarce but most has gone bad with age, if you want to shoot just reload.

Yes they did. This was a really bad idea, particulaly in the '06. First, the barrels were .311 and .308 bulleted ammo will not be accurate. Second, the base of the 7.7 cartridge is slightly larger diameter than .30-06 or .300 Savage and the Type 99 chambers were sloppy to boot. For .300 savage or .308 you could set the barrel back a thread to take care of the base diameter problem, but with the '06 you could not do this.

Those converted to '06 that I've seen shot couldn't hit a flock of barns and badly bulged the base of the cartridge case. Probably the only reason the case heads didn't separate was that the oversized bore dropped the chamber pressure.

Ariska's are incredibly strong. There is actually a document case of a guy borrowing a chamber reamer and rechambering his WWII "Japanese Rifle" to '06 and then going out and killing a deer with it. He complained about the recoil and took to an actual gunsmith to check. It was a type 38 (6.5mm) and he had been shooting .308 diameter bullets down its 6.5mm bore.

I haven't checked in years, but Norma used to import commercial soft point 7.7 ammo into the U.S.

Well as far as reloading for this cartridge I have been making 7.7 brass from 30-06 for years and I have experienced zero case failures. It seems that once the case swells a little to fill the chamber that’s where it stays since the 7.7 dies I have only push the brass back the minimum amount needed to achieve 7.7 dimensions.

I have also heard of cases of type 99 rifles being rechambered to 30-06 during the Korean War for ROK soldiers to use as I imagine that in time of war any weapon was better than nothing.

I believe you can still get new boxer brass for 7.7x58 Jap from Graf & Sons. It is made by Prvi Partisan. I bought a bunch a few years ago and I am still using it.

Although I do not (yet) have a Nambu, I think you can buy new 8mm Nambu brass from Buffalo Arms. If I remember right it is made by Starline.

I belive that is true too. I also know that you can make 8mm nambu from 357 sig since I've found fired cases made from them that measured out to 8mm nambu specs.

Most of the ammo in Japan was dumped at sea in the occupation.

Most of the ammo in China went to Mao and was used into the 50's

also back when jap guns were practically worthless- in the 60's for example - some amounts of ammo were around. Many people shot up the surplus ammo- my brother years ago even had a technique to effectively drill out the primer pocket to convert to a boxer primer and reuse the brass. there was never as much jap stuff as german to begin with. We live in the best of times now with many old obsolete calibers easier to come by now than 30-40 years ago.

I agree. One of my rifles (a list ditch Type 99) was unfired according to family history and my own observations. It makes sense because unless the owner (My great uncle who captured it and my grandpa who he gave it to had no interest in shooting it) and if one back in the 50's-80's didn’t reload they probably never would have shot it. Same goes for any STG 44's and Russian guns captured during Korea and Vietnam.

I have also been saving all of my Yugo 7.62x39mm brass and South African 303 brass to convert to Boxer primers if those calibers ever become economically viable to convert. If not then they will just go to a scrap yard for thier weight in metals.

You should try it some time. I've loaded many .30 US projectiles in .303 cases necked down to .30. Its just as accurate as any other surplus ball ammo.

I've seen detailed instructions on how to form 8mm Nambu cases from .357 Sig on another forum. Looks like it isn't too terrible of a process, but if you can just buy brass that's probably the route I would go. I shoot .357 Sig but I'd probably reload that brass for that caliber, and having the right headstamp is always nice... Not that I am not guilty of forming any .243 Win I find into .308 Win or .270 Win into .30-06 Spr... Since I don't do .243 or .270...

That hasn't been my experience. I noticed a significant loss in accuracy loading .308" bullets in .303 Brit cases. I haven't tried them in 7.7x58mm Jap, but I would expect the same results. I know .308" bullets I tried in 7.62x54R also produced very poor accuracy from my 91/30 Mosin Nagant compared to when I used .311" bullets or with surplus ammo.

Sometimes the stupidity of our government when it comes to waste astounds me.



Isn't that nice... Too bad it didn't go to the Nationalists (Taiwan) instead.

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