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SSR85C project status of, and input needed
2/27/2011 7:14:35 PM
Just bought a ssr85c low cap from Centerfire Systems
Been moding it, also have some ideas and concerns I would like to share and get some input on, I will also have to add compliance parts as well but my concerns are mostly with stock options and so on with the flat rear trunion.
Been moding it, also have some ideas and concerns I would like to share and get some input on, I will also have to add compliance parts as well but my concerns are mostly with stock options and so on with the flat rear trunion.
2/27/2011 7:15:07 PM
1st off I will bring you all up to date on the project as it is currently, sorry it is long winded but oh well I have a lot to say and a lot of ideas for it
Anyway…
Purchased under the idea that I will eventually be my wife’s rifle
Initially figured I would purchase black hand guards to match the thumbhole stock
Add a m16A2 style muzzle break after cutting off the welded on thread protector
And open up the mag well to take standard mags
Well… initial impressions, rifle is very nice, craftsmanship and construction is impressive. However, Parkerizing on the receiver is so thin I can almost scratch it off with my fingers nails though. Will have to be cold blued
The front sight is very very slightly canted, only about 1mm so not enough to make a difference, should still be zero able.
Trigger seems nice
Bakelite lower hand guard is loose, took it off, wrapped the part that fits into the receiver with duck tape to reduce wobble, worked like a charm and is tight now, also tape cant be noticed without disassembly.
Anyway…
Purchased under the idea that I will eventually be my wife’s rifle
Initially figured I would purchase black hand guards to match the thumbhole stock
Add a m16A2 style muzzle break after cutting off the welded on thread protector
And open up the mag well to take standard mags
Well… initial impressions, rifle is very nice, craftsmanship and construction is impressive. However, Parkerizing on the receiver is so thin I can almost scratch it off with my fingers nails though. Will have to be cold blued
The front sight is very very slightly canted, only about 1mm so not enough to make a difference, should still be zero able.
Trigger seems nice
Bakelite lower hand guard is loose, took it off, wrapped the part that fits into the receiver with duck tape to reduce wobble, worked like a charm and is tight now, also tape cant be noticed without disassembly.
2/27/2011 7:15:47 PM
Got a receiver template and opened up the mag well, was harder than others have made it seem, only had a set of dremel bits and a hand held power drill. Idea of drilling corners with drill bit and connecting the holes is imposable with out a vice and drill press. Holes have to be too close to the already cut single stack hole, and will slip off before they gain purchase on the drilling surface, all cutting had to be done with dremel cutting bit the corners and edges had to be evened out with grinding bit.
1st time I opened up an ak wag well, turned out nice, tapering end at the front of the mag is a bit wide but doesn’t affect function or appearance, mag well took about 3 hours total work including finishing up edges.
Internal feed lips/ slats that hold the mag in place had to also be ground down to accommodate standard mags (using Bulgarian and Korean), this is a pain don’t think bending with c lamps would work with out warping the receiver itself, must work slow and carefully with dremel grinding bit, key is to take just enough off so the mag will fit with no wobble, also must be done evenly so mag wont seat canted, that is the difficult part, initially got them grinded down but mag was slightly canted, couldn’t tell with normal mags, but drum mags made it easier to see the cant, but this was still very slight and didn’t affect feeding, also was so tight that mag changes were difficult to do quickly. Took a tiny bit off the longer slat/feed lip, now seats evenly with less than 1mm of play side to side, also makes mag changes easier because its not soo tight as before, no audible rattle can be heard with mag. All in all took another 3 and ½ hours’ work on this as well.
Range test shows an average of 3-inch groupings at 100 yards firing off of a rest, very happy with this result. Used tula ammo 122gr fmj
Muzzle thread protector is held in place as normal breaks are by a detent in the front sight post; it is also reinforced by a weld bead on the 6 o’clock position under the barrel, so that it can’t be removed. It shouldn’t be a problem to cut through the weld bead and replace with m16A2 style muzzle break.
1st time I opened up an ak wag well, turned out nice, tapering end at the front of the mag is a bit wide but doesn’t affect function or appearance, mag well took about 3 hours total work including finishing up edges.
Internal feed lips/ slats that hold the mag in place had to also be ground down to accommodate standard mags (using Bulgarian and Korean), this is a pain don’t think bending with c lamps would work with out warping the receiver itself, must work slow and carefully with dremel grinding bit, key is to take just enough off so the mag will fit with no wobble, also must be done evenly so mag wont seat canted, that is the difficult part, initially got them grinded down but mag was slightly canted, couldn’t tell with normal mags, but drum mags made it easier to see the cant, but this was still very slight and didn’t affect feeding, also was so tight that mag changes were difficult to do quickly. Took a tiny bit off the longer slat/feed lip, now seats evenly with less than 1mm of play side to side, also makes mag changes easier because its not soo tight as before, no audible rattle can be heard with mag. All in all took another 3 and ½ hours’ work on this as well.
Range test shows an average of 3-inch groupings at 100 yards firing off of a rest, very happy with this result. Used tula ammo 122gr fmj
Muzzle thread protector is held in place as normal breaks are by a detent in the front sight post; it is also reinforced by a weld bead on the 6 o’clock position under the barrel, so that it can’t be removed. It shouldn’t be a problem to cut through the weld bead and replace with m16A2 style muzzle break.
2/27/2011 7:16:12 PM
Thumbhole stock has rather high cheek weld making it difficult to get my face low enough to see wedge sights; wife also dislikes length of pull “too long” for her.
I like the look of the bakelite guards, centerfire systems pics of it don’t do them justice, they look really nice. Was thinking of replacing thumbhole with milled Bakelite set to match hand guards.
Rear trunion is flat with stamped top tang, so was gonna cut a bottom tang out of the middle of the rear trunion by cutting on 3 sides and bending it outward then cutting away the rest of the center of the rear tang to accommodate the Bulgarian milled but stock interface. Not sure if this would work though, stock would also prolly have to be modified and drilled to fit shorter bottom tang and any other problems.
I like the look of the bakelite guards, centerfire systems pics of it don’t do them justice, they look really nice. Was thinking of replacing thumbhole with milled Bakelite set to match hand guards.
Rear trunion is flat with stamped top tang, so was gonna cut a bottom tang out of the middle of the rear trunion by cutting on 3 sides and bending it outward then cutting away the rest of the center of the rear tang to accommodate the Bulgarian milled but stock interface. Not sure if this would work though, stock would also prolly have to be modified and drilled to fit shorter bottom tang and any other problems.
2/27/2011 7:17:10 PM
If that didn’t work I had 3 alternate stock ideas
Was thinking of just cutting out the whole flat rear tang and using a refinished Romanian wood take off stock set. Or maybe an East German choc pebble stock set. Or maybe a triangle side folder with Bakelite grip and original hand guards.
Well… wife ended those ideas by telling me she wants it all black and she wants a m4 style collapsible stock to accommodate our differences in size and desired length of pull, she also wants a rail mounted forward vertical grip.
Initially I told her tough, I am putting in the work on it I will decide how to mod it, and she the told me that “if I put an ugly wood stock on it, I will come home from work one day to find she painted blue clouds and rainbows all over it so then we would both hate the way in looks”.
Worst part was she would do it too. Sooooo
The final idea is to cut off the top tang and drill the 2 holes for an ace stock, then add an ace ar15 buffer tube adaptor so that that way she can have her m4 stock, and if I convince her I can at least go with an ace side folder eventually.
Was also going to go with the mako hand guards and either a folding grip or tapco’s short grip.
Was thinking of just cutting out the whole flat rear tang and using a refinished Romanian wood take off stock set. Or maybe an East German choc pebble stock set. Or maybe a triangle side folder with Bakelite grip and original hand guards.
Well… wife ended those ideas by telling me she wants it all black and she wants a m4 style collapsible stock to accommodate our differences in size and desired length of pull, she also wants a rail mounted forward vertical grip.
Initially I told her tough, I am putting in the work on it I will decide how to mod it, and she the told me that “if I put an ugly wood stock on it, I will come home from work one day to find she painted blue clouds and rainbows all over it so then we would both hate the way in looks”.
Worst part was she would do it too. Sooooo
The final idea is to cut off the top tang and drill the 2 holes for an ace stock, then add an ace ar15 buffer tube adaptor so that that way she can have her m4 stock, and if I convince her I can at least go with an ace side folder eventually.
Was also going to go with the mako hand guards and either a folding grip or tapco’s short grip.
2/27/2011 7:17:30 PM
Well that’s the status of my ssr85c project to date.
Would be happy to answer any questions about the project so far, from people thinking for getting this rifle from centerfire
Would also definitely like to hear any input from people with milled aks about if that bottom tang idea would work.
Also any input about stamped interface issues I may have if I did in fact go with that idea (I may still do this with an m4 style stock adapter instead of the ace adapter with cutting off the tang)
And of course any ideas about the ace stock from those that have em
Would be happy to answer any questions about the project so far, from people thinking for getting this rifle from centerfire
Would also definitely like to hear any input from people with milled aks about if that bottom tang idea would work.
Also any input about stamped interface issues I may have if I did in fact go with that idea (I may still do this with an m4 style stock adapter instead of the ace adapter with cutting off the tang)
And of course any ideas about the ace stock from those that have em
2/27/2011 8:48:21 PM
I finished mine today...Went trough 2 cutting wheels doing the magwell...The rear trunnion modding needed 5 cutting wheels and a sanding band. Finished off with a hand file...
2/27/2011 10:23:33 PM
wow, really turned out well. congrats
especialy like the look of the midwest ind quad rail
especialy like the look of the midwest ind quad rail
2/28/2011 1:48:18 AM
question though, why the wood stock along with quad rail? kinda mismatching dont ya think?
the midwest is one of the more expencive rails on the market, and the but stock looks like an brand new and unfinished wasr stock.
like I said before cool mod and deffenately good steady cheak weld and recoil control with the wood and forward grip + assessory capatability with the rail
but why not all wood or all black? just curious what let to the choice is all
the midwest is one of the more expencive rails on the market, and the but stock looks like an brand new and unfinished wasr stock.
like I said before cool mod and deffenately good steady cheak weld and recoil control with the wood and forward grip + assessory capatability with the rail
but why not all wood or all black? just curious what let to the choice is all
2/28/2011 10:07:59 AM
Simple...It is just stuff that I had laying around...I bought the rail when it first came out to put it in a "tactical" ak build...The build later materialized into something else so the rail was just sitting there and it is an easy compliance part...
The wood is from Ironwood and it is actually a full set...I'm using the handguard in an incoming underfolder build though so the buttstock was also sitting around as well...
The wood is from Ironwood and it is actually a full set...I'm using the handguard in an incoming underfolder build though so the buttstock was also sitting around as well...
2/28/2011 2:50:21 PM
I really like this post. I was thinking of converting one of these guns,but was nervous. Here are some thoughts I had. As far as an M4 style stock: I have one on my ak and I used an ACE adapter. I HIGHLY recommend it. It is sturdy and you don't have to remove the tang. This is nice because if you ever wanted to go back to a standard stock you can. Krebs sells a lot of parts and the have a setup where you can also make the m4 stock fold to the side. Now to the mag release lever. I have heard that they need to be changed, but I don't know. This may be the reason some of your mags were canted one way or the other, I'm not sure. Troy at InRange told me that it is a pain to get a standard stock to fit in them, but it can be done. I don't worry too much about handguards wobbling, but a synthetic set may be your best bet. Duct tape may burn off if you run the gun real hot. Post some photos of the process it would help.
2/28/2011 3:05:54 PM
I may be wrong, and often am, but for the normal ACE reciever blocks to work it assumes a normal rear trunion where the stock slides out.
There is no hole for the stock with these flat end trunions.
One would either have to modify the ace adapter by cutting off the section that slides into the reciever then drilling holes from the inside of the reciever into the block and then tapping that hole for a bolt. (insert bolt from inside the reciever). Use the top tang to fit inside the provided cutout in the ace block.
The other way to use this is go ahead and cut the rear trunion to take the ace block.
To add to the options a simple and quick way to add a M4 carbine type stock might be to buy the Ace A510 adapter, cut the tang off the rear trunion, and bolt the A510 directly to the flat face of the trunion. Simple and cheap. I think the rear trunion has enough strength for this but dont know how the angle of the stock works out. Perhaps it can be shimmed for a correct angle.
There is no hole for the stock with these flat end trunions.
One would either have to modify the ace adapter by cutting off the section that slides into the reciever then drilling holes from the inside of the reciever into the block and then tapping that hole for a bolt. (insert bolt from inside the reciever). Use the top tang to fit inside the provided cutout in the ace block.
The other way to use this is go ahead and cut the rear trunion to take the ace block.
To add to the options a simple and quick way to add a M4 carbine type stock might be to buy the Ace A510 adapter, cut the tang off the rear trunion, and bolt the A510 directly to the flat face of the trunion. Simple and cheap. I think the rear trunion has enough strength for this but dont know how the angle of the stock works out. Perhaps it can be shimmed for a correct angle.
2/28/2011 3:11:57 PM
I really like this post. I was thinking of converting one of these guns,but was nervous. Here are some thoughts I had. As far as an M4 style stock: I have one on my ak and I used an ACE adapter. I HIGHLY recommend it. It is sturdy and you don't have to remove the tang. This is nice because if you ever wanted to go back to a standard stock you can. Krebs sells a lot of parts and the have a setup where you can also make the m4 stock fold to the side. Now to the mag release lever. I have heard that they need to be changed, but I don't know. This may be the reason some of your mags were canted one way or the other, I'm not sure. Troy at InRange told me that it is a pain to get a standard stock to fit in them, but it can be done. I don't worry too much about handguards wobbling, but a synthetic set may be your best bet. Duct tape may burn off if you run the gun real hot. Post some photos of the process it would help.
ya, I should get the camera and take some pics, was thinkin that today
I will have to remember how to post them though, been a wile
as far as the tape, it is only on the "rear handguard lug" (dont know what its called) on the bottom handguard, the part that actually holds the bottom handguard to the reciever and not in contact with the barrel or anything, hope it wont end up burning but we will have to wait and see at the range.
also, the mag catch is fine as is!
it doesnt need repalcing and fits well, the "canting" of mags came from the reciever integral feed lips being uneven.
their are these rails/feed lips/ slats or what ever you choose to call em inside the reciever just above the dimples but below the bolt rails
they are too narrow for a high cap mag to fit, so after the mag well is finished they must be ground down as well before a mag will fit
after grinding them enough for the mag to fit the one on the left was just a lilttle wider than the one on the right.
so the mag canted a tiny bit, but I took the left one down just a little, and now they sit even. the mags now go in an sit even and stable
it was prolly the bigest pain of the whole process though
2/28/2011 3:19:37 PM
Originally Posted By lightguy:
I may be wrong, and often am, but for the normal ACE reciever blocks to work it assumes a normal rear trunion where the stock slides out.
There is no hole for the stock with these flat end trunions.
One would either have to modify the ace adapter by cutting off the section that slides into the reciever then drilling holes from the inside of the reciever into the block and then tapping that hole for a bolt. (insert bolt from inside the reciever). Use the top tang to fit inside the provided cutout in the ace block.
The other way to use this is go ahead and cut the rear trunion to take the ace block.
To add to the options a simple and quick way to add a M4 carbine type stock might be to buy the Ace A510 adapter, cut the tang off the rear trunion, and bolt the A510 directly to the flat face of the trunion. Simple and cheap. I think the rear trunion has enough strength for this but dont know how the angle of the stock works out. Perhaps it can be shimmed for a correct angle.
I may be wrong, and often am, but for the normal ACE reciever blocks to work it assumes a normal rear trunion where the stock slides out.
There is no hole for the stock with these flat end trunions.
One would either have to modify the ace adapter by cutting off the section that slides into the reciever then drilling holes from the inside of the reciever into the block and then tapping that hole for a bolt. (insert bolt from inside the reciever). Use the top tang to fit inside the provided cutout in the ace block.
The other way to use this is go ahead and cut the rear trunion to take the ace block.
To add to the options a simple and quick way to add a M4 carbine type stock might be to buy the Ace A510 adapter, cut the tang off the rear trunion, and bolt the A510 directly to the flat face of the trunion. Simple and cheap. I think the rear trunion has enough strength for this but dont know how the angle of the stock works out. Perhaps it can be shimmed for a correct angle.
this was what i was thinkin exactly, was woried about that angle though and the thought of a shim did occure to me. what would be cheap and easy to work with though that is still stroung enough to support it under strain??
also I am kinda leery about cutting off the tang and limiting myself to the ace stock forever, what about leaving the tang, drilling the holes in the rear trunion for the ace anyway, then maybe just attaching a wolf tail to the tang for looks and to find a use for it. or would the stock not clear the the tang and be the correct hight?
3/1/2011 8:54:59 PM
You might try buying the A510 and locating it below the tang and see if that works.
If it does and looks OK ; good to go.
If not you may need to cut out that area anyhow ( the drilled area for the A510 ) to fit a Ace stamped receiver block anyhow. Order it later.
Which in the end is probably the ideal way to go.
Even with the ace stamped receiver block you will need the A510 for the M4 stock.
Cant loose.
If it does and looks OK ; good to go.
If not you may need to cut out that area anyhow ( the drilled area for the A510 ) to fit a Ace stamped receiver block anyhow. Order it later.
Which in the end is probably the ideal way to go.
Even with the ace stamped receiver block you will need the A510 for the M4 stock.
Cant loose.
3/1/2011 9:05:41 PM
Originally Posted By usar_ds:
this was what i was thinkin exactly, was woried about that angle though and the thought of a shim did occure to me. what would be cheap and easy to work with though that is still stroung enough to support it under strain??
also I am kinda leery about cutting off the tang and limiting myself to the ace stock forever, what about leaving the tang, drilling the holes in the rear trunion for the ace anyway, then maybe just attaching a wolf tail to the tang for looks and to find a use for it. or would the stock not clear the the tang and be the correct hight?
Originally Posted By lightguy:
I may be wrong, and often am, but for the normal ACE reciever blocks to work it assumes a normal rear trunion where the stock slides out.
There is no hole for the stock with these flat end trunions.
One would either have to modify the ace adapter by cutting off the section that slides into the reciever then drilling holes from the inside of the reciever into the block and then tapping that hole for a bolt. (insert bolt from inside the reciever). Use the top tang to fit inside the provided cutout in the ace block.
The other way to use this is go ahead and cut the rear trunion to take the ace block.
To add to the options a simple and quick way to add a M4 carbine type stock might be to buy the Ace A510 adapter, cut the tang off the rear trunion, and bolt the A510 directly to the flat face of the trunion. Simple and cheap. I think the rear trunion has enough strength for this but dont know how the angle of the stock works out. Perhaps it can be shimmed for a correct angle.
I may be wrong, and often am, but for the normal ACE reciever blocks to work it assumes a normal rear trunion where the stock slides out.
There is no hole for the stock with these flat end trunions.
One would either have to modify the ace adapter by cutting off the section that slides into the reciever then drilling holes from the inside of the reciever into the block and then tapping that hole for a bolt. (insert bolt from inside the reciever). Use the top tang to fit inside the provided cutout in the ace block.
The other way to use this is go ahead and cut the rear trunion to take the ace block.
To add to the options a simple and quick way to add a M4 carbine type stock might be to buy the Ace A510 adapter, cut the tang off the rear trunion, and bolt the A510 directly to the flat face of the trunion. Simple and cheap. I think the rear trunion has enough strength for this but dont know how the angle of the stock works out. Perhaps it can be shimmed for a correct angle.
this was what i was thinkin exactly, was woried about that angle though and the thought of a shim did occure to me. what would be cheap and easy to work with though that is still stroung enough to support it under strain??
also I am kinda leery about cutting off the tang and limiting myself to the ace stock forever, what about leaving the tang, drilling the holes in the rear trunion for the ace anyway, then maybe just attaching a wolf tail to the tang for looks and to find a use for it. or would the stock not clear the the tang and be the correct hight?
Oh; and leave the tang alone for now.
I measured the wall thickness of that rear trunion back wall and its pretty stout. Cant remember the thickness but I personally would not worry.
You can place a thicker/wider washer under the nut (inside the reciever) to spread the load.
You can buy a set of cheapo feeler guages to experiment for shiming the A510 for the correct angle. Then cut and use the gauge itself as the shim.
Of course the Ace receiver block should have the correct angle if you go that route.
3/2/2011 4:12:05 AM
ya, that is the initial route I am definitely gonna go, that way if i run into too many problems with angle and so on i can still change it to a receiver block or standard stamped interface.
yesterday I was disassembling the stock and checking the rear trunion for angle which surprisingly may be fine even with out shims it looks like.
and the original stock would not go back on.
if i attempted to tighten it up it still had a lot of wobble, originally it was very solid feeling so I couldn't figure out why...
ended up tightening it up a little at a time to get it about were it was originally, and the pistol grip bolt busted through and ruined the stock.
very frustrating especially because i was being so careful, i was tightening so slow and it was still so loose i cant figure out why.
well original stock is definitely crap, was going to wait on the stock to be sure of what i wanted/needed
the fact that I now have no working stock for it definitely forced me to buy all the components to put the m4 stock and pistol grip on there pronto
so i will report on that as soon as it ships here
yesterday I was disassembling the stock and checking the rear trunion for angle which surprisingly may be fine even with out shims it looks like.
and the original stock would not go back on.
if i attempted to tighten it up it still had a lot of wobble, originally it was very solid feeling so I couldn't figure out why...
ended up tightening it up a little at a time to get it about were it was originally, and the pistol grip bolt busted through and ruined the stock.
very frustrating especially because i was being so careful, i was tightening so slow and it was still so loose i cant figure out why.
well original stock is definitely crap, was going to wait on the stock to be sure of what i wanted/needed
the fact that I now have no working stock for it definitely forced me to buy all the components to put the m4 stock and pistol grip on there pronto
so i will report on that as soon as it ships here
3/4/2011 11:49:20 PM
Want to buy a stock ? 
Watch; these things will become collectors items because most will be taken off and rightly tossed.
Watch; these things will become collectors items because most will be taken off and rightly tossed.
3/5/2011 3:08:12 AM
ya prolly,
I can see it now, 10 years down the road guys bragging that they found a genuine ssr85c plastic thumbhole stock on gunbroker
I ended up buying the A510 ace m4 stock adaptor as well as mako rails and an arsenal handgrip. I also ordered an ace skeleton stock 9 1/2 length just in case I really don't like the m4 stock.
the A510 ace adaptor hasn't come in the mail yet but I lined the rear trunion up with a m4 stock I have laying around and it looks like I will definitely have to use shims if I just wanna drill holes
the angle is just all wrong
question for those that have the ace receiver blocks: how many holes are their in the block it self??? it looks like the m4 stock adaptor uses 4 bolts were as the skeleton stock uses 2 so does the block have a 4 hole interface???
so to make the rear trunion compatible for both stocks I should have to drill 4 holes, right???
and I should be able to shim the 4 bolt A510 m4 stock by putting small washers on the top 2 bolts between the adaptor and the rear trunion, however if the ace skeleton stock only takes 2 bolts I would need a wedge shaped spacer of some kind right??
and will i NEED a folding mechanism to adapt from a 4 hole interface to 2 hole interface or can I just use the skeleton as a fixed stock???
basically will either 2 of the 4 drilled holes be the correct height to directly attach the skeleton stock with out the folding mechanism??
???,
any ideas???
I can see it now, 10 years down the road guys bragging that they found a genuine ssr85c plastic thumbhole stock on gunbroker
I ended up buying the A510 ace m4 stock adaptor as well as mako rails and an arsenal handgrip. I also ordered an ace skeleton stock 9 1/2 length just in case I really don't like the m4 stock.
the A510 ace adaptor hasn't come in the mail yet but I lined the rear trunion up with a m4 stock I have laying around and it looks like I will definitely have to use shims if I just wanna drill holes
the angle is just all wrong
question for those that have the ace receiver blocks: how many holes are their in the block it self??? it looks like the m4 stock adaptor uses 4 bolts were as the skeleton stock uses 2 so does the block have a 4 hole interface???
so to make the rear trunion compatible for both stocks I should have to drill 4 holes, right???
and I should be able to shim the 4 bolt A510 m4 stock by putting small washers on the top 2 bolts between the adaptor and the rear trunion, however if the ace skeleton stock only takes 2 bolts I would need a wedge shaped spacer of some kind right??
and will i NEED a folding mechanism to adapt from a 4 hole interface to 2 hole interface or can I just use the skeleton as a fixed stock???
basically will either 2 of the 4 drilled holes be the correct height to directly attach the skeleton stock with out the folding mechanism??
???,
any ideas???
3/5/2011 12:02:17 PM
My Ace Adapter has washers on the inside of the receiver where the block is bolted to the receiver. The block also bolts to the tang on the receiver.
3/5/2011 2:36:40 PM
Originally Posted By msanders84:
My Ace Adapter has washers on the inside of the receiver where the block is bolted to the receiver. The block also bolts to the tang on the receiver.
My Ace Adapter has washers on the inside of the receiver where the block is bolted to the receiver. The block also bolts to the tang on the receiver.
huh, the one I saw at midway usa says you must cut off the tang to acomodate that model. it is locked to the pistol grip nut and also locks to the bolt that goes in bellow the recoil spring. I will definitely look into one that lets you keep the tang.
but more importantly...
do you have a side folder on your ace block? if so, how does the folding mechanism lock to the receiver block? 4 bolts right?
and how does the actual ace stock lock to the folding mechanism, 2 bolts right?
looking at your ace stock would it be possible to remove the folding mechanism and lock the ace skeleton stock to the receiver block as a fixed (non-folding) stock??
is yes would it still be the correct height??
3/6/2011 10:50:15 PM
^ No idea.
Call ACE themselves ?
Call ACE themselves ?
3/10/2011 6:08:40 PM
OK Guy's, I have been thinking about ordering 3 of these rifles. What are you talking about, when you are talking about the Rear Trunnion ??
In the Pic's on Centerfire's site it looks like it has a Standard Stamped Style Rear Trunnion.. I now am thinking, what does it have???
Can someone please post a pic or a couple of pics of the Rear Trunnion area of this Rifle???
ALSO, If you are in need of an ACE style Folding Mechansim, I just got a Stormwerkz Folding Mechansim,
and it LOCKS TIGHT IN BOTH POSITIONS, NO SLOP, FLOP OR WOBBLE, it has Locking Lugs on Both Ends. It only costs $55.00 Shipped. You may want to give it a look.
http://stormwerkz.com/StormWerkz_Stock_Folding_Mechanism.html
Thanks,
Chief
In the Pic's on Centerfire's site it looks like it has a Standard Stamped Style Rear Trunnion.. I now am thinking, what does it have???
Can someone please post a pic or a couple of pics of the Rear Trunnion area of this Rifle???
ALSO, If you are in need of an ACE style Folding Mechansim, I just got a Stormwerkz Folding Mechansim,
and it LOCKS TIGHT IN BOTH POSITIONS, NO SLOP, FLOP OR WOBBLE, it has Locking Lugs on Both Ends. It only costs $55.00 Shipped. You may want to give it a look.
http://stormwerkz.com/StormWerkz_Stock_Folding_Mechanism.html
Thanks,
Chief
3/10/2011 6:13:37 PM
Originally Posted By 1NAVYCHIEF-RET:
OK Guy's, I have been thinking about ordering 3 of these rifles. What are you talking about, when you are talking about the Rear Trunnion ??
In the Pic's on Centerfire's site it looks like it has a Standard Stamped Style Rear Trunnion.. I now am thinking, what does it have???
Can someone please post a pic or a couple of pics of the Rear Trunnion area of this Rifle???
Thanks,
Chief
OK Guy's, I have been thinking about ordering 3 of these rifles. What are you talking about, when you are talking about the Rear Trunnion ??
In the Pic's on Centerfire's site it looks like it has a Standard Stamped Style Rear Trunnion.. I now am thinking, what does it have???
Can someone please post a pic or a couple of pics of the Rear Trunnion area of this Rifle???
Thanks,
Chief
Scroll down for pics here.
5/1/2011 4:26:38 AM
ok been a wile since I have been online
but... I cut off the rear tang, drilled the rear trunion and installed the ace adapter for the m4 stock, the angle of the rear trunion is all wrong, tried to shim it but gave up on that idea. was a huge pain.
also ended up saying screw the m4 stock and got an ace folder and folding mechanism, they are just so much cooler
waiting on an ace receiver block from midway...
then I will dremmel out the rear trunion and should be good with that.
all that will be left is cutting off the thread protecter and putting the muzzle brake on and should be good to go.
but... I cut off the rear tang, drilled the rear trunion and installed the ace adapter for the m4 stock, the angle of the rear trunion is all wrong, tried to shim it but gave up on that idea. was a huge pain.
also ended up saying screw the m4 stock and got an ace folder and folding mechanism, they are just so much cooler
waiting on an ace receiver block from midway...
then I will dremmel out the rear trunion and should be good with that.
all that will be left is cutting off the thread protecter and putting the muzzle brake on and should be good to go.
5/2/2011 12:00:44 PM
Originally Posted By usar_ds:
ok been a wile since I have been online
but... I cut off the rear tang, drilled the rear trunion and installed the ace adapter for the m4 stock, the angle of the rear trunion is all wrong, tried to shim it but gave up on that idea. was a huge pain.
also ended up saying screw the m4 stock and got an ace folder and folding mechanism, they are just so much cooler
waiting on an ace receiver block from midway...
then I will dremmel out the rear trunion and should be good with that.
all that will be left is cutting off the thread protecter and putting the muzzle brake on and should be good to go.
ok been a wile since I have been online
but... I cut off the rear tang, drilled the rear trunion and installed the ace adapter for the m4 stock, the angle of the rear trunion is all wrong, tried to shim it but gave up on that idea. was a huge pain.
also ended up saying screw the m4 stock and got an ace folder and folding mechanism, they are just so much cooler
waiting on an ace receiver block from midway...
then I will dremmel out the rear trunion and should be good with that.
all that will be left is cutting off the thread protecter and putting the muzzle brake on and should be good to go.
Good work.
Waiting to see your progress before I jump in.
Cuz I'm just a chicken.
Did you say you used a reciever flat for a magwell template ?
5/17/2011 1:54:14 PM
so where are the pics?!
5/20/2011 5:56:00 AM
Tag, because I have two of these things to 922(r) and I'm still not sure exactly what route I want to go.
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5/24/2011 5:00:33 AM
ya I should get around to post some pics, was gonna wait till the project was finished and post a bunch of before and after picks of the different steps i took.
but i am really pissed at the project right now.
the ace block I am going to use requires the rear tang to be cut off, so i did that, then i cut out the flat portion of the rear trunion to insert the ace reciever block, but i can see now it is way too wide,
the rear trunion wraps around the inside of the rear portion of the reciever, I will have to cut away at that to fit the ace block.
but i dont think i can cut off to much of it or I will loose stability in the top portion of the rear trunion,
so now i will have to cut some of it away, which will be a real pain in the ass to do just right with only a dremmel cutting wheel. then i will have to grind down part of the ace block to accomodate the part of the rear trunion i cant cut away.
it is going to be slow, carefull, difficult work with the limited tools i have.
then i will have to drill the top of the rear trunion to insert a support bolt.
at this point i wish i had just bought a wood stock and been done with it, but it is too late now as the tang is already cut off
more to come soon
but i am really pissed at the project right now.
the ace block I am going to use requires the rear tang to be cut off, so i did that, then i cut out the flat portion of the rear trunion to insert the ace reciever block, but i can see now it is way too wide,
the rear trunion wraps around the inside of the rear portion of the reciever, I will have to cut away at that to fit the ace block.
but i dont think i can cut off to much of it or I will loose stability in the top portion of the rear trunion,
so now i will have to cut some of it away, which will be a real pain in the ass to do just right with only a dremmel cutting wheel. then i will have to grind down part of the ace block to accomodate the part of the rear trunion i cant cut away.
it is going to be slow, carefull, difficult work with the limited tools i have.
then i will have to drill the top of the rear trunion to insert a support bolt.
at this point i wish i had just bought a wood stock and been done with it, but it is too late now as the tang is already cut off
more to come soon
6/4/2011 3:44:03 AM
ok its finally finished
ended up deciding that the best corse of action was to cut the portion of the ace adaptor block away that would normaly grip the pistol grip screw, then file down the block to fit, then drill and tap the reciever and block to hold the block in place. unfortunately I dont have the tools to drill , then countersink, and then tap it. so I ended up taking it to a friend i have over at www.dynamicfirearmsolutions.com (gotta give credit were it is due) anyway here is the end result.
before...
after
ended up deciding that the best corse of action was to cut the portion of the ace adaptor block away that would normaly grip the pistol grip screw, then file down the block to fit, then drill and tap the reciever and block to hold the block in place. unfortunately I dont have the tools to drill , then countersink, and then tap it. so I ended up taking it to a friend i have over at www.dynamicfirearmsolutions.com (gotta give credit were it is due) anyway here is the end result.
before...
after
6/4/2011 3:52:44 AM
pics of mag well conversion, wish I had done a cleaner job but it holds mags perfectly, and with no wobble.
so i dont have too much to complain about.
like I said before. the feed lips are the bigest pain
I also didnt have a before pic of this so I am using a before pic from some lone elses thread. hope they dont mind
before
after
so i dont have too much to complain about.
like I said before. the feed lips are the bigest pain
I also didnt have a before pic of this so I am using a before pic from some lone elses thread. hope they dont mind
before
after
6/4/2011 4:16:32 AM
range test this morning, went well
weapon initialy had cycling problems, with silver bear 123gr and bulgy 30rd mags, bolt would not cycle with enough force to chamber the next round.
however I swiched to a korean 75rd drum loaded with tula 122gr and she ran like a champ.
after 75 rds of tula(with no problems)I went back to the silver bear and the bulgy 30 rd mag, and no more problems, guess i just had to break her in, or maybe she was just to dirty from the work dont on her???
anyway 25m zero went well (took a wile though) and i pushed out to 100m, avg grouping was around 4" off a sand bag rest with silver bear 123gr fmj.
well hear she is...
weapon initialy had cycling problems, with silver bear 123gr and bulgy 30rd mags, bolt would not cycle with enough force to chamber the next round.
however I swiched to a korean 75rd drum loaded with tula 122gr and she ran like a champ.
after 75 rds of tula(with no problems)I went back to the silver bear and the bulgy 30 rd mag, and no more problems, guess i just had to break her in, or maybe she was just to dirty from the work dont on her???
anyway 25m zero went well (took a wile though) and i pushed out to 100m, avg grouping was around 4" off a sand bag rest with silver bear 123gr fmj.
well hear she is...
6/4/2011 10:46:36 AM
very nicely done. Looks great, especially with the bakelite. Is that hex screw for the folder mech? A quick question, why not just cut the tang and then drill and tap the rear like everyone is doing with the Draco's? Or is that what you did? The pics are kinda dark on my screen.
6/4/2011 1:29:32 PM
Nice looking stick. I like your selection of components for the rifle. Bakelite handguards look good.
6/4/2011 5:35:20 PM
Originally Posted By nictra:
very nicely done. Looks great, especially with the bakelite. Is that hex screw for the folder mech? A quick question, why not just cut the tang and then drill and tap the rear like everyone is doing with the Draco's? Or is that what you did? The pics are kinda dark on my screen.
very nicely done. Looks great, especially with the bakelite. Is that hex screw for the folder mech? A quick question, why not just cut the tang and then drill and tap the rear like everyone is doing with the Draco's? Or is that what you did? The pics are kinda dark on my screen.
I tried that initially, for one the rear trunnion on this rifle is the same thickness of the receiver so it can be drilled but not really taped, so you need to put self locking nuts on the inside of the receiver to lock the bolts in place, the width of the increments between the bolts also means that the self locking nuts have to be filed down on one side because they are too close to the walls of the receiver to fit...
the rear trunnion's flat backside on this model is also at a 120ish degree angle to the bottom of the receiver so the buttstock then sits jutting at an upward angle, what you would have to do is cut and file down a wedge shaped piece of metal to compensate for the rear angle, then drill it to fit between the rear trunnion and the folding mechanism.
but I basically said to hell with it and bought an ACE "(AKRBC) Compact AK Receiver Block"...
so then I get the block and cut the rear trunnion so I can insert the block, but the block is too wide for the receiver even if there was no trunnion. this particular rear trunnion also wraps around both of the inside walls of the receiver as well so the block is way to wide.
and because the ACE receiver block locks to the pistol grip screw if I filed it down narrow enough to fit inside the receiver I would loose the whole part that locks it to the pistol grip screw all together.
so I had 2 options,
option 1: carefully cut away at the rear trunnion were it wraps around the inside walls of the receiver being careful not to cut away at the points that secure it in place, then cut away and file down at the ACE block, making it narrower on the points that make contact with the points on the rear trunnion that cant be cut away, but I would have still lost a significant amount of strength holding the receiver block in place.
or option 2: Cut off the portion of the ACE block that locks it to the pistol grip screw, then file it narrower to fit inside the receiver despite the sides of the rear trunnion, then drill/countersink through the sides/bottom of the receiver, and top of rear trunnion. then drill/tap the ace block on the sides/top/bottom. thus securely locking th ace block in place.
I ended up going with option 2
6/4/2011 5:45:16 PM
Originally Posted By Liquidmetal:
Nice looking stick. I like your selection of components for the rifle. Bakelite handguards look good.
Nice looking stick. I like your selection of components for the rifle. Bakelite handguards look good.
thanks, ya I have a black set of mako handguards I bought for it but I ended up just loving look of the bakelite.
6/4/2011 7:58:57 PM
and sorry about the pics quality, I gotta work with the camera I got.
6/4/2011 9:04:15 PM
good deal, sorry, I didn't read the whole thread...Looks great!
6/5/2011 12:56:26 PM
I like the ace. looks great. mine was a little picky w/ mags at first but seems to get better every trip. i think it was my fault since i left the magwell a little too tight initially. but she runs 100% now. these bulgy rifles are awsome.
*edit* what kinda groups do you get w/ the staple gun?LOL
*edit* what kinda groups do you get w/ the staple gun?LOL
6/7/2011 2:18:06 AM
Originally Posted By ak47mays:
I like the ace. looks great. mine was a little picky w/ mags at first but seems to get better every trip. i think it was my fault since i left the magwell a little too tight initially. but she runs 100% now. these bulgy rifles are awsome.
*edit* what kinda groups do you get w/ the staple gun?LOL
I like the ace. looks great. mine was a little picky w/ mags at first but seems to get better every trip. i think it was my fault since i left the magwell a little too tight initially. but she runs 100% now. these bulgy rifles are awsome.
*edit* what kinda groups do you get w/ the staple gun?LOL
hah,
ya they seem to be a little picky at 1st but once you run some ammo though them they seem to even out and run like champs.
6/16/2011 11:07:58 AM
I have one of these and have already opened up the back. I was wondering what parts you were using to 922r the gun? I was planning on doing the trigger group, muzzle break, stock and pistol grip. Are there any less expensive ways? I don't want to use US mags.
6/18/2011 4:57:00 PM
Originally Posted By msanders84:
I have one of these and have already opened up the back. I was wondering what parts you were using to 922r the gun? I was planning on doing the trigger group, muzzle break, stock and pistol grip. Are there any less expensive ways? I don't want to use US mags.
I have one of these and have already opened up the back. I was wondering what parts you were using to 922r the gun? I was planning on doing the trigger group, muzzle break, stock and pistol grip. Are there any less expensive ways? I don't want to use US mags.
the only other suggestion I would have would be the gas piston as well, you can get a cheap US made one for a reasonable price,
