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Problem with Hammer Pin
12/21/2010 12:47:42 PM
Hello everybody! I'm a newbie to rifles and this is my first post. I wanted to ask your help for a problem I'm having with my I.O. Inc. AK-47C. If I cycle the rifle, the hammer pin pops out. Of course, firing it makes it even worse. I was able to put it back in place and added some blue Loctite, but it happened again. Shall I return the rifle to the manufacturer and pay for transportation costs or is there something easy I can do myself and avoid the headache of shipping the AK-47? I think I can change a pin, but is it worth it? Many thanks!
Pin in place
Pin popped out
Pin in place
Pin popped out
12/21/2010 1:56:45 PM
AK hammer and trigger pins are retained by a wire device, often called a "shepard's hook" because of the appearance.
There are several different types of these wires and and how they are installed.
These wire retainers lock into the groove on the hammer and trigger pins and lock them in place.
Sometimes builders fail to install the wire correctly and you get pins coming out.
You have options:
First is to install the wire correctly. This usually fixes the problem permanently. The AK wire is a simple but elegant solution to pin retention and once in place correctly never give any more trouble.
Here's a site that shows the various wire types and how they're installed. Go down to post #18.
http://www.akfiles.com/forums/showthread.php?t=33108
Second option is to buy one of the AK plate type retention devices. These are made of flat steel and are much easier to install.
There the older style and the new Tapco type:
http://dpharms.com/tapcoakretainingplatenew-p-1110.html
http://www.redstararms.com/
There are several different types of these wires and and how they are installed.
These wire retainers lock into the groove on the hammer and trigger pins and lock them in place.
Sometimes builders fail to install the wire correctly and you get pins coming out.
You have options:
First is to install the wire correctly. This usually fixes the problem permanently. The AK wire is a simple but elegant solution to pin retention and once in place correctly never give any more trouble.
Here's a site that shows the various wire types and how they're installed. Go down to post #18.
http://www.akfiles.com/forums/showthread.php?t=33108
Second option is to buy one of the AK plate type retention devices. These are made of flat steel and are much easier to install.
There the older style and the new Tapco type:
http://dpharms.com/tapcoakretainingplatenew-p-1110.html
http://www.redstararms.com/
12/21/2010 2:10:53 PM
I noticed the shepherd's hook! Thanks! I'll give it a try. 
12/21/2010 2:41:57 PM
You can also go to a hardware store and buy 2 "E" clips to clip on the group around the pin. Take the pin with you to find the right size, I don't know it off hand.
Also, that hole looks slightly elongated. Could be just the picture, but it looks bigger than than the pin by a bunch.
Also, that hole looks slightly elongated. Could be just the picture, but it looks bigger than than the pin by a bunch.
12/21/2010 5:31:34 PM
Thank you, Mach: good to know!
12/21/2010 10:44:37 PM
Success! 
Mine is a Bulgarian Shepherd's hook and it was over the hammer pin, instead of under it. Now that the hook is under the pin, it keeps the pin in place. Thank you all again!
Mine is a Bulgarian Shepherd's hook and it was over the hammer pin, instead of under it. Now that the hook is under the pin, it keeps the pin in place. Thank you all again!12/22/2010 8:56:55 AM
Originally Posted By Mach:
You can also go to a hardware store and buy 2 "E" clips to clip on the group around the pin. Take the pin with you to find the right size, I don't know it off hand.
Also, that hole looks slightly elongated. Could be just the picture, but it looks bigger than than the pin by a bunch.
http://lh3.googleusercontent.com/public/bV1Qs1c8107tbi0YYUNRRQq42Km7qTYJcmXY7er39xn-xAxQM5dEbDLTI-6iJbaVVDk6UVUsHKX_9KwZEtv_GFB2AnKPLVC9a36hIBzqS3N0piJcv04lQGL4tqmn4kDk90vugjrtwg
You can also go to a hardware store and buy 2 "E" clips to clip on the group around the pin. Take the pin with you to find the right size, I don't know it off hand.
Also, that hole looks slightly elongated. Could be just the picture, but it looks bigger than than the pin by a bunch.
http://lh3.googleusercontent.com/public/bV1Qs1c8107tbi0YYUNRRQq42Km7qTYJcmXY7er39xn-xAxQM5dEbDLTI-6iJbaVVDk6UVUsHKX_9KwZEtv_GFB2AnKPLVC9a36hIBzqS3N0piJcv04lQGL4tqmn4kDk90vugjrtwg
E clips don't work worth a damn. They're not designed to fit the groove in the pins (with a round bottom) and eventually "walk" of the pin or break.
Hairpin clips and/or hitchpin clips are designed to work in a groove with a round bottom and will stay put. Take a pin to the store and buy the ones that fit.
12/22/2010 9:14:01 AM
Originally Posted By POLYTHENEPAM:
E clips don't work worth a damn. They're not designed to fit the groove in the pins (with a round bottom) and eventually "walk" of the pin or break.
Hairpin clips and/or hitchpin clips are designed to work in a groove with a round bottom and will stay put. Take a pin to the store and buy the ones that fit.
Originally Posted By Mach:
You can also go to a hardware store and buy 2 "E" clips to clip on the group around the pin. Take the pin with you to find the right size, I don't know it off hand.
Also, that hole looks slightly elongated. Could be just the picture, but it looks bigger than than the pin by a bunch.
http://lh3.googleusercontent.com/public/bV1Qs1c8107tbi0YYUNRRQq42Km7qTYJcmXY7er39xn-xAxQM5dEbDLTI-6iJbaVVDk6UVUsHKX_9KwZEtv_GFB2AnKPLVC9a36hIBzqS3N0piJcv04lQGL4tqmn4kDk90vugjrtwg
You can also go to a hardware store and buy 2 "E" clips to clip on the group around the pin. Take the pin with you to find the right size, I don't know it off hand.
Also, that hole looks slightly elongated. Could be just the picture, but it looks bigger than than the pin by a bunch.
http://lh3.googleusercontent.com/public/bV1Qs1c8107tbi0YYUNRRQq42Km7qTYJcmXY7er39xn-xAxQM5dEbDLTI-6iJbaVVDk6UVUsHKX_9KwZEtv_GFB2AnKPLVC9a36hIBzqS3N0piJcv04lQGL4tqmn4kDk90vugjrtwg
E clips don't work worth a damn. They're not designed to fit the groove in the pins (with a round bottom) and eventually "walk" of the pin or break.
Hairpin clips and/or hitchpin clips are designed to work in a groove with a round bottom and will stay put. Take a pin to the store and buy the ones that fit.
Mine work very well. Have you personally had problems with them?
12/22/2010 4:08:00 PM
Originally Posted By Mach:
Mine work very well. Have you personally had problems with them?
Originally Posted By POLYTHENEPAM:
E clips don't work worth a damn. They're not designed to fit the groove in the pins (with a round bottom) and eventually "walk" of the pin or break.
Hairpin clips and/or hitchpin clips are designed to work in a groove with a round bottom and will stay put. Take a pin to the store and buy the ones that fit.
Originally Posted By Mach:
You can also go to a hardware store and buy 2 "E" clips to clip on the group around the pin. Take the pin with you to find the right size, I don't know it off hand.
Also, that hole looks slightly elongated. Could be just the picture, but it looks bigger than than the pin by a bunch.
http://lh3.googleusercontent.com/public/bV1Qs1c8107tbi0YYUNRRQq42Km7qTYJcmXY7er39xn-xAxQM5dEbDLTI-6iJbaVVDk6UVUsHKX_9KwZEtv_GFB2AnKPLVC9a36hIBzqS3N0piJcv04lQGL4tqmn4kDk90vugjrtwg
You can also go to a hardware store and buy 2 "E" clips to clip on the group around the pin. Take the pin with you to find the right size, I don't know it off hand.
Also, that hole looks slightly elongated. Could be just the picture, but it looks bigger than than the pin by a bunch.
http://lh3.googleusercontent.com/public/bV1Qs1c8107tbi0YYUNRRQq42Km7qTYJcmXY7er39xn-xAxQM5dEbDLTI-6iJbaVVDk6UVUsHKX_9KwZEtv_GFB2AnKPLVC9a36hIBzqS3N0piJcv04lQGL4tqmn4kDk90vugjrtwg
E clips don't work worth a damn. They're not designed to fit the groove in the pins (with a round bottom) and eventually "walk" of the pin or break.
Hairpin clips and/or hitchpin clips are designed to work in a groove with a round bottom and will stay put. Take a pin to the store and buy the ones that fit.
Mine work very well. Have you personally had problems with them?
I used E clips on the first rifle I built. Somewhere between 500 and 750 shots through the rifle the E clip on the trigger broke. I replaced it, figuring that the clip was defective. Within 250 more shots the E clip walked off the pin, which allowed the pin to walk out of the right side hole. That caused the disconnector/trigger to fail to engage the hammer, which promptly followed the carrier forward. After finding the clip in the rifle, unbroken, I recognized that I had a problem, so I consulted my brother who happens to be a mechanical engineer. He explained that the E clip is designed to work in a groove which is only slightly wider than the clip and has sides that are flat and parallel. That shape limits the lateral movement of the clip and supports it. He demonstrated what happens when lateral pressure is applied to the clip when it's on the AK axis pin - it wiggles around, due to the lack of support. After telling me the E clips would eventually break or walk off the pin, he suggested that I get hitch pin clips or hairpin hair pin clips. I followed the advice and haven't had a problem after several thousand shots through each of several rifles.
12/22/2010 6:40:08 PM
Originally Posted By POLYTHENEPAM:
I used E clips on the first rifle I built. Somewhere between 500 and 750 shots through the rifle the E clip on the trigger broke. I replaced it, figuring that the clip was defective. Within 250 more shots the E clip walked off the pin, which allowed the pin to walk out of the right side hole. That caused the disconnector/trigger to fail to engage the hammer, which promptly followed the carrier forward. After finding the clip in the rifle, unbroken, I recognized that I had a problem, so I consulted my brother who happens to be a mechanical engineer. He explained that the E clip is designed to work in a groove which is only slightly wider than the clip and has sides that are flat and parallel. That shape limits the lateral movement of the clip and supports it. He demonstrated what happens when lateral pressure is applied to the clip when it's on the AK axis pin - it wiggles around, due to the lack of support. After telling me the E clips would eventually break or walk off the pin, he suggested that I get hitch pin clips or hairpin hair pin clips. I followed the advice and haven't had a problem after several thousand shots through each of several rifles.
Originally Posted By Mach:
Mine work very well. Have you personally had problems with them?
Originally Posted By POLYTHENEPAM:
E clips don't work worth a damn. They're not designed to fit the groove in the pins (with a round bottom) and eventually "walk" of the pin or break.
Hairpin clips and/or hitchpin clips are designed to work in a groove with a round bottom and will stay put. Take a pin to the store and buy the ones that fit.
Originally Posted By Mach:
You can also go to a hardware store and buy 2 "E" clips to clip on the group around the pin. Take the pin with you to find the right size, I don't know it off hand.
Also, that hole looks slightly elongated. Could be just the picture, but it looks bigger than than the pin by a bunch.
http://lh3.googleusercontent.com/public/bV1Qs1c8107tbi0YYUNRRQq42Km7qTYJcmXY7er39xn-xAxQM5dEbDLTI-6iJbaVVDk6UVUsHKX_9KwZEtv_GFB2AnKPLVC9a36hIBzqS3N0piJcv04lQGL4tqmn4kDk90vugjrtwg
You can also go to a hardware store and buy 2 "E" clips to clip on the group around the pin. Take the pin with you to find the right size, I don't know it off hand.
Also, that hole looks slightly elongated. Could be just the picture, but it looks bigger than than the pin by a bunch.
http://lh3.googleusercontent.com/public/bV1Qs1c8107tbi0YYUNRRQq42Km7qTYJcmXY7er39xn-xAxQM5dEbDLTI-6iJbaVVDk6UVUsHKX_9KwZEtv_GFB2AnKPLVC9a36hIBzqS3N0piJcv04lQGL4tqmn4kDk90vugjrtwg
E clips don't work worth a damn. They're not designed to fit the groove in the pins (with a round bottom) and eventually "walk" of the pin or break.
Hairpin clips and/or hitchpin clips are designed to work in a groove with a round bottom and will stay put. Take a pin to the store and buy the ones that fit.
Mine work very well. Have you personally had problems with them?
I used E clips on the first rifle I built. Somewhere between 500 and 750 shots through the rifle the E clip on the trigger broke. I replaced it, figuring that the clip was defective. Within 250 more shots the E clip walked off the pin, which allowed the pin to walk out of the right side hole. That caused the disconnector/trigger to fail to engage the hammer, which promptly followed the carrier forward. After finding the clip in the rifle, unbroken, I recognized that I had a problem, so I consulted my brother who happens to be a mechanical engineer. He explained that the E clip is designed to work in a groove which is only slightly wider than the clip and has sides that are flat and parallel. That shape limits the lateral movement of the clip and supports it. He demonstrated what happens when lateral pressure is applied to the clip when it's on the AK axis pin - it wiggles around, due to the lack of support. After telling me the E clips would eventually break or walk off the pin, he suggested that I get hitch pin clips or hairpin hair pin clips. I followed the advice and haven't had a problem after several thousand shots through each of several rifles.
Thanks. I'll let my brother know too. We both used E clips, but I don't have maybe 200 rounds through the rifle.
