AR15.Com Archives
 Who all actually makes LPKs?
Dan_Gray  [Team Member]
8/15/2011 9:36:56 AM EST
Like lowers, there are many less manufacturers than there are brands I'm sure.

Mega sourced a part for their lowers from DPMS and is having to replace it because it's breaking apart like sand. They're no longer using DPMS for that part. CS from Mega has been excellent.

So in an effort to actually know what people are buying, who is as making the parts kits for which vendors?

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wyager  [Member]
8/15/2011 9:53:53 AM EST
Good question. I would imagine that the same people who make lowers make parts (to help keep everything within tight specs), but I am interested in the answer to this as well.
M4  [Life Member]
8/15/2011 10:03:36 AM EST
I believe DPMS, Daniel Defense, LMT, Bushmaster and Colt do.

Not sure who else....and not 100% on all those above, pretty sure they all do.

DPMS kits are widely used by many manufacturers....that is for sure.
PursuitSS  [Team Member]
8/15/2011 11:47:03 AM EST
Armalite has a different bolt catch than anyone else.
ccosby  [Team Member]
8/15/2011 12:00:02 PM EST
My understanding is it is more then that. It is who makes what parts in the kits. There are a lot of little machine shops that make certain parts. A lower parts kit might be comprised of parts from various vendors. IE the springs might come from somewhere else then the indents.
Dan_Gray  [Team Member]
8/15/2011 12:31:02 PM EST
Originally Posted By ccosby:
My understanding is it is more then that. It is who makes what parts in the kits. There are a lot of little machine shops that make certain parts. A lower parts kit might be comprised of parts from various vendors. IE the springs might come from somewhere else then the indents.


I figured the springs were all off the shelf items. I guess it makes sense on the rest.

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cross3700  [Member]
8/15/2011 12:31:18 PM EST
Originally Posted By Dan_Gray:
Like lowers, there are many less manufacturers than there are brands I'm sure.

Mega sourced a part for their lowers from DPMS and is having to replace it because it's breaking apart like sand. They're no longer using DPMS for that part. CS from Mega has been excellent.

So in an effort to actually know what people are buying, who is as making the parts kits for which vendors?

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Just out of curiosity, what part of their lowers is Mega having problems with?

Dan_Gray  [Team Member]
8/15/2011 12:40:01 PM EST
Originally Posted By cross3700:


Just out of curiosity, what part of their lowers is Mega having problems with?



On the ambi billet lowers, the roll pin that holds the left side bolt release is replaced by a threaded pin. Mine crumbled like powdered sugar once the threads engaged. Mega is using a different pin now and doing hassle free replacements if required.



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cross3700  [Member]
8/15/2011 2:24:36 PM EST
thanks. That's crazy.
458winmag  [Team Member]
8/15/2011 3:39:11 PM EST
Who knows? Colt doesn't even make their upper receivers.

wyager  [Member]
8/15/2011 6:52:11 PM EST
Originally Posted By 458winmag:
Who knows? Colt doesn't even make their upper receivers.



Who makes them?
scottydoesnt  [Member]
8/16/2011 1:47:29 AM EST
My hammer is stamped LWRCI on it straight out of the kit I bought from them.
TrackSol  [Team Member]
8/17/2011 12:12:19 PM EST
I know the Rock River trigger and hammer I bought to replace my DPMS ones were of MUCH better quality and were night and day difference.

A friend of mine recently built a lower using a Palmetto State Armory MOE LPK and we both felt the same higher quality in the trigger compared to the DPMS kit on his other rifle and mine.
Dan_Gray  [Team Member]
8/17/2011 12:52:19 PM EST
Originally Posted By TrackSol:
I know the Rock River trigger and hammer I bought to replace my DPMS ones were of MUCH better quality and were night and day difference.

A friend of mine recently built a lower using a Palmetto State Armory MOE LPK and we both felt the same higher quality in the trigger compared to the DPMS kit on his other rifle and mine.


Except for the trigger and safety, that's a PSA lpk above. It seemed to be good quality.

And my screw is already in. 2 days, WA state to Arkansas. That's great CS.

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votefromrooftops  [Team Member]
8/17/2011 1:30:05 PM EST
Originally Posted By TrackSol:
I know the Rock River trigger and hammer I bought to replace my DPMS ones were of MUCH better quality and were night and day difference.

A friend of mine recently built a lower using a Palmetto State Armory MOE LPK and we both felt the same higher quality in the trigger compared to the DPMS kit on his other rifle and mine.


i've seen this also, PSA is very Stag/CMT like, the parts are quality, not junk like DPMS and Spikes LPK's. i've seen 2 PSA LPK's used so far and both have very good triggers, clean and somewhat crisp. Stag/CMT and Daniel Defense, J&T are the best LPK's i've seen. i would not hesitate to use a PSA from what i have seen first hand. i have had mixed results with Rock River, the parts kit was fine, but the trigger was something horrible, to be honest that was 1 out of 6 used from Rock River. So far the most consistant quality i have seen is J&T(because i've used them the longest) Stag/CMT and Daniel Defense. the LPK's all have had quality small parts and the triggers don't have to be polished out of the package every time
EHilderbrand  [Team Member]
8/17/2011 2:28:44 PM EST
IIRC, a company called MicroBest is a manufacturer of several parts for some of the big name's out there.
wyager  [Member]
8/17/2011 3:48:53 PM EST
Originally Posted By EHilderbrand:
IIRC, a company called MicroBest is a manufacturer of several parts for some of the big name's out there.


Their website shows a ton of AR parts, not just LPK parts. Bolts/firing pins/etc. too.
EHilderbrand  [Team Member]
8/17/2011 3:53:14 PM EST
Yep. There are a few other manufacturers as well, I just can"t recall who they are.
strat81  [Team Member]
8/17/2011 5:33:32 PM EST
Archive Link

I asked a similar question a while back.
madecov  [Member]
8/18/2011 10:40:17 AM EST
I have two PSA kits that have one of the best triggers I've ever had.
My STAG triggers are ok but not great.

I thought CMT manufactured parts kits.
DeathDealer164  [Team Member]
8/18/2011 10:48:49 AM EST
Not to hijack the thread, but can anybody suggest where a person can purchase an LMT LPK?
maleante  [Team Member]
8/18/2011 11:07:32 AM EST
LAR

...LAR Manufacturing has been producing precision engineered firearms and firearms components for over 40 years. Founded in 1968, LAR began manufacturing of M16 upper receivers for the Rock Island U.S. Armament Command...

LAR never stopped building firearms components for the M16 and AR15 platforms. LAR has acted and continues to be a contract manufacturing facility for some of the world’s largest AR15 brand names in the industry...
maleante  [Team Member]
8/18/2011 11:08:22 AM EST
Originally Posted By madecov:
I have two PSA kits that have one of the best triggers I've ever had.
My STAG triggers are ok but not great.

I thought CMT manufactured parts kits.


CMT's commercial line of products is STAG.
maleante  [Team Member]
8/18/2011 11:12:35 AM EST
Originally Posted By 458winmag:
Who knows? Colt doesn't even make their upper receivers.



Oh really?

You don't know what you speak of.

Colt makes everything in house.

Their FORGINGS for uppers and lowers (as with ALL other AR or M16 manufacturing companies) come from a forge. Colt uses Cerro among others.
maleante  [Team Member]
8/18/2011 11:13:50 AM EST
Diemaco makes their own parts...

bmnpa  [Team Member]
8/18/2011 1:03:37 PM EST
Whomsoevah produced the ones for Roggio Arsenal;




produces or better stated cut out the worst pieces of scheisse ever seen @ $100 a pop.

The hammer was soft, the dis-connector didn't without some judicious filing on it, and the trigger hung/stuck/grinded so bad it was horrible

YMMV
458winmag  [Team Member]
8/18/2011 3:21:18 PM EST
Originally Posted By maleante:
Originally Posted By 458winmag:
Who knows? Colt doesn't even make their upper receivers.



Oh really?

You don't know what you speak of.

Colt makes everything in house.

Their FORGINGS for uppers and lowers (as with ALL other AR or M16 manufacturing companies) come from a forge. Colt uses Cerro among others.

So, what you're saying is they don't make their upper receivers in house?
I'll agree.

Dan_Gray  [Team Member]
8/18/2011 3:25:40 PM EST
Originally Posted By 458winmag:
Originally Posted By maleante:
Originally Posted By 458winmag:
Who knows? Colt doesn't even make their upper receivers.



Oh really?

You don't know what you speak of.

Colt makes everything in house.

Their FORGINGS for uppers and lowers (as with ALL other AR or M16 manufacturing companies) come from a forge. Colt uses Cerro among others.

So, what you're saying is they don't make their upper receivers in house?
I'll agree.



They turn the forging into the receiver. No, they don't make the raw base metal. No AR maker does. They come from a forge.

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458winmag  [Team Member]
8/18/2011 3:31:11 PM EST
So, what leads anyone to believe any company makes it's own parts?

They finish suppliers product to individual specs at best.
maleante  [Team Member]
8/18/2011 4:00:37 PM EST
Your definition of "make" is skewed in relation to the AR world.

Let's define "make"...

I can make my own ar15. Make in this sense is me assembling parts together like lego's.

Cerro Forge makes forgings. Make in this sense is Cerro shaping metal by plastic
deformation under great pressure into high strength parts that are a raw chunk of metal as the outcome.

Colt makes all their AR parts in house. Make in this sense is Colt taking raw metal and raw forgings (shaped into semi-definable shapes), and machining every single piece to their specifications to create a product that was entirely designed and machined meets quality control specs by Colt.



Upper and Lower Forgings are nothing more than chunks of aluminum melted together to "make" this form below:




This is a Colt lower which was "made" from the forging above.





Now, ask yourself this question: During which process of the two above is something usable actually made? That should answer your question on whether or not Colt makes their own uppers/lowers.
458winmag  [Team Member]
8/18/2011 4:19:16 PM EST
Originally Posted By maleante:
Your definition of "make" is skewed in relation to the AR world.

Let's define "make"...

I can make my own ar15. Make in this sense is me assembling parts together like lego's.

Cerro Forge makes forgings. Make in this sense is Cerro pouring molten aluminum into a mould with a raw chunk of metal as the outcome.

Colt makes all their AR parts in house. Make in this sense is Colt taking raw metal and raw forgings (shaped into semi-definable shapes), and machining every single piece to their specifications to create a product that was entirely designed and machined meets quality control specs by Colt.



Upper and Lower Forgings are nothing more than chunks of aluminum melted together to "make" this form below:

http://www.tacticalinc.com/imagemagic.php?img=zOHCytnckrbc2dPVoZSQqZmTj9bZ1Q%3D%3D&w=500&h=400&page=


This is a Colt lower which was "made" from the forging above.

http://i150.photobucket.com/albums/s95/MMcfpd/AR-15A3_lower.jpg



Now, ask yourself this question: During which process of the two above is something usable actually made? That should answer your question on whether or not Colt makes their own uppers/lowers.


When did Colt or Cerro start using cast uppers?
maleante  [Team Member]
8/18/2011 4:30:55 PM EST
Originally Posted By 458winmag:

When did Colt or Cerro start using cast uppers?


Please, you know what I mean. If you're trolling, keep on it's entertaining... If you aren't then, disregard my explanation except for the understanding that Cerro FORGE sells upper and lower forgings to Colt.

Never once did I say that they are cast, always that they are FORGED, I'm no engineer or metalurgist so if you got the impression from my explanation of "making things" that they are "cast uppers", you sir are searching for something to troll with.






Cerro Forge makes forgings. Make in this sense is Cerro shaping metal by plastic
deformation under great pressure into high strength parts that are a raw chunk of metal as the outcome.

Happy now?
458winmag  [Team Member]
8/18/2011 5:02:47 PM EST
Yup.
Back to my original statement to the OP, "Who knows?".

The only thing we can make a best guess by, is the vendor.
Do you think GA, Spikes, RRA or Colt cast their own FCG (yes cast) and make the associated parts in house? [ it would not surprise me if GA did]
Unlikely

They turn out the final product

codzilla  [Member]
8/19/2011 11:30:58 AM EST
In the last couple months I've used DPMS, Bushmaster, Stag, CMMG and RRA. DPMS and BM seem to have changed. They both now have F#s on some of the parts, i.e. F1 on trigger, F4 on hammer F8 on bolt catch. Both brands look very similar just minor machining differences. They are also much darker in finish than they used to be.
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