AR15.Com Archives
 Pistol lower markings necessary?
Beltfedleadhead  [Team Member]
11/14/2006 6:29:21 AM EST
Ok, I read the FAQs and letters from the ATF, but I'm still a little foggy on this:

If I use a virgin lower, does it HAVE to be marked "pistol", or does it just have to be transferred on the 4473 as a pistol?

Also, am I required by law to get a certificate of virginity (heh) from the manufacturer, or is it just a good idea to cover my ass? The lower is stripped and being sold to me from a dealer who bought it straight from the manufacturer, so it's never been built on as a pistol OR rifle.


Does anyone know, or should I put a call in to the alphabet squad?
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HardShell  [Team Member]
11/14/2006 6:45:08 AM EST
Required? No.

A good idea? Maybe...

(I had mine so marked FWIW, just in case.)
BigGeorgeC  [Member]
11/14/2006 7:15:37 AM EST
I did a lot of research on this and this is what I believe:

1. If you don't have a marked lower, it will just be a hassle if a LEO has to pull you in and half to do a backwards search to ensure that the lower in question was indeed sold as a pistol. (Who wants to carry the bill of sale around with them all the time?)

2. If the lower is marked "Pistol Only", it just takes all the BS out of the loop should you be questioned on the validity of the lower.

3. If at sometime you want to re-build the lower into a rifle, take a few snapshots of the completed pistol as you don't want any "gray area" as to whether you had intended to build a SBR without a tax stamp.

As a wrap up, you are 100% clean if the lower was transferred as a pistol on the 4473 but it's just less headache to have it marked pistol only. Also, no, you do not need a bonded cerificate up front. Again, it's just to eliminate problems down the road. As always, check your local laws pertaining to AR pistol lowers.
Silence  [Member]
11/14/2006 10:36:26 AM EST
Any lower could be marked 'pistol only', and it would not affect whether it was a legit pistol or not.

I Dont see how this could in any way at all keep you from having headaches later on if you ever have to truly 'prove' that it is a legit pistol. I dont think having a lower marked 'pistol only' would help one way or the other if you ever were really questioned on its legality.

It may help with goofballs at the range, but so would saying 'it is an effin pistol, goofball'.
ORinTX  [Team Member]
11/14/2006 10:40:30 AM EST
This is not legal advice.

You can't do much to prevent a cop from taking you in. But you can easily defend yourself in court later if it's sold as a pistol.

Now, go register it as an SBR and avoid all that hassle. You know you want to.
Beltfedleadhead  [Team Member]
11/14/2006 6:44:01 PM EST

Originally Posted By ORinTX:
This is not legal advice.

You can't do much to prevent a cop from taking you in. But you can easily defend yourself in court later if it's sold as a pistol.

Now, go register it as an SBR and avoid all that hassle. You know you want to.



Oh, it WILL be an SBR at some point, but not right away, as my funds do not allow that currently. As you can tell by my avatar, I do already have one SBR, and it's very, very lonely.
another48hrs  [Team Member]
11/17/2006 8:29:21 AM EST

it WILL be an SBR at some point


I think you will get more of a hassle with a sbr that said "Pistol Only" than the other way around.
Beltfedleadhead  [Team Member]
11/17/2006 9:11:37 PM EST

Originally Posted By another48hrs:

it WILL be an SBR at some point


I think you will get more of a hassle with a sbr that said "Pistol Only" than the other way around.


Eh. I've decided to get a DPMS stripped virgin lower transferred to me as a pistol. I pick it up tomorrow, and my M&A 7.5" kit gets here tuesday!! Pics inbound.
Stumps  [Member]
11/20/2006 12:04:09 AM EST
Cops won't try to confiscate. As soon as they run the numbers it will come back as a pistol.
Repete  [Member]
11/24/2006 9:08:07 AM EST

Originally Posted By Stumps:
Cops won't try to confiscate. As soon as they run the numbers it will come back as a pistol.


If the only record of it being a pistol is the fact that it was verified virgin from the mfg, and the 4473 noted pistol upon purchase, how would it come back as a pistol?
BigGeorgeC  [Member]
11/24/2006 8:26:58 PM EST

Originally Posted By Repete:

Originally Posted By Stumps:
Cops won't try to confiscate. As soon as they run the numbers it will come back as a pistol.


If the only record of it being a pistol is the fact that it was verified virgin from the mfg, and the 4473 noted pistol upon purchase, how would it come back as a pistol?


I think Stumps is making the assumption that the 4473 has the receiver written both as virgin and a pistol IMO.
sidroski  [Member]
11/24/2006 9:12:27 PM EST
I want to build one also and think pistol marking will make a short leo stop shorter if I ever run into one.
Who makes them pre-marked?
Good post. Had the same question myself.
YoungGun  [Member]
11/25/2006 8:05:13 AM EST
In Clark County Nevada we are required to register our pistols (hand guns) and must always carry the "blue" card along with the pistols (hand guns) for identification of registration. I just picked up a few stripped lower receivers and registered them as pistols (stripped lower receiver). The "blue" card should be able to verify my pistols appropriately when necessary.

YG
stlshot  [Member]
11/27/2006 5:47:05 PM EST
In MO we need a permit to acquire a concealable firearm.I simply made a bunch of photocopies of the permit,and throw one copy in my gun bag.--see it's a pistol......moot point for me now as my tax stamp just came
azwipe  [Member]
11/27/2006 8:57:27 PM EST
Ive got a Ramline pistol grip with the compartment.I put the orignal bill of sale in it sealed in a little ziploc baggie.It might save me a little time at the police station.I would like to get it marked Pistol just in case I have to sell it some day.CYA!
Hey if you look theres no plate on the end of the lower.I put a tiny allen screw in the take down spring hole.Its a sticky on the site somewhere A+ for that one.I recommend that one its great. JB
HardShell  [Team Member]
11/28/2006 5:14:43 AM EST

Originally Posted By Stumps:
Cops won't try to confiscate. As soon as they run the numbers it will come back as a pistol.


Do you realize what's involved and the time it takes to "run a firearm?"

I personally wouldn't count on that to keep you from an immediate detention/arrest/confiscation if the LEO in question is so inclined (IMHO few would be, barring other circumstances, but still... ).
HardShell  [Team Member]
11/28/2006 5:17:30 AM EST

Originally Posted By azwipe:
Ive got a Ramline pistol grip...


That's what I have on my AR pistol as well, even though I don't use them on any of my other ARs. The shape of that grip, placement of the finger-notch, and the way it fits my hands allows me to control the front-heavy AR pistol better than any other grip I've tried on it...

MuRDoC  [Member]
11/28/2006 5:27:03 AM EST
This is going to be offensive to some law enforcement people here, sorry.
Working at the gun shows, I've seen more than one person picked up from the crowd for having an AR pistol or AK pistol. The ATF, who watch us like hawks do not know the law. I watched as a gentleman was picked up and taken to the front of the George R Brown convention center and he was being hassled about an AK pistol, the guy had to take the cops to the dealers table who was selling them. The dealer showed the ATF agent paper work stating the legality of such a firearm. I watched this happen, and I talked to the owner of the pistol and the dealer after I ease dropped on the ATF agents conversation
Instead of having any of my lowers say pistol, I'm going to carry around a laminated sheet with the law on it in my MIAD.
Stumps  [Member]
12/8/2006 3:16:32 AM EST
The NCIC computer has my serial # recorded as a handgun. That is good enough for me.
Belial  [Team Member]
12/8/2006 7:07:34 PM EST

Originally Posted By Stumps:
The NCIC computer has my serial # recorded as a handgun. That is good enough for me.


That is because the great state of Washington has pistol registration. Alot of states treat handguns and rifles the same and in those cases things could be a little more gret as to the configuration of the weapon.
Beltfedleadhead  [Team Member]
12/10/2006 4:52:31 PM EST
squekie, you aren't accepting IMs. Change this in your profile options, and I will reply to you.
Mousehouse  [Team Member]
1/12/2007 4:13:24 AM EST
Let me see if I get this right.

If I purchased a stripped lower from a dealer and it was registered on the form 4473 as a rifle can I ask the manufacturer for a letter stating it was never a rifle and turn it into a pistol?

Does the manufacturer or FFL register a lower as a pistol? Register isn't a good word to use but I hope you get the idea.

Sorry for the beginner questions.
2111onetwo  [Member]
1/12/2007 11:27:38 AM EST
it is what it is on the 4473, unless it was originally built as a rifle.

you need it described as a pistol on 4473 and virgin.

read the atf letter that is tacked.
Mousehouse  [Team Member]
1/12/2007 3:11:41 PM EST
I did. Just wanting to make sure a letter from the manufacturer stating it has never been built and the form 4473 saying it is a pistol is enough.

Thanks.
Gibbles  [Member]
1/14/2007 9:49:32 PM EST
I think its a good idea, I got mine done as a pistol from the maker, even has a Pistol rollmark under the serial, there is No question that it left the factory with that roll mark.
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