AR15.Com Archives
 broken op rod - UPDATE
ron556  [Team Member]
5/9/2009 2:53:57 PM EST
i have a gen 3 upper that i bought used; it's run pretty well since i've had it [about 1.5–2 years, about 2500+ rounds]. the person i bought it from said he ran it about 500 rounds through it [mostly suppressed].

ran drills today and went through maybe 70-80 rounds. when i proceeded to clean the weapon tonight, i broke it all down and found that i had broken the op rod [where the rod joins the piston "head"]. anyone else ever had this happen?

i ordered the spare parts kit [$150!!!] to replace the op rod. since it's offered as a spare parts kit, i assume these things tend to wear out. just curious, though. any thoughts and/or observations would be helpful.

if anyone else has ever had this issue, i'd like to hear about it.

UPDATE - 05.11.09
chris @ POF called me today and we spoke about the broken op rod. although my upper is most likely out of warranty, i am shipping the upper back to them and they will replace the broken op rod [no charge] as well as go over the whole thing to make sure there is no damage to the carrier. he also requested that i get him the info on my recent spare parts order so he can take care of it on his end.

this may answer some questions re: their customer service; frankly, i think that's pretty damn good. i will continue to update this thread when it all gets sorted out.
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okent  [Member]
5/9/2009 7:26:25 PM EST
I have not had anything break but I ordered a replacement parts kit myself a few weeks ago.
Hate to have the rifle go down and not be able to fix it right then.

So it ran fine with the head broken off?
Manny2_0  [Member]
5/9/2009 9:06:31 PM EST
Originally Posted By ron556:
though. any thoughts and/or observations would be helpful.

if anyone else has ever had this issue, i'd like to hear about it.



Everything wears out, but it seems that this is not acceptable!!!!!!!!

I specifically steared away from LWRC because they have something in their piston syst. that needs replacement after 5k......
There is an article in swat mag. about this


My intent is not to make you feel bad......
However thus begs the question, are piston worth they issues they address...... while bringing on a whole new onset of problems instead of just issues......

I am not very well versed in the whole di vs pistons debate but here is a clear vote for don't get a piston unless you need one for your speciflic applications.... IE SBR or suppressed

Now for the sad part about my post......
I got rid of my di because I drink cool aid and want a piston
ron556  [Team Member]
5/10/2009 3:08:00 AM EST
i'm not sure at what time during the session it failed, but it ran fine until literally the last few rounds… and my buddy and i thought it was bad ammo [he'd been having serious issues with his gun: a sabre defence DI gun]. so i decided to trade up ammo w/ him b/c his stuff ran fine in my gun.

so i was just emptying the last few [10 or so] random rounds down range and i had a few failures to fire [3 out of 10, maybe]. i think that's when the op rod finally went tits-up. i didn't realize it until i broke the gun down for cleaning, proceeded to remove the gas plug/piston assembly and got out more parts than i was expecting.

i actually found another spare parts kit from another arfcom member [of course, after i ordered one from POF]. that doesn't bother me, though… i'd rather have the extra parts.
ron556  [Team Member]
5/10/2009 3:37:09 AM EST
Originally Posted By Manny2_0:
Originally Posted By ron556:
though. any thoughts and/or observations would be helpful.

if anyone else has ever had this issue, i'd like to hear about it.



Everything wears out, but it seems that this is not acceptable!!!!!!!!

I specifically steared away from LWRC because they have something in their piston syst. that needs replacement after 5k......
There is an article in swat mag. about this


My intend is not to make you feel bad......
However thus begs the question, are piston worth they issues they address...... while bringing on a whole new onset of problems instead of just issues......

I am not very well versed in the whole di vs pistons debate but here is a clear vote for don't get a piston unless you need one for your speciflic applications.... IE SBR or suppressed

Now for the sad part about my post......
I got rid of my di because I drink cool aid and want a piston


i can understand that. i'm running an 11.5" upper [suppressed and unsuppressed]. suppressed, the POF is pretty sweet. but every time i shoot a nice DI gun, i am reminded of why folks like them so much… very smooth.

to a certain degree, i can agree with you: the more complex a weapon system, the more parts there are to fail. in my experience, i have not had that many issues with my piston gun. i owned a DI gun [though it was a RRA… not a higher-end gun like a sabre, noveske, etc.] that being said, my buddy has been having pretty serious extraction issues with his sabre defence gun. and that's a gun w/ less than 500 rds through it. still trying to figure it out for him.

of course, i'm actually lazy, which is why i drank the piston kool-aid in the first place. i dislike cleaning weapons, though i am anal about keeping my weapons clean [i still break down and clean my piston gun after every shooting session]. so maybe another DI gun is in my future, just to keep alongside my piston gun.

but that isn't to say that DI guns are not without their own issues [particularly sustained full auto fire]. small arms review did an interesting torture test w/ a POF gun vs. a DI gun a few years back [both on registered receivers]. the POF gun ran thousands of rounds [of wolf!] with no failures. the DI gun failed much sooner [failed gas tube within the first few hundred rounds]. of course, most of us will never run a gun like that… but it is a compelling argument for longevity.

FWIW, i have personally witnessed a friend's 10.5" noveske N4 that runs absolutely everything he feeds it [mostly wolf] with absolutely no problems after 5k rounds or so in the last 12-18 months. not sure if that is that much of an endorsement for noveske [or DI guns in general], but it runs like hell and is very accurate. OTOH, another one of my buddies has a 10" LWRC that had a bolt carrier failure at [i think] 1800 [ETA] 6000 rounds [one of the bolts that secured the "key" to the carrier broke, but the gun still ran fine]; they overnighted him a new bolt carrier and he has run it with no issues since then [currently 5k+ rounds]. he did have some problems with broken rims on wolf ammo at his last training class, so i don't think he'll be running much wolf in the future…

food for thought, i guess. no weapon system is immune to failure.i still really like running my POF, but i am seriously considering getting good DI gun to have as a backup. maybe i'm just singing the blues b/c i've broken two [expensive] carbines in a week…
ILove2Shoot  [Industry Partner]
5/11/2009 12:55:36 PM EST
in a way, I look forward to this arriving in the shop. I want to get a closer look at the failure.......I have not seen a head come off the opp rod yet......
SeanK1ng  [Member]
5/11/2009 3:10:23 PM EST
Originally Posted By ron556:
Originally Posted By Manny2_0:
Originally Posted By ron556:
though. any thoughts and/or observations would be helpful.

if anyone else has ever had this issue, i'd like to hear about it.



Everything wears out, but it seems that this is not acceptable!!!!!!!!

I specifically steared away from LWRC because they have something in their piston syst. that needs replacement after 5k......
There is an article in swat mag. about this


My intend is not to make you feel bad......
However thus begs the question, are piston worth they issues they address...... while bringing on a whole new onset of problems instead of just issues......

I am not very well versed in the whole di vs pistons debate but here is a clear vote for don't get a piston unless you need one for your speciflic applications.... IE SBR or suppressed

Now for the sad part about my post......
I got rid of my di because I drink cool aid and want a piston


i can understand that. i'm running an 11.5" upper [suppressed and unsuppressed]. suppressed, the POF is pretty sweet. but every time i shoot a nice DI gun, i am reminded of why folks like them so much… very smooth.

to a certain degree, i can agree with you: the more complex a weapon system, the more parts there are to fail. in my experience, i have not had that many issues with my piston gun. i owned a DI gun [though it was a RRA… not a higher-end gun like a sabre, noveske, etc.] that being said, my buddy has been having pretty serious extraction issues with his sabre defence gun. and that's a gun w/ less than 500 rds through it. still trying to figure it out for him.

of course, i'm actually lazy, which is why i drank the piston kool-aid in the first place. i dislike cleaning weapons, though i am anal about keeping my weapons clean [i still break down and clean my piston gun after every shooting session]. so maybe another DI gun is in my future, just to keep alongside my piston gun.

but that isn't to say that DI guns are not without their own issues [particularly sustained full auto fire]. small arms review did an interesting torture test w/ a POF gun vs. a DI gun a few years back [both on registered receivers]. the POF gun ran thousands of rounds [of wolf!] with no failures. the DI gun failed much sooner [failed gas tube within the first few hundred rounds]. of course, most of us will never run a gun like that… but it is a compelling argument for longevity.

FWIW, i have personally witnessed a friend's 10.5" noveske N4 that runs absolutely everything he feeds it [mostly wolf] with absolutely no problems after 5k rounds or so in the last 12-18 months. not sure if that is that much of an endorsement for noveske [or DI guns in general], but it runs like hell and is very accurate. OTOH, another one of my buddies has a 10" LWRC that had a bolt carrier failure at [i think] 1800 [ETA] 6000 rounds [one of the bolts that secured the "key" to the carrier broke, but the gun still ran fine]; they overnighted him a new bolt carrier and he has run it with no issues since then [currently 5k+ rounds]. he did have some problems with broken rims on wolf ammo at his last training class, so i don't think he'll be running much wolf in the future…

food for thought, i guess. no weapon system is immune to failure.i still really like running my POF, but i am seriously considering getting good DI gun to have as a backup. maybe i'm just singing the blues b/c i've broken two [expensive] carbines in a week…



Rather than a DI AR.....take a look at Robinson Armament's XCR. I have a POF.....love it. I also have an XCR.....great piston gun for the money.

HTH,
Sean
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